New Year New Buns

[ihatedarkroast]

I thought I'd give an update on what I've been up to and my rabbit newb adventures. The two castors/amber are two does I kept from Tizzy's 3rd litter. I named them Serena and Selena. The larger otter is their brother Otto.

I purchased the chocolate with papers to breed with the castors. His name is Yogi Bear. He is a sweetie. Oddly he had a curly wooly coat as a juvenile so I got him at a discount. In the fall his full rex coat grew in.

The otter in the smaller kennel I got from Rural King to breed with Otto. I haven't named her yet.

Tizzy passed away while nursing her 3rd litter. She had some diahrrea but I'm not sure the exact cause. I suspect when I switched feed brands I did it too quickly.

Otto I thought was a female for a long time. He was in with his sisters so I am unsure if he is the father of their litters or if Yogi is. ;_; I did separate them as soon as I realized he was not a girl. Yogi had both parents as otters on his papers. Not sure how he turned out chocolate. His breeder was frustrated about that.

 

[ihatedarkroast]

I thought I'd give an update on what I've been up to and my rabbit newb adventures. The two castors/amber are two does I kept from Tizzy's 3rd litter. I named them Serena and Selena. The larger otter is their brother Otto.

I purchased the chocolate with papers to breed with the castors. His name is Yogi Bear. He is a sweetie. Oddly he had a curly wooly coat as a juvenile so I got him at a discount. In the fall his full rex coat grew in.

The otter in the smaller kennel I got from Rural King to breed with Otto. I haven't named her yet.

Tizzy passed away while nursing her 3rd litter. She had some diahrrea but I'm not sure the exact cause. I suspect when I switched feed brands I did it too quickly.

Otto I thought was a female for a long time. He was in with his sisters so I am unsure if he is the father of their litters or if Yogi is. ;_; I did separate them as soon as I realized he was not a girl. Yogi had both parents as otters on his papers. Not sure how he turned out chocolate. His breeder was frustrated about that.

Here are some more of how the castors grew out and the current litters. One litter is a couple weeks behind the other. Eyes just barely starting to open. I'm loving the new colors! I think I have some more castors, a few otters. They grey ones...maybe likac tortise and 1 lilac otter??? Maybe Yogi bear is really the dad afterall. Haha. Also wabbit fricasee we made with that broken black and a broken tan. Used chef john's recipe off youtube. Came out amazing.

I actually sold a couple buns on clist this time. Hoping I can do it again to help with the feed bill. I am definitely not breaking even despite the meat and pelts. Rural king said they would purchase some as well but they have to be fairly young and I doubt they pay much

 

[Alaska Satin]

Here are some more of how the castors grew out and the current litters. One litter is a couple weeks behind the other. Eyes just barely starting to open. I'm loving the new colors! I think I have some more castors, a few otters. They grey ones...maybe likac tortise and 1 lilac otter??? Maybe Yogi bear is really the dad afterall. Haha. Also wabbit fricasee we made with that broken black and a broken tan. Used chef john's recipe off youtube. Came out amazing.

I actually sold a couple buns on clist this time. Hoping I can do it again to help with the feed bill. I am definitely not breaking even despite the meat and pelts. Rural king said they would purchase some as well but they have to be fairly young and I doubt they pay much

Some of those bunnies are harlequins! They're either blue or lilac, I can't tell on my screen. The little otter kit may or may not be harlequinized, but the other two (or is it the same kit?) are not broken. Broken color means a color broken up by white; rather, when a rabbit has more than one color - it's harlequin! Surprise !

Otto I thought was a female for a long time. He was in with his sisters so I am unsure if he is the father of their litters or if Yogi is. ;_; I did separate them as soon as I realized he was not a girl. Yogi had both parents as otters on his papers. Not sure how he turned out chocolate. His breeder was frustrated about that.

That means that both of his parents were otter carrying self a(t) a and black carrying chocolate B b. Otto you know for sure is aa bb, so they only way he can make more blacks or otters is to breed him with a black otter doe.

 

[ihatedarkroast]

For real? O_O cool!! There are two gray in that litter. One has a definite golden tan outline and the body is solid. Very hard to see on my camera. The other has the tan zig zags scattered across the body. I have 3 otter kits. I can't wait to see them grow! I don't think the otter kit is harlequinized, just had a lot of mom's fur stuck to him from the nest that showed up in the photo. Of the really young litter, I have otter and castor (I think) the gray castor seems to get redder hued/more amber as they age.

Interesting. So if Otto the black otter was the father of the castor mom litters, there would be no baby black otter babies? So he likely not the father? I found Yogi Bear's pedigree. I was wrong about him having two otter parents. But he had 3 otter grandparents. His mother was a blue carrying the otter gene, so I think the gray must come from him! Otto's parents never threw any blues or lilacs or any sort of grays at all.

Well, I'm relieved that these kits are not inbred. I was worried I hadn't separated the siblings fast enough. I also never saw any fall-offs with Yogi so I thought the girls hated him. It's good to know he's a stealth charmer.

Otto will have his otter lady, but she is not full grown yet. He's gonna have to be patient.

 

[Mckatie]

For real? O_O cool!! There are two gray in that litter. One has a definite golden tan outline and the body is solid. Very hard to see on my camera. The other has the tan zig zags scattered across the body. I have 3 otter kits. I can't wait to see them grow! I don't think the otter kit is harlequinized, just had a lot of mom's fur stuck to him from the nest that showed up in the photo. Of the really young litter, I have otter and castor (I think) the gray castor seems to get redder hued/more amber as they age.

Interesting. So if Otto the black otter was the father of the castor mom litters, there would be no baby black otter babies? So he likely not the father? I found Yogi Bear's pedigree. I was wrong about him having two otter parents. But he had 3 otter grandparents. His mother was a blue carrying the otter gene, so I think the gray must come from him! Otto's parents never threw any blues or lilacs or any sort of grays at all.

Well, I'm relieved that these kits are not inbred. I was worried I hadn't separated the siblings fast enough. I also never saw any fall-offs with Yogi so I thought the girls hated him. It's good to know he's a stealth charmer.

Otto will have his otter lady, but she is not full grown yet. He's gonna have to be patient.

Love this! So many beautiful colours! I just bought a pedigreed chocolate rex but he's still with his mum. I have 2 does 1 a broken caster the other a tri. There was a broken blue in that litter as well but it was a male. You have very lovely kits! So exciting! These are my rex.

 

[Mckatie]

For real? O_O cool!! There are two gray in that litter. One has a definite golden tan outline and the body is solid. Very hard to see on my camera. The other has the tan zig zags scattered across the body. I have 3 otter kits. I can't wait to see them grow! I don't think the otter kit is harlequinized, just had a lot of mom's fur stuck to him from the nest that showed up in the photo. Of the really young litter, I have otter and castor (I think) the gray castor seems to get redder hued/more amber as they age.

Interesting. So if Otto the black otter was the father of the castor mom litters, there would be no baby black otter babies? So he likely not the father? I found Yogi Bear's pedigree. I was wrong about him having two otter parents. But he had 3 otter grandparents. His mother was a blue carrying the otter gene, so I think the gray must come from him! Otto's parents never threw any blues or lilacs or any sort of grays at all.

Well, I'm relieved that these kits are not inbred. I was worried I hadn't separated the siblings fast enough. I also never saw any fall-offs with Yogi so I thought the girls hated him. It's good to know he's a stealth charmer.

Otto will have his otter lady, but she is not full grown yet. He's gonna have to be patient.

You have made me so excited seeing all of the possibilities of my rex colours. Thank you for sharing all of your pictures!

 

[ihatedarkroast]

Love this! So many beautiful colours! I just bought a pedigreed chocolate rex but he's still with his mum. I have 2 does 1 a broken caster the other a tri. There was a broken blue in that litter as well but it was a male. You have very lovely kits! So exciting! These are my rex.

OMG I love your tri and broken black in the last pic! I can't wait to see how your choco baby grows up. Mine had a more golden color until he grew his winter coat then it was a rich velvety brown. Also, is that a dog vest on a rabbit or a rabbit vest? Hmmm. Maybe I should train Yogi Bear and Otto to walk on a leash? The girls are probably too skittish but I bet the boys could do it. Yogi might even enjoy it. He's so social.

 

[Mckatie]

OMG I love your tri and broken black in the last pic! I can't wait to see how your choco baby grows up. Mine had a more golden color until he grew his winter coat then it was a rich velvety brown. Also, is that a dog vest on a rabbit or a rabbit vest? Hmmm. Maybe I should train Yogi Bear and Otto to walk on a leash? The girls are probably too skittish but I bet the boys could do it. Yogi might even enjoy it. He's so social.

Thank you. The broken black is actually a broken castor, but the picture isn't great. The harnesses I've used most are dogs; some are figure 8 cats. I liked the pink harness as it appeared more secure as well as comfortable. I bring the kits to assisted living so they wear a harness whenever possible. They do learn to walk on the leash. The harnesses were quickly outgrown. I'm breeding the tri to a castor soon. Last year in Livingston MT at the fair they had rabbit agility.

 

[ihatedarkroast]

I'm going to have to try this! Well, away from my kids. They might jerk them around too much. Rabbit agility? interesting.

 

[Mckatie]

I'm going to have to try this! Well, away from my kids. They might jerk them around too much. Rabbit agility? interesting.

Yes, it's fun!

 

[Alaska Satin]

Interesting. So if Otto the black otter was the father of the castor mom litters, there would be no baby black otter babies? So he likely not the father? I found Yogi Bear's pedigree. I was wrong about him having two otter parents. But he had 3 otter grandparents. His mother was a blue carrying the otter gene, so I think the gray must come from him! Otto's parents never threw any blues or lilacs or any sort of grays at all.

The pattern genes are, in order of descending dominance, are:
A = agouti
a(t) = tan
a = self

So if a rabbit looks like an agouti (or a steel), it has an A in the first place, and can have A, a(t) or a in the second place.
If a rabbit looks like a tan (otter or marten), it has a(t) in the first place, and can have another a(t) or an a in the second place. It cannot carry agouti A.
If it is a self, it must have two self alleles aa at that locus. It cannot carry either agouti A or tan a(t).

So, some conclusions you can draw are that:
Yogi is aa since he is a self. He must be Dd because he had to have gotten a dilute d from his blue dam.
The dam is a self blue aa, so she cannot carry otter, and neither can Yogi.
So, Yogi could produce otters with the castor doe only if the doe carried a(t) behind her agouti A, and he can produce blue (gray) with the doe who also carries dilute d (we know that she does, because she had blue babies).

Otto, on the other hand is an otter a(t)_.
There could have been black otters in a castor x black otter litter, if the castor doe carried a tan a(t) behind her agouti A. That would look this:
Black Otter a(t)_ B_C_D_E_ x Castor Aa(t) B_C_D_E_
You could get A a(t) which is an agouti carrying otter, or a(t)a(t) which is an otter.
If the otter had a self a behind its a(t), you could also get a(t) a which would be an otter carrying self.
He could have made blue kits with the doe if he carries dilute d behind his Dense color D (we already know the doe carries dilute). Even though his parents never produced any blues, that recessive d can hide for many generations; it could have been lurking on either or both sides of his parents.

So unless you know more about Otto's and the castor doe's pedigrees, this litter wouldn't eliminate either Otto or Yogi as the sire.

 

[ihatedarkroast]

The pattern genes are, in order of descending dominance, are:
A = agouti
a(t) = tan
a = self

So if a rabbit looks like an agouti (or a steel), it has an A in the first place, and can have A, a(t) or a in the second place.
If a rabbit looks like a tan (otter or marten), it has a(t) in the first place, and can have another a(t) or an a in the second place. It cannot carry agouti A.
If it is a self, it must have two self alleles aa at that locus. It cannot carry either agouti A or tan a(t).

So, some conclusions you can draw are that:
Yogi is aa since he is a self. He must be Dd because he had to have gotten a dilute d from his blue dam.
The dam is a self blue aa, so she cannot carry otter, and neither can Yogi.
So, Yogi could produce otters with the castor doe only if the doe carried a(t) behind her agouti A, and he can produce blue (gray) with the doe who also carries dilute d (we know that she does, because she had blue babies).

Otto, on the other hand is an otter a(t)_.
There could have been black otters in a castor x black otter litter, if the castor doe carried a tan a(t) behind her agouti A. That would look this:
Black Otter a(t)_ B_C_D_E_ x Castor Aa(t) B_C_D_E_
You could get A a(t) which is an agouti carrying otter, or a(t)a(t) which is an otter.
If the otter had a self a behind its a(t), you could also get a(t) a which would be an otter carrying self.
He could have made blue kits with the doe if he carries dilute d behind his Dense color D (we already know the doe carries dilute).

So unless you know more about Otto's and the castor doe's pedigrees, this litter wouldn't eliminate either Otto or Yogi as the sire.

Hmmmmmm....I will have to think on it more then. I can write down the possibilities. If I cross Otto and the doe on purpose maybe the resulting litter would shed some more light.

On a slightly related note, does Yogi carry a weak version of the Astrex gene? Here is a picture of his coat before it became rex fur like it is now. It was at the time when I got him very kinky and had a cottony feel. Now he has the velvet smooth rex looking and feeling fur.

 

[seashore]

For real? O_O cool!! There are two gray in that litter. One has a definite golden tan outline and the body is solid. Very hard to see on my camera. The other has the tan zig zags scattered across the body. I have 3 otter kits. I can't wait to see them grow! I don't think the otter kit is harlequinized, just had a lot of mom's fur stuck to him from the nest that showed up in the photo. Of the really young litter, I have otter and castor (I think) the gray castor seems to get redder hued/more amber as they age.

Interesting. So if Otto the black otter was the father of the castor mom litters, there would be no baby black otter babies? So he likely not the father? I found Yogi Bear's pedigree. I was wrong about him having two otter parents. But he had 3 otter grandparents. His mother was a blue carrying the otter gene, so I think the gray must come from him! Otto's parents never threw any blues or lilacs or any sort of grays at all.

Well, I'm relieved that these kits are not inbred. I was worried I hadn't separated the siblings fast enough. I also never saw any fall-offs with Yogi so I thought the girls hated him. It's good to know he's a stealth charmer.

Otto will have his otter lady, but she is not full grown yet. He's gonna have to be patient.

Hello @ihatedarkroast what app is that screenshot from? Looks like a better version of an app I tried to build myself and never got round to finishing!! Might save me some work