Hello! I previously got some harlequins from a black x red cross, and I’m saving one doe to breed. My goal is to get more reds. I just sold my red buck who is the red mothers brother, but I forgot that I planned to breed him to my harlequin doe that I’m saving from my first litter. I didn’t plan to sell him, it just kind of happened in the spur of the moment, and, like I said, I forgot about my harlequin doe.
She’s only three months atm, so I can’t breed her yet. I have her harlequin brother as a last resort, and I can always save a red buck from my red x agouti. Since I also have an agouti buck mainly to breed my red doe (Harlequin’s mom) for more reds, I was wondering if crossing him with the harlequin would give me any reds.
I know it doesn’t work out the way I think it will in my head. I’m thinking that since a red x harlequin will give half and half, and a red x agouti will also give half and half, they should both have half the red recessive genes and when paired together give reds here and there.
Don’t know if this helps, but I also have black and whites
In short, it will all depend on what your rabbits have in their genetic makeup, especially at the A and E loci.
A red is an agouti <
A> with full color <
C> and a pair of recessive non-extension <
e> alleles. It doesn't usually matter whether it is black <
B> or chocolate <
b> based.
So a red looks like this: <
A_?_C_D_ee>
Harlequins can be produced by a number of different genetic combinations. They can be agouti <
A> with full color <C> and a harlequin allele <
e(j)> in the dominant position on the E locus. A regular black-and-orange harlequin will be black-based. That looks like this: <
A_B_C_D_e(j)_>.
Harlequin can also be self <
aa>, with full color and
two copies of the harlequin allele (that's called being homozygous for harlequin). That looks like this: <
aaB_C_D_e(j)e(j)>.
So, you usually don't get a harlequin hiding in an agouti, since the agouti allele helps the harlequin be expressed. (If the harlequin is in the dominant position, it makes a harlequin, while if it is in the recessive position <
_e(j)> it makes a "harlequinized agouti.") However,
self rabbits
can hide a harlequin allele as long as it is heterozygous, so a self rabbit with only one copy of harlequin <
e(j)> will look like a normal self.
All of this suggests that in your original black x red cross, the harlequin came from the self black (since red is an agouti and is <
ee>, so there's no place for the harlequin to reside in that rabbit).
To get a red out of a harlequin (or any colors, really), you need to get an agouti <
A> paired up with two non-extension alleles <
ee>. If your harlequin doe (or buck) was out of a red parent, you know for sure it will have at least one copy of <
e>; i.e. your harlequin-out-of-a-red would be <
e(j)e>, which tells you it also is agouti-based <
Aa>. (You know this because its single harlequin <
e(j)> was expressed when the rabbit got an agouti allele from the red parent, and you know it also got a self allele <
a> from the black parent.)
To get a red from an agouti-based harlequin that is heterozygous for harlequin and non-extension <
e(j)e>, you need the
other parent to have at least one copy of the non-extension allele, so it can pair up with the one from the heterozygous parent. You can't tell if a rabbit carries a non-extension <
e> by looking; the only ways you can know for sure are
a) if the rabbit had one or both non-extension parents (like red), or
b) you test breed it with a non-extension mate and get non-extension colors.
Your agouti buck
may or
may not give you reds with your red (or your harlequin) doe; it will depend on whether he carries a non-extension <
e>. Agouti (I'm assuming you're talking about chestnut agouti) is <
A_B_C_D_E_>. If he came from a red parent, you'll know he carries a single copy of <e>, but otherwise you probably won't be able to tell until you breed him. If he does
not carry the non-extension <e>, the whole litter with the red doe will most likely be chestnut agoutis (or selfs if the buck also carries a self <
a>). However, all of
those bunnies will at least carry a non-extension from the red dam, so
they will be able to give you reds.
In summary: any bunnies with a red parent will carry a copy of the non-extension allele <
e>. To get reds, you need a copy of the agouti allele <
A> (which can't hide, except in a harlequin), and
two copies of the non-extension <
e>.
- If you breed your two harlequin siblings from the red doe, for instance, you will probably get some reds.
- If you breed your heterozygous harlequin <
e(j)e> buck with a red doe, you should get some reds.
- If you breed your chestnut agouti buck with either the red doe or the heterozygous harlequin <
e(j)e> doe, you will
only get reds if the agouti buck carries a non-extension <
e> (to pair with one from the doe).
- Red x red will always give you reds (unless you have some other alleles hiding at the A, C or D loci, which can result in, for example, selfs, REWs or fawns). Red x red is usually the ideal since there is the other issue of "rufus modifiers" which add up over the generations in reds. If you cross your reds with other varieties, you can end up with orange instead of red (other varieties don't necessarily have the rufus modifiers that turn a paler orange into a deeper red color; red and orange are usually the same genetically, other than the modifiers).
