So, about these Champagne d'Argents...

[PSFAngoras]

It you haven't picked it up yet, I have a hard time making decisions.

I thought I would keep my rex, but I am really unhappy with them. I just can't suck it up. My best show typey doe is going in the freezer tomorrow for what appears to be vent disease (started a post in rabbit care when it just looked like a mild ******l infection, quickly went downhill from there and I'm not willing to risk the health of my other two). The pair I'm left with are non showable colors, and also came with hock sores, are easy stressed by the heat, and their coats are better than any in the surrounding area, but still shabby compared to the doe I have to put in the freezer. Sure, they sell in a pet market, but I originally wanted a hardy meat breed. They certain aren't standing up to my expectations and requirements. (I have a small space, so I need rabbits that are willing to do their job and do it well all year round. End of story)

To my amazement, there were actually an influx of heritage meat breeds at our state fair this year!!! Among those were Champagnes. I honestly nearly did have a heart attack when I saw them. Two different breeders for a total of about 5 senior rabbits were there, and six juniors in the meat pen completion. I made my first round around the barn and then made a bee line for the registration table to ask if it would be possible to get one of the breeders contact info so I could talk to them about getting a more hands on session with one of the rabbits and ask about breeding stock after fair time was over. The lady standing behind the receptionist at the desk was actually on of the breeders! She was more than pleased to take me over to them and let me be more hands on there at the fair. Her pair won't be breeding until this fall, but she gave me the number of her breeder so I could get in touch with her. The crazy part is the breeder only charges $25 a head for pedigreed stock!

I want to get a hold of her before I make a final decision, (and I still have rex in the nest right now) but I really want to hear your opinions on the breed. The hardest part of it for me would be the lack of pelt color, but they seem like really sociable rabbits with docile temperaments, a decent grow out time for a heritage breed, and a good build. I would be willing to give up pelt color for a good meat pair. (Already have a mutt meat doe, but the cage space might go to a second purebred doe if she has two more botched litters...). I also have friends who have very multi colored litters, so I can always buy/barter with them for other colored pelts. So, what do you guys think about your champagnes? What are the ups and downs, goods and bads? Do you really notice them being to lazy to breed?

I'd like to hear it all! Thanks in advance!

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Short reply for now since I need sleep ASAP, but...I have a love-hate relationship with my Champagnes, LOL. I'll detail more tomorrow.

 

[Frosted Rabbits]

I had bought some Champagnes from a kid a few years ago-- they were not what I expected-- turns out, he bought them, and they did not produce-- and I bought them, - found out, they were a LOT older than the pedigrees suggested-- so, the original seller took advantage of the kid, who took advantage of me.... I did like the temperament , and they fit the cages I had for my AmChins-- It was also hard for some nosey people to tell the difference between the AmChins and the Champagnes... ..

 

[azbowhunter]

I'm just getting started with champagne d'argents, but I've researched the breed extensively, and, for our desired goals, they meet our needs ideally.
Great meat to bone ratio, mild temperament, solid producers, good mothers, and good birth rates.
Meat is supposed to be about as good as it gets.
Obviously, with my [enormous] knowledge and wisdom =-O , of 2 days, the truth is time will tell.
I'm liking what I see so far, and everything I've read seems accurate.

 

[akane]

I had no trouble getting my 2 bucks to breed despite the laid back attitude of champagnes. Less trouble than I'm having with my main american sable buck and they are more high strung. I also bought a bred doe which he bred in front of me to one of his older bucks and it was just bang bang bang and that buck was done despite a first time doe. Only downside was litters of about 5 kits instead of the 8-12 I got out of my mutt line. However I find I can only butcher about 5 at a time and I got behind a lot with my mutts and now with my american sables. I recently had some bucks fighting in the colony because I didn't get to them soon enough.

 

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

acutally champagnes are the best meat rabbit out there.. and there pelts are to die for.. well mine was any was.. the temperament are awesome.. breed very easy, don't eat allot for the meat that you get.. grow very well. good hocks ect.. I cant say anything bad about this breed..The only thing I can say is watch were you get your stock from.. I have seen lots of them not sliver out as much or they look like they have another breed behind them.Try to get some stock from someone that shows.. Oh ya,, they are great moms.. and they don't have big litters ,, so the babies are all well cared for easier.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Just got back in from dispatching the Rex doe, it was awful. It went very well, but I have an extremely hard time offing my breeders. She was an amazing mother, and a beautiful doe. I actually put her back once thinking that I was not doing the right thing, but then I was able to re-convince myself that I was doing it because she is not healthy, and it was the only option for her.

I was reassured when I opened her up to find that she was extremely overweight even though she never showed any outward signs. I have never seen that much fat on the inside of a rabbit. That would have likely explained why her litter was so small. Also her uterus looked very red and angry. It was good to know I did the right thing, but it was still hard.

Anyway, I think she was the biggest hurdle for me to get over to commit to going ahead and letting go of the Rex. I am not happy with them, but when you are raised in a family where giving up an animal for any reason is a downright crime, it makes it hard to admit things aren't working out for you and thy need to be changed. ( my mom and I have gone round and round about the fact that my rabbits are seen as livestock and are edible. She's more open to it now, but only just so)

Thank you guys for all of the input so far, and please, keep it coming! I'd like to learn as much as I can before I commit to this breed. I failed to do so with the Rex, and its the reason I've gotten myself into my recent position.

Kyle, why is your relationship with the Champagnes a love/ hate thing?

And Mary Ann, if they are they are the best meat breed in your opinion, why do you no longer breed them?

Thank you guys

 

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

I know longer breed them as I had someone that really like them and wanted to continue in that breed.. I had 3 different breeds here .. I want my angora breed more than anything.. So I also had cals and champagne... one of them had to go... I had a buyer knocking at the door and she bought all of them... she paid the price that I wanted so they left.. She drove 5 hours to come to my house.. So I knew she was a serious on continuing on the breed. I do miss them.. But my goal is angora .. I just needed a few for meat... so I kept some of the cals.. and she bought some of those too. ..

Ps.......it is easier for me to dispatch a cal ,, than a champagne. ... as cals are so common here..

 

[akane]

You do actually get interesting colors out of the champagne and you can get interesting pelts depending how fast your line silvers and when you butcher. Offspring start black and each one is unique in how it silvers. Here's a litter at 8weeks then 12weeks on page 1 and then they were butchered http://smg.photobucket.com/user/aqh88/l ... t=3&page=2

 

[PSFAngoras]

Ooh, good point. I didn't even think about that, but I do typically butcher at 8 weeks, so that may produce a VERY fun effect!!

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Ooh, good point. I didn't even think about that, but I do typically butcher at 8 weeks, so that may produce a VERY fun effect!!

I am loving the silvering...it's adorable and fun!!! No two seem to do it the same way...

 

[dayna]

I love my champagnes! They have an awesome temperment and my female gives me large litters. (8, 9, 6 kits the last three litters)

 

[PSFAngoras]

How is the meat to bone ratio? I'm still thinking this one over, just waiting for the Rex to either sell or go in the freezer before I make a decision. I won't rush myself on this one!<br /><br />__________ Wed Aug 28, 2013 10:11 pm __________<br /><br />Oh and Kyle, you never told me about your love hate relationship!

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

LOL!!! And now I realize that right as I have to leave to help my dad with condo rennovations. LOL OOPS. I shall do so tonight!!!!

Meat to bone ratio is EXCELLENT, as good as if not better than the NZ I had. They have deceptively light, delicate bones for such a beefy rabbit!!!

 

[PSFAngoras]

I'll be looking forward to it thank you!

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

I love them because they are super rabbits...gentle, mellow, sweet-natured for the most part...but they're also big, and I'm having issues with how beefy they are, LOL!!! My love-hate relationship with them is because they take up so much more room than my Mini Rex, and right now I don't need a lot of rabbit meat. They're TOO good at being meat rabbits, LOL!!!!!!!!! They're so beefy and chunky and hefty! So I finally get the meat rabbits of my dreams...juuuust when I don't need them. :roll: I keep waffling about selling out of the breed and just taking them back on later when meat rabbits will be a necessity, but...then I go pet my big old buck, Boss, or watching his kits bounce all over like they're made of rubber and crack, and I can't bring myself to not keep at least a pair. :roll:

Only one of my Champagnes (of four original adults) has disappointed me with her personality...and she USED to be just a sweetie until she got fleas; constantly treating her for fleas and the fact that she hates being bred makes her a nuisance. She gets to leave soon...just as soon as this Champagne doe kit grows a little more.

Really, realistically, I should sell out and take them up again later. Really. But I can't bring myself to do so. They are just too wonderful. Even my dad, who isn't all that keen on the rabbits, adores the Champagnes!!!

But yeah, they're sweet, easy keepers, good feed costs to meat ratio as well as good bone to meat ratio, I love them. Get some Champs. Srsly.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Thank you for the reply! I don't have a problem with big rabbits, I have a problem without them! You know, naturally being five three I just had to get into an angora line that consistently runs between 12 and 13 pounds, so I don't see 10 pound champagnes as an issue. I contacted the breeder by email, so I'm basically at this point waiting for a reply, and for my rex to sell. I'll have to see what I can't scrounge up!

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

LOL, my buck, Boss? Is two ounces below the max weight for the breed. On show mornings, he doesn't get breakfast...I feed him AFTER he's been on the table, or he might get a DQ for his size! :lol:

Champs are awesome.

 

[PSFAngoras]

The angora breeder my lines came from shows her rabbits, and almost all of them are at least two pounds over the show limit. She takes home champions all the time. I guess if some other areas are good enough, the judge doesn't knit pick about other areas. I'm too scared to show because of it, but I love her lines anyway. Good, quality lines that produce good wool and good babies with meat type bodies and snugly temperaments. The only reason I want a short hair meat breed is because I like to tan the hides (afraid that the wool will mat on the angoras) and the show quality kits may sell better than the angoras. No one wants to put work into their bunnies in my immediate vicinity.

__________ Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:37 am __________

So I got an email back... At the same time someone on CL posted a out a trio of Am. Chins for $25 bucks.

I emailed them, but their add didn't convince me they were knowledgable, or that their stock was pedigreed. I will give the lady wih the Champagnes a call today since she left her number ( and she IS very knowledgable, sounds like she might even judge shows) and talk to her about the champs and the am. Chins ( she promted me to call about any breed) but I won't make a final decision until I get a pic/ info from the people with the chins.

I'd like to preserve a rare breed, but I refuse to drive 5 hours for questionable stock. The lady with the champs lives 45 minutes away, and I've seen some of her stock, so I know they're quality. (Not to mention felt, and scratched the bunnies, and chatted with the owner) . Really leaning towards the champs if the chin people are less than my expectations, but I've been surprised before. It would still be December before I get the champs, but I'll be happy to wait for quality stock.

*sigh* I hate making decision. Especially when you almost set on something and a wrench gets thrown in the project!<br /><br />__________ Sun Sep 01, 2013 5:00 am __________<br /><br />I talked to lady yesterday with the Champagnes. The chins ended up being a flop as not all of them were pedigreed. Going to get at least a pair of champs in December when her next litter is ready, cat wait .

As far as the Rex, she also shows and said that a lot of Rex lines around here are known for over eating, and slow growth. She also said that typically, after their first really nice prime coat, their coat goes down bill from there. I guess it would explain why my youngest have the best coats, and the older the rabbit is, the less of a coat it has. Makes sense, I suppose.

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

My one MR buck is losing his fantastic coat...he was SO plush and dense when I bought him, now he's...less amazing, LOL. My other buck just gets better and better though, so...it may be a bloodline thing.

Congrats on the future Champagnes!!!!