8 week old bunny lethargic!!!!

[Happy Camper]

This morning when I went to feed my bunnies I found this 8 week old bunny in a lethargic state. His tummy feels full, was breathing and with eyes opened, but would not move. He's sharing a cage with the rest of that litter and was weaned at 7 weeks.

I removed him to an empty cage that has a nice nest. I offered water and food and he did not care. I think he's dying...
Is there anything I can do at this point?

 

[MamaSheepdog]

It sounds like he may have bloat. Give him some simethicone for gas. I have heard Gas-X drops or strips recommended. Also, get him moving! Let him romp around the house or yard. Massaging his belly will probably help as well.

I would also offer some type of electrolyte solution- Gatorade is often used, or you can use Pedialyte or mix your own solution.

http://www.ehow.com/how_5875270_make-el ... ution.html

Good luck! :clover:

 

[Miss M]

I'm with MSD... and don't just offer these things. Your bun is in bad enough shape now that you've got to force the issue in order to have a chance to save him.

Squirt the simethicone and the Gatorade (or Pedialyte or whatever) slowly into the back of the mouth. Force fluids frequently.

:clover:

I hope you can save him!

 

[Happy Camper]

He does not seem bloated... I felt his tummy to see if he was like this because he hadn't eaten, but tummy felt fine...

I have found dead bunnies at this age before, for no apparent reason. Let's say an average of one every other litter... this is the first time though, I find one let's say in the process of dying... why is this???

I will bring him inside the house, but besides your good tips I don't find anything else i can do... mainly because I have no idea what is causing this...

Thanks anyways...

I'm with MSD... and don't just offer these things. Your bun is in bad enough shape now that you've got to force the issue in order to have a chance to save him.

Squirt the simethicone and the Gatorade (or Pedialyte or whatever) slowly into the back of the mouth. Force fluids frequently.

:clover:

I hope you can save him!

 

[Secuono]

If he does pass, remember to check his organs.
Hopefully it's nothing serious.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Weaning is stressful for a litter, and sometimes they develop "weaning enteritis", but from what I have heard they usually have diarrhea with that. I have no personal experience with it, but I'm sure someone that has will chime in.

I do know that feed and warmth seem to be factors. If they are on straight pellets that can be a contributing factor. Feeding hay and old fashioned oatmeal seems to help them as they are transitioning to pellets. It is also a good practice to give them a bedded area off of the wire so their bellies do not become chilled. You can use a cardboard box with some shavings or hay in it, or even just pile a goodly amount somewhere on the wire.

I personally use cat litter jugs which contain the body heat of the kits and it also gives them a sense of security because they can hide if they feel the need to do so.

 

[MaggieJ]

Treating him for bloat won't make matters worse. It may be a relatively mild case if he doesn't seem bloated. I hope you can save him, but I really have no other ideas to offer. If he dies, it would be a very good idea to open him up (the sooner the better after death) and check the organs, especially lungs, liver and intestines, for some indication of what the problem might be. It is your best bet to head off similar problems in the future.

 

[Happy Camper]

Well when I went down to check he had already died. He did seem bloated then though. He was still warm so maybe I noticed him being bloated better cause he was lying on his side.

I did not want to handle him much when I found him this way and I just did a quick check, offered food and water and put him in a quiet spot. But after he died I did notice he had an rectal obstruction. Meaning a hardened lump of feces. It was not easily noticeable, but it was there. When I forcced it out, he drained feces and liquid.

I did not open him up cause my kids were around the house and I did not want them to be saddened by this. Besides I had never checked a bunny insides for illnesses, so I know it would take me some time.

I will research how to do it in case it happens again (hope not). I will add the transition diet, because I was not doing that. They were going from milk to pellets.

Thanks for the great advice

Treating him for bloat won't make matters worse. It may be a relatively mild case if he doesn't seem bloated. I hope you can save him, but I really have no other ideas to offer. If he dies, it would be a very good idea to open him up (the sooner the better after death) and check the organs, especially lungs, liver and intestines, for some indication of what the problem might be. It is your best bet to head off similar problems in the future.

 

[Secuono]

If you dont open him, you won't know if this is a hidden illness that is spreading. It takes about 2min to open him up and look at the liver, lungs, which will be very obvious if something is wrong with them.

Hopefully it's nothing but a weaning issue. Good luck!<br /><br />__________ Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:44 pm __________<br /><br />

Weaning is stressful for a litter, and sometimes they develop "weaning enteritis", but from what I have heard they usually have diarrhea with that. I have no personal experience with it, but I'm sure someone that has will chime in.

I do know that feed and warmth seem to be factors. If they are on straight pellets that can be a contributing factor. Feeding hay and old fashioned oatmeal seems to help them as they are transitioning to pellets. It is also a good practice to give them a bedded area off of the wire so their bellies do not become chilled. You can use a cardboard box with some shavings or hay in it, or even just pile a goodly amount somewhere on the wire.

I personally use cat litter jugs which contain the body heat of the kits and it also gives them a sense of security because they can hide if they feel the need to do so.

I wouldn't use those in VA or warmer states, the temp will rise very quickly in them! During winter or late fall, it should be safe, though.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I wouldn't use those in VA or warmer states, the temp will rise very quickly in them! During winter or late fall, it should be safe, though.

I haven't had any issues with them, and it gets to 110F here at times. However, with high humidity it might be an issue. Perhaps cutting the bottom out for more ventilation would be a good idea in the hot months when chilling of the gut is less likely, while still giving them the security of a hiding place.

 

[AnnClaire]

So sorry to hear this CT ... FYI, with young kits (up to 16 weeks), you need to check them daily, even multiple times per day to be sure they are not getting blocked at the back end. Some with just a bit longer fur can get matted with poop and cause a stoppage if not found and removed in time. You might want to develop a habit of picking a kit up and turning it over to visually check it's privates ... the more handling the babies get, the calmer they are when sold as pets, on the show table, or at butchering time, whichever purpose you raise rabbits for.

 

[Miss M]

I'm so sorry you lost the bun! It did sound like it would be difficult to save him.

 

[Happy Camper]

Oh nooooo! I am freaking out! I lost another one TODAY! I AM OPENING HIM UP ... what am I looking for when I do this? This one seemed skinnier than yesterdays. Yesterday I checked and handled them all and they seemed allright!
This one belongs to a different litter and never shared the cage with the deceased one from yesterday. Please your pointers are needed and welcomed.

If you dont open him, you won't know if this is a hidden illness that is spreading. It takes about 2min to open him up and look at the liver, lungs, which will be very obvious if something is wrong with them.

Hopefully it's nothing but a weaning issue. Good luck!

__________ Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:44 pm __________

Weaning is stressful for a litter, and sometimes they develop "weaning enteritis", but from what I have heard they usually have diarrhea with that. I have no personal experience with it, but I'm sure someone that has will chime in.

I do know that feed and warmth seem to be factors. If they are on straight pellets that can be a contributing factor. Feeding hay and old fashioned oatmeal seems to help them as they are transitioning to pellets. It is also a good practice to give them a bedded area off of the wire so their bellies do not become chilled. You can use a cardboard box with some shavings or hay in it, or even just pile a goodly amount somewhere on the wire.

I personally use cat litter jugs which contain the body heat of the kits and it also gives them a sense of security because they can hide if they feel the need to do so.

I wouldn't use those in VA or warmer states, the temp will rise very quickly in them! During winter or late fall, it should be safe, though.

 

[Secuono]

Google " rabbit necropsy" in the Image search with the safe setting off and you'll find a ton of pictures of healthy and then gross, diseased organs.
Lungs pink, liver velvet red, intestines even shape with no off colors or bulges, etc.
As soon as you cut the belly flaps open, the guts will spill out if you hold the rabbit up. Then you'll see the liver, will need to cut the membrane separating lungs and heart from the rest of the body cavity. I don't have pics, gutting is not my fav part and I try to get that done as soon as possible. ick.

 

[Happy Camper]

I will do it now (he was still breathing a little qhen I checked but is definetely dying... So as soon as I confirm death I will open... T will check the site , thanks... hopefully is just a very bad coincidence...!!!!!!!

Google " rabbit necropsy" in the Image search with the safe setting off and you'll find a ton of pictures of healthy and then gross, diseased organs.
Lungs pink, liver velvet red, intestines even shape with no off colors or bulges, etc.
As soon as you cut the belly flaps open, the guts will spill out if you hold the rabbit up. Then you'll see the liver, will need to cut the membrane separating lungs and heart from the rest of the body cavity. I don't have pics, gutting is not my fav part and I try to get that done as soon as possible. ick.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Oh no! I am so sorry you are having these losses.

Take pictures of the organs and we will help you evaluate them.

 

[Secuono]

Oh no! I am so sorry you are having these losses.

Take pictures of the organs and we will help you evaluate them.

Yes, if you can hold the camera and not go *gag*. I can't, lol.

 

[Happy Camper]

Hey Chickies and Bunnies... I opened him up and really did not see any "bad" signs. To me (very unexpert)things looked fine. I took pics and will upload in my almbum.

If you could take a look (at your best time) and give me your impressions I'd really appreciate it!!! :help:

Needless to say that I removed all the bunnies to different setrilized cages/containers for observation... Thanks for your coaching!!!

Google " rabbit necropsy" in the Image search with the safe setting off and you'll find a ton of pictures of healthy and then gross, diseased organs.
Lungs pink, liver velvet red, intestines even shape with no off colors or bulges, etc.
As soon as you cut the belly flaps open, the guts will spill out if you hold the rabbit up. Then you'll see the liver, will need to cut the membrane separating lungs and heart from the rest of the body cavity. I don't have pics, gutting is not my fav part and I try to get that done as soon as possible. ick.

<br /><br />__________ Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:37 pm __________<br /><br />All, right... I uploaded the images in a subalbum named Bunny Necropsy. The images are in "order" of what I did and found. Pic 1- the bunny, pic2- first sight after incision, pic3, what I saw when I moved intestines, further pics liver, lungs and heart... IMAGES ARE GRAFFIC!!!!! (there's no pretty way of putting those, right?)

 

[MamaSheepdog]

There is an awful lot of gas in the intestines, and the lungs looked dark to me, but it could have been blood on the organs. I couldn't really get a good look at the stomach, but it does not look normal in color. It could be your camera- the liver and kidneys looked pretty dark in the pics, but otherwise smooth and healthy looking.

Have you had a chance to get any hay yet? I would recommend pulling them off of pellets for now and giving hay and oatmeal. I would also give them all the simethicone for gas.

In a couple of days you can slowly reintroduce the pellets, but I would make sure that they always have hay to nibble so they don't gorge on the pellets when fed. It would probably be best to give them small amounts of pellets two or three times daily as opposed to in one big meal.

I am not sure if they will be helpful for this issue, but plants that help with digestive issues such as diarrhea are blackberry and raspberry leaves and canes, strawberry leaves, and the weeds plantain and shepherd's purse.

 

[Happy Camper]

Wow thanks! The colors in the pictures were pretty close to the actual organ colors in some shots and not in others. The intestines were very grayish (just like the picture) and you are right, it does not look ok. So you think this is diet related?

There was blood on the lungs though in the pic... before I touched them with bloody fingers they looked lighter. The liver looks darker because there was no light in the room and that was a bad angle of the camera... the actual color was a pretty red velvet color.

Yes, I have them on hay and will get the anti gas drops tomorrow morning. Here in the Caribbean we don't have any kind of berries, but I am giving them some dayflower whick they love and I have had good experience with before.

How do I feed oatmeal? Just uncooked regular rolled oats?

MamaSheepdog, I really appreciate your time and advice. :yes: It's calming and educational. I feel so bad when anything happens to any of my animals. I don't take this lightly... I thought I was doing everything ok, until this happened

I spend long hours reading about them, but one can't go over everything... until something like this happens. Thanks so much!!!

There is an awful lot of gas in the intestines, and the lungs looked dark to me, but it could have been blood on the organs. I couldn't really get a good look at the stomach, but it does not look normal in color. It could be your camera- the liver and kidneys looked pretty dark in the pics, but otherwise smooth and healthy looking.

Have you had a chance to get any hay yet? I would recommend pulling them off of pellets for now and giving hay and oatmeal. I would also give them all the simethicone for gas.

In a couple of days you can slowly reintroduce the pellets, but I would make sure that they always have hay to nibble so they don't gorge on the pellets when fed. It would probably be best to give them small amounts of pellets two or three times daily as opposed to in one big meal.

I am not sure if they will be helpful for this issue, but plants that help with digestive issues such as diarrhea are blackberry and raspberry leaves and canes, strawberry leaves, and the weeds plantain and shepherd's purse.