More Problems! But now I know why!

Shop deals on ebay
shop deals on amazon
Advertise with us
Rabbit Talk Forum

Help Support Rabbit Talk Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
MaggieJ

MaggieJ

Administrator
Staff member
Admin
Moderator
Rabbit Talk Supporter
Joined
Dec 16, 2009
Messages
17,366
Reaction score
689
Location
South Eastern Ontario
I went down to feed and water the rabbits this evening, just before dark. While I was feeding them, I heard squeals and grunts and moans from one of the nest tunnels. So I went to investigate. What I found was that Sage was kindling and Jasper, our usually so-gentlemanly buck, was trying to mate with her. I dragged him out and closed the lid to give Sage some privacy, but Jasper was relentless. He just wouldn't stay out and there was nothing but hay handy to block the entrance. Total chaos. The other rabbits were milling about under my feet and it's a wonder I didn't step on anybunny. A wonder too that none escaped! Finally I wedged the lid of one of the feed bins in front of the entrance and got a breathing space.

I went outside and got a dog crate and dragged it in and locked Jasper up for the night. Then I made sure that Sage could get back into the nest tunnel and I went to finish the chores. I was so upset! Shaking and furious! Mostly with myself but a bit with the sex fiend too. I've never seen anything like it.

So. Now I know what happened to Sage's other litter a month ago. And I expect that is why Alice only had two kits in the nest this past time. Likely she lost some of them. Obviously Jasper will not be able to stay in the colony full time. I feel very discouraged, because most of the time they all enjoy being together. I love seeing a pile of bunnies on top of the nest boxes, lounging in a patch of sunshine and grooming each other.

On the other hand, I suppose now I know what is happening I can modify things to fix the problem. If it had happened at any other time of day or night, I would not have known what was going on. This colony thing is more complicated than it looks at a glance. The benefits are obvious... the downside a little harder to figure out.
 
oh my... stupid rabbit. glad you figured out what happened. So it looks like he'll only have temporary access...perhaps a pen in the middle of the colony with occasional times out and about with them?
 
Yeah, I think that's what we'll be doing. I'll have to figure out a schedule for him. I guess he could stay from breeding to about the third week of their pregnancies... Then separate him until I want to rebreed the does. It will give me more control over things, but I'm sorry he can't stay in full time.

I'd never have believed it if I hadn't seen it!
 
Not a Stupid Rabbit,
the Buck was just doing what any other Buck would do.
Rabbits will re-breed immediately after Kindling,
that is when the Does are most receptive.
Might be a good idea to just allow the Buck
in with the Does for a few weeks at a time,
then back into his quarters he goes.
Ottersatin. :eek:ldtimer:
 
Ugh, that would make me mad! Glad you found him and pulled him out. I think your idea is a good one...you might even be able to leave him for 28 days, pull, and put him back once they are all kindled...
 
Wow... glad you figured it out! I had heard plenty of them mating within a couple of days after kindling, but I hadn't heard of a buck trying to mate with a doe while she's kindling! I can understand why Sage was a mite upset with Jasper!
 
Otttersatin, I do realize that any buck will rebreed a doe immediately after kindling. What I didn't realize was that he would follow her into the nest tunnel and try to do it while she was in labour. This doe was NOT receptive... she was busy birthing.

Even after I threw him out of the tunnel, he still kept coming back. I was singlehanded and had a heck of a time keeping him out long enough to block the entrance. He'll be caged within the colony until I can work out a solution - likely an adjoining floor pen with a connecting door for timed conjugal visits.

This particular buck is usually not an aggressive breeder, which is why I made the mistake of thinking he could stay in the colony at all times. My main reason for posting about this at such length is that I want other people to be aware of how different a buck's behaviour can be when a doe kindles.
 
it could just be something to do with Jasper though.

I have a friend who did colony raising. The bucks were NEVER that persistent. while the doe was kindling they left them alone. Post kindle...yeah, but not during.
 
I hope that's the case, Ladysown, and that it is just something with this particular buck. But how can one tell when setting up a colony? There was no prior indication of this Jekyll/Hyde behaviour - quite the reverse, in fact.<br /><br />__________ Thu Feb 10, 2011 9:28 am __________<br /><br />Well, I'm pleased with Sage. After all the upset, she went back into the nest tunnel and finished kindling and pulled lots of fur. There was one huge dead kit outside the nest this morning - likely stepped on during the "activities" last evening - but there are several live ones in the nest. We didn't open it... It is -18 Celsius this morning or Zero Fahrenheit.
 
it makes me wonder about the small litters and random dead kits n my colony for sure, last time Spooky kindled, one was nice and big, nothing looked wrong, and she hadnt cleaned it off at all. I really wondered about that since she has never has kits DOA. It still was in the sack. I am very thankful you posted this, because it had never crossed my mind before.
 
It takes the does a while (couple of kindlings) to get the buck trained, from what I've seen now. After that..it's better, but the buck will definitely try to breed as soon as they kindle :(

My angora girls and buck do just fine with a schedule. He lives with them for 3.5 weeks. When they start to lay around and look like big LUMPS, I take him out and put him in a cage next to the does. He stays there until I'm ready for another litter. I give the girls a couple months break..but they're not meat rabbits. With the meat colony, I'd do a 1month wait...kits are out and about, eating solids, etc...and then put him back in with them.

Perhaps a simple fence down one side of the area? give him a 2' section wide, 4 or 5feet long? nice hopping room. He can stay in touch with his girls, but the nesttunnel is safe from him.
 
That's what I figure I will do, Ann. Annoying, though, because it means I have to actually go into the colony every day instead of feeding and watering through the gate. And it's like being back to cages again.

Funny thing, Ann, my does never lay about like beached whales. They get a little thicker through the belly but they are always as active as ever right up to the moment of kindling.
 
Maple and Spooky do the beached whale thing, but Luna is as big as a HOUSE and she is running around, leaping onto my bed. Its crazy woman in there, lol!
 
I pull the buck the week before the does are due and put him back about a week after they have kindled. I think it lessens stress a lot. After a few weeks with a buck the does come to hate him and make lots of grunting and squealing noises all the time. They start to get more testy with each other as well. Remove the buck for awhile and everyone is happier again.
 
Well, a few things have been happening in the colony. Only one kit survived from Sage's litter - never did get an accurate count but we only found one dead so there may only have been two. Sage pulled mountains of fur and was taking good care of it, but Alice, who was in her last week of pregnancy began interfering with the nest. After finding the kit exposed twice, we brought both Sage and the kit up to the house. We moved Alice's lonely only into a smaller cage (ferret carrier, actually) and put Sage and her kit into the solid bottomed cage. It's really too small, but Sage seems relaxed and happy. The kit is a little blimp. Every time I pick it up I think is is going to burst. It's probably getting more milk than it needs, so we will very soon move it to the ferret carrier and just give it a couple hours morning and evening with Sage. I weighed the kit yesterday. It was exactly 200 grams. It's eyes are beginning to open.

Alice's lonely only returned to the colony today. Seemed like a smooth re-entry, but we left the open carrier there to give it a bolt hole if it gets frightened. It seemed very happy and eager to explore. The adults gave it the once over but seemed to accept it. I fully expect it to integrate itself with the youngsters from Alice's first litter and hang out with them.
 
Golly I'm sorry you've had such a bad experience with the colony :( There does seem to be a correlation between raising the kits as a colony start and you can keep the physical size of colony small; and putting in adult does who are friends, but have been separate - needing a much larger space.

Even with Mama and Clone, mother and daughter....when one kindled the other sort of panicked and scattered everyone around. (although I've got a theory that it happened here because Clone was due to kindle AFTER mama, and went looking for a place to have her babies....unfortunately, she found Mama-sans' tunnel)
 
Yeah, it's been a bit of a drag... but I think we have a handle on it now. We're planning to divide the colony in half with Sage on one side and Alice on the other. The nest tunnel is one unit so the barrier will bisect it as well. Jasper will commute... three weeks with one doe and then three with the other. This will give the does a bit of extra time between litters. If we get off schedule, Jasper may have to spend a bit of time in a cage on occasion. A bit more work, but a bit more control... I guess it's a trade-off.
 
Eventually, I'd like to do that. But Alice is David's favourite and has special status. I may eventually put her back in a cage and run a colony with some youngsters instead. But now that Sage has decided to give motherhood a whirl, I'd like to get a good doe or two from her. So we'll try the dual pens for a while and see how it goes.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top