Question about using 2 bucks on same doe

[ckcs]

Anyone ever let 2 bucks breed with 1 doe on the same day?

I have a REW doe and buck that are mature. I also have a broken tort buck that is 5 months old. The broken has mounted another rabbit before but we are still waiting to see if she took. To keep us in supply of rabbits I need to breed my REW doe. I would just use the REW buck but I'd rather use the Broken. However I really want this doe to get pregnant so though I could use the broken buck and then a few hours later use the REW buck. If both bucks are mature could the resulting litter be a combination of the 2? Is there any problems with doing this?

 

[PSFAngoras]

I've never done it because I'm a stickler of having only one sire to a litter for pedigree purposes, but the result should be a litter with both bucks siring kits.

Since rabbits are induced ovulated, the doe should release eggs with both breedings, provided both breedings result in eggs becoming fertilized, there to be a single litter from both bucks.

Go ahead and give it a shot!

 

[TwoAcreDream]

The 2 current litters I have here, have multiple dads. Doe #2 and #3.
Well it was kind of a experiment. Both the does are mixed breeds.
I think the mini rex fathered the most. The other bucks were young and I
mainly wanted to know how they would react. These 2 does are
fostering 5 pure calis and 1 NZ cross baby in addition to their own.

Yesterday I bred the big NZ white to the young Cali buck. I don't have
a NZ buck. For a young animal, he is quite the pro. He did the deed
3x in a real short amount of time. Then the mixed doe #1 whose
babies are 8 weeks old now, I bred her to the mini rex buck. She
is my back up plan for the NZ. I almost used both bucks on both of them,
but I wanted to be able to tell them apart if I have to foster babies.
The NZ babies will be for meat. The mixed will be for animal food.

I don't see any harm in using more than 1 buck. Especially if you
need to get a doe bred and want to be sure she took. The one mixed
doe I tried with 4 different bucks over a 2 day span. The only one
she finally lifted for, was the broken mini rex. He gets serious quick.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I haven't ever done it because I want to have accurate information on the pedigree, but you could do it if that isn't a factor.

Since rabbits are induced ovulated, the doe should release eggs with both breedings, provided both breedings result in eggs becoming fertilized, there to be a single litter from both bucks.

They release eggs only once, not multiple times. Not all of an animal's (or person's) eggs are "mature" at the same time. Follicles containing eggs form on the surface of the ovaries, and once they attain a certain size, they burst and release the eggs. In induced ovulators like cats and rabbits, the follicles simply regress when they are past their prime, and the eggs are reabsorbed, never to be "used" again.

From http://www.fao.org/docrep/t1690E/t1690e05.htm#TopOfPage :

The sexual behaviour of a female rabbit is thus very special. She has no cycle and can stay in heat for several days running. On the ovary, follicles not having evolved to the ovulation stage through lack of stimulation undergo regression and are replaced by new follicles, which remain for a few days in the pre-ovulating state and may then in turn regress.

Ovulation is normally induced by the stimuli associated with coitus and occurs ten to 12 hours after mating, as outlined in Figure 11.

Fertilization and gestation.

At the moment the ovary follicles are ruptured the oviduct pavilion or infundibulum covers the ovary. When liberated the ovocytes are sucked in by the pavilion. The ovocytes are in fact fertilizable from the moment they are liberated, but they are not actually fertilized until about an hour and a half after release. The sperm is deposited by the male in the upper part of the vagina. The spermatozoa make their way upwards rapidly. They can reach the fertilization area (in the distal ampulla, near the isthmus) 30 minutes after coitus. During their journey the spermatozoa undergo a maturing process which enables them to fertilize the ovocytes. Of the 150 to 200 million spermatozoa ejaculated, only two million (1 percent) will reach the uterus. The rest are defeated by obstacles at the cervix and uterotubal junction.



Since LHs are a smaller breed, I would bet that the broken is sexually mature.

Also from the above referenced document:

Gonad development and puberty.

The gonads begin to differentiate on the 16th day after fertilization. After birth the testes develop less quickly than the rest of the body. From the age of five weeks they begin to grow very rapidly. Accessory glands undergo a similar development, but at a more even rate and are less precocious. Spermatogenesis begins between days 40 and 50. The testicular tubes become active at about 84 days. The first spermatozoa are present in the ejaculate at about 110 days.

Sexual maturity, defined as the moment when daily sperm production ceases to increase, is reached at 32 weeks by New Zealand White rabbits in temperate climates. However, a young buck in these same conditions can be used for reproduction from the age of 20 weeks. Indeed the first manifestations of sexual behaviour appear at days 60 to 70 when the rabbit makes it first attempts at riding. Coitus may occur for the first time at about 100 days, but the viability of the sperm cells is very weak or nil in the first ejaculates. So first mating should be timed for age 135 to 140 days.

I found this to be very interesting in regard to using a buck on multiple does on the same day:

Sperm production.

The volume of semen ejaculated is about 0.3 to 0.6 ml. Concentration is evaluated at 150 to 500 × 106 spermatozoa per ml, but both volume and concentration are liable to vary. False mountings, one or two minutes before copulation, increase the concentration of the ejaculate. In two successive servicings the first acts as a preparation for the second, which is less voluminous but more concentrated. During subsequent matings the volume of the ejaculate decreases, while concentration increases between the first and the second ejaculate and then diminishes. The total number of spermatozoa per ejaculate follows the same trend.

Maximum spermatozoa production is obtained by using the buck regularly once a day. If the buck is used regularly twice a day, each ejaculate has only one half the concentration of spermatozoa. On the other hand, if bucks service several times a day, one day a week, the three or four ejaculates may be concentrated enough to effect fertilization. Further ejaculates contain very few spermatozoa and cannot effect fertilization often enough to be worth while. Daily spermatozoa production is roughly 150 to 300 million, independent of the rate of ejaculation. The maximum epididymis reserve is only one to two billion spermatozoa, only partially mobilizable for repeated ejaculations.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Ah, okay, it was explained to me wrong then, but that doesn't surprise me considering who my rabbit mentor was In the beginning. Thanks for the correction.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Ah, okay, it was explained to me wrong then

A friend of mine was trying to tell me that dogs will have more puppies the more times they are bred, thinking they were induced ovulators too. They insisted that this was why a dog could have pups in the same litter from different sires. :roll:

It is a common misconception, and not only with rabbits.

 

[TwoAcreDream]

Okay, so if the doe was bred within 5 minutes to two different bucks...
then the babies can be either one or both bucks offspring....
yes or no.....

 

[CarsLops]

According to an article I just read, if your rew doe is solid and your rew buck is solid, you will be able to tell which buck is the sire. Since solid to solid will only produce solids, if the entire litter is solid, then the solid buck is the sire. If even one kit is broken, the broken is the sire, as solid to solid can never produce a broken. I've never done this and don't know if it's true, but I can easily follow the logic.

 

[ckcs]

I've never done it because I'm a stickler of having only one sire to a litter for pedigree purposes, but the result should be a litter with both bucks siring kits.

This is why it is a good idea to air my ideas of RT first lol. I totally didn't think about the pedigree. A pedigree isn't a concern for the most part as I don't have enough generations to have a full pedigree on my rabbits. However I occasionally hold back rabbits to further the pedigree and knowing the sire is important for that. It wish I knew if my broken was carrying REW as that would make it easy to tell the parents. Both the brokens parents carry REW. Now that I think of it, I wouldn't be holding a REW kit back anyway so I'd know who the father was on any kit that I kept. I'd also just use the REW buck since I know he is mature but I'm not sure I want a full litter of REW. I get 1-3 a litter with one of my does and they sell ok but colors sell better.

 

[CochinBrahmaLover]

I'm confused, lol. You need more rabbits - which to me, sounds like these will be freezer camp - but you're concerned about the pedigree? :shock: Which then sounds like these might be sold as pets, but you NEED more rabbits to sell as pets? Or is this in for fostering purposes?
I thought you only raised lionhead show & pet rabbits, but I fail to see why you need a supply of rabbits if they're just for pets, and if they're for meat, why would the pedigree matter?

Just curious,it confuses me, lol.

Ill eagerly await the results though, since you always have the cutest fluffy rabbits opcorn:

 

[MamaSheepdog]

A pedigree isn't a concern for the most part as I don't have enough generations to have a full pedigree on my rabbits. However I occasionally hold back rabbits to further the pedigree and knowing the sire is important for that.

If you want to pedigree the offspring, I would breed to only one buck. You only need three generations of purebreds, and with rabbits that doesn't take very long.

I'd also just use the REW buck since I know he is mature but I'm not sure I want a full litter of REW.

REW just covers the true color of a rabbit, like a white sheet thrown over a couch, so you could get a variety of colors. He may also be a "broken", so you have lots of possibilities.

 

[ckcs]

I'm confused, lol. You need more rabbits - which to me, sounds like these will be freezer camp - but you're concerned about the pedigree? :shock: Which then sounds like these might be sold as pets, but you NEED more rabbits to sell as pets? Or is this in for fostering purposes?
I thought you only raised lionhead show & pet rabbits, but I fail to see why you need a supply of rabbits if they're just for pets, and if they're for meat, why would the pedigree matter?

Just curious,it confuses me, lol.

Ill eagerly await the results though, since you always have the cutest fluffy rabbits opcorn:

I breed rabbit strictly for the pet market. At this time I don't eat them or show them. My focus has always been raising rabbits with great temperament that look nice to me and buyers. I try to always have rabbits available for sale which is part of why I want to bred her. My other does are either with a litter or are pregnant. She is also the newest doe that I have and I want to see how she does.

I'm slowly working on my pedigrees. As I don't show it is not a high priority. I do plan to show in the future and hope to have the pedigree established on a few in the next year or so. I sometimes get people that want a pedigree so there may be slight benefit to sales.

 

[OneAcreFarm]

There is a member here, LisaBunnyGal, that regularly uses multiple bucks when mating her does. She gets litters of 13-14 quite regularly....she raises for food for her dogs. I just recently bred a NZW to both a Chocolate Rex and a Broken Black Rex for a person that wants NZW/Rex mixes. It is kind of an experiment to see what happens, so I will keep you posted.

 

[CochinBrahmaLover]

Ah, I see. I thought you showed, my bad.

Best of luck.