Making silage for rabbits?

[ramblingrabbit]

Well, I've been pondering the notion for a little while now. While I have yearround forage in the area, it seems like it could save some time and trouble by reducing the daily forage cutting to have a store of silage in plastic bags handy for feeding. I could envision having some bags of mixed silage handy as sort of the base fodder ration, stored next the bin I keep the grain in, and offering it at each feeding along with some fresh cut stuff, plus extra protein greens for the does, that sort of thing. (As it is now, I tend to cut everything fresh, but I collect some stuff, mostly grasses, also tree branches, from farther afield and keep them on an improvised rick I set up next to the rabbitry--that way, we don't have to gather EVERYTHING twice a day, and can have some--slightly wilted--stuff on hand, and gather the rest quickly from the nearby garden and landscape at feeding time, which makes it reasonably efficient.)

The trouble is, while I've read breif references here and there to the idea of bagging silage for rabbits, I just can't seem to find any specific information on exactly how to go about it, what potential pitfalls to watch out for, etc. I know mold's something to worry about. Some "recipes" I found, not specific to rabbits, talked about using molasses mixed in "to aid fermentation" but not sure exactly when this would be required or how key it is--supposedly it depends on the type of fodder (which doesn't really help unless I can find more specific instructions for specific materials and methods, of course). I also read in one or two places about cutting the ingredients up really small to aid fermentation, but I can't help but wonder how key that is--it would be a big pain, it seems, to do by hand, so I'm sort of reluctant to go to all the trouble to experiment without a better understanding of the principles to guide me... I suppose I could experiment with very small batches just to see what happens to different ingredients.

Speaking of which, I'm also not so clear on the nutritional properties of silage. Is it purely a question of preservation, or does the fermentation also increase nutritional value in some way (analogous to sauerkraut)? Increase or decrease protein, for example? Neutralize toxins, perhaps? In what other ways are nutrients affected, and how does it compare to fresh forage or hay from the same plants? Does it tend to improve or reduce palatability of greens?

I could also dry things in hay, but I worry about them molding quickly in this humid, warm environment.

Hmmm... Any thoughts...?

 

[DonnerSurvivor]

Not sure how you are going to make silage without at least a chopper and a tractor and that is serious money. Even If you already have the tractor already choppers though relatively cheap are a pain in the rear to maintain. Unless I am thinking way to large or if you have a way to gather and chop small amounts I cant see it being worth it at all.

 

[ramblingrabbit]

I have machetes, shears, knives, hedge trimmers, a mowing machine, a neighbor with a chipper shredder machine I could hook up. And I only need enough for a couple litters of rabbits, not a herd of cows. But I wonder how small the pieces need to be, or better yet is it possible to ferment silage at all without shredding? What if I'm using something that already has smallish leaves, like, say, hibiscus or something? :?

If this is truly uncharted territory I may just have to start experimenting... the mold issue or potential for other toxins definitely freaks me a little though.

 

[Jack]

Why ferment it is? rabbits don't chew their cud, I would think you'd have more issues trying to feed them such wet feed

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Here are a couple posts on the topic:

chaffhaye-alfalfa-t11571.html

post136926.html#p136926

 

[ramblingrabbit]

Thanks Mamasheepdog. My curiosity is certainly piqued now. I may have to just experiment a bit now and see what I can make...

Why ferment it is? rabbits don't chew their cud, I would think you'd have more issues trying to feed them such wet feed

Jack--I would like to ferment it as a way to preserve fresh fodder for later feeding--as I explained above. I understand how rabbit digestion works, but they are already happily eating, for point of discussion, exclusively fresh-cut (or slightly wilted) forage (ie no hay) with a little grain supplement, and I don't see how a silage would have any more or less water content than fresh cut--matter never being created or destroyed, and all that... But if you have specific info on the nutrition of silage for rabbits or the chemistry of what happens during the fermentation I'd really love to learn! If I can get a better sense of the principles at work I can experiment more efficiently...

BTW it's my understanding that silage need not exclusively be used for cud chewers. I once talked to someone who fed a chaya-based silage to chickens, and I've heard of something similar being used for pigs. And humans eat sauerkraut.

The ultimate test, of course, will be to see if my rabbits would even eat what I make... :lol:

 

[Jack]

OK, I would caution, caution.
the fastest way to kill a healthy rabbit is change it's food.
as for sillage, some swear it's fool proof, others that it's an art.

I would consider either plastic barrels or large trash cans once you have your system, interesting idea.

 

[akane]

Generally silage is not used for goats, horses, and rabbits because they are too sensitive to bacteria or mold that can contaminate the feed. One rip in your silage wrap and you have no more herd. Cattle, chicken and some other livestock are far more durable to such things. We send the stuff not good enough for the cattle to the chickens, the stuff not good enough for the horses to the cattle and the stuff not good enough for the rabbits to the horses. That's how the sensitivity and needs ladder goes. Rabbits are at the top of needing the purest and safest feed stock.

 

[ramblingrabbit]

Hmmmm... Thanks folks. Makes sense I guess, and maybe that's why I can't find more info about silage for rabbits specifically, eh? :? Don't want to lose the herd over this for sure, that would be, um, counterproductive! I might still try some more research, try fermenting some stuff on a small scale so I can really watch it carefully, see what it looks and smells like, and then make the call whether to try feeding a little bit to see how it takes. One possibility that occurs to me is using it to feed up the weened fryers, rather than the breeders, which is when having extra fodder stored on hand would definitely be most useful anyway, and that would minimize risk in case anything weird DID happen. Anyhow, I'm nothing if not cautious. And if I do try experimenting, of course, I'll report back. Cheers!

 

[Miss M]

You can always select an experimental rabbit or litter, rather than taking the chance with your whole herd initially.

 

[Big Tom]

When we are chopping hay for silage, the chopper knives are set for a 5/16 cut length. Our moisture content is about 65% and we pack the silage as tight as we can get it to prevent any air being trapped in the silage. Air equals mold and mycotoxins. We store silage in upright silos, so there are hundreds of tons of weight packing the silage down as we fill the silos.If the silage is to wet you get rot, if it is to dry it won't pack tight enough and you can get mold. Mold you can see, mycotoxins you can't.

I would think it be far easier to just dry your fodder and store it as hay.

 

[Frecs]

There are youtube videos on making silage on a small scale. But, after watching a good many of them and doing other research, I decided that for rabbits it is better to "make hay" or as I saw it called on one site "dried rabbit salad". IOW, dry the plant matter (guarding against mold) and mix a variety together and store for wintertime feeding. I have not begun this process yet as I have so many projects to do as it is! How to dry (especially in a humid environment) and store large amounts is one of the issues I've not yet resolved.

FYI: I know someone who takes lawn clippings and molds it with molasses into a block to feed his "feeders" (feeders being the rabbits destined for freezer camp). Not sure if these blocks could then be stored for later????

 

[Big Tom]

I'm not sure why you would need the molasses. You can use the clippings the way they are once they have dried. Most lawn clippings, if your grass isn't to high when you mow, will dry in 5 or 6 hours or sooner. I know folks who stuff clippings in plastic garbage cans and feed it in the winter months.

 

[Frecs]

I'm not sure why you would need the molasses. You can use the clippings the way they are once they have dried. Most lawn clippings, if your grass isn't to high when you mow, will dry in 5 or 6 hours or sooner. I know folks who stuff clippings in plastic garbage cans and feed it in the winter months.

I'm not sure of the logic for the molasses blocks either other than calories. Which may be helpful if I'm reading this study correctly:http://www.lrrd.org/lrrd12/4/ling124.htm. The point for the person I'm speaking of, is to reduce the cost of feeding the rabbits destined for freezer camp down to as close to zero as possible. If molasses helps to provide energy to a diet of grass/weeds/garden waste then it serves a purpose.

I have found that my rabbits do not like fresh clippings from my lawnmower bag. I think it's because the clippings are so short. I'm not sure where I'd set up to dry large amounts of clippings that the chickens would not destroy. And, I don't have anywhere to store a large quantity of bags of hay. So, I make use of the clippings as mulch and go out first with scissors and a bucket to cut grass/clover/weeds to feed the rabbits. I stick with just cutting the clumps of Bermuda grass -- I'm NOT getting on my hands and knees to cut the other stuff! If there was a way to make the grass clippings more tasty for the rabbits, it would be very helpful.

 

[avdpas77]

The reason for molasses is probably the sugar content. Anaerobic fermentation of sugar equals alcohol which is a preservative for the fodder. Sauerkraut on the other hand is an aerobic process that produces acid, usually acetic acid.

I would be very wary of feeding a rabbit either, and I would be surprised if you could get them to eat it. If you have a rabbit you can experiment with see if you can get the used to eating a little bit of cabbage (don't feed them a lot, it causes gas and that is a problem for rabbits) If you can get them to eat a bit of cabbage each day, then see if you can get them to eat sauerkraut. I suspect you couldn't get them to touch it.

If you really want to save up your forage, get a piece of black plastic and lay it in a sunny place. Cut a bunch of fodder (I do this with Ladino clover in the early summer) and spread it evenly on the plastic. Turn it once or twice a day for two or three days until it is dry, then put it in a 50 gal drum or some other suitable container that allows the air in. you can make really terrific hay this way and the rabbits will love it every bit as much as fresh.

 

[ramblingrabbit]

The reason I thought silage over hay initially is because of my climate. I would be afraid of drying forage only to have it get moldy at some point in the ambient humid air. Mold grows on EVERYTHING in Hawaii. I hang a shirt in an open closet in my bedroom for two months and it smells moldy. The wooden ceiling has mold growing on it if we don't clean it regularly. My shoes are growing mold. Mold even grows on plastic here. The farm supply store only carries small amounts of poultry and rabbit feeds at one time because it starts molding in the paper bags as soon as it gets delivered. Back when i first got my two rabbits, and stopped off at the store to buy pellets, they told me to only get a ten pound bag for two rabbits, because it would go moldy otherwise. I buy straw for the chicken coop in fifty pound bails at a time, and it's moldy before I can get through it.

Another thing that attracted me was that I've read somewhere that silage is more nutritious than hay.

Maybe since mold is going to be a hazard no matter what though... I suppose I could try to dry some hay up really quickly, seal it up tight in something like a plastic bin with a sealable lid, or maybe better yet in several differnt smaller containers. That might work, if I used it up quickly enoough and made sure to keep it dry when opening and closing the container... I'd hate to have it mold on me though.

Has anybody else in humid climes had luck with this?<br /><br />__________ Fri May 24, 2013 11:06 am __________<br /><br />

There are youtube videos on making silage on a small scale. But, after watching a good many of them and doing other research, I decided that for rabbits it is better to "make hay" or as I saw it called on one site "dried rabbit salad". IOW, dry the plant matter (guarding against mold) and mix a variety together and store for wintertime feeding. I have not begun this process yet as I have so many projects to do as it is! How to dry (especially in a humid environment) and store large amounts is one of the issues I've not yet resolved.

I like this idea. In my case of course it wouldn't be for winter feeding, but just to relieve the burden of some of the daily forage collecting and make feedings more efficient--and a more "*****-proof" chore so it's easier when I have to delegate it to someone other than my immediate family. Of course, if I can't store decent amounts at a time without mold issues, I'm not sure it's going to do much for me...

 

[wisnoskij]

Generally silage is not used for goats, horses, and rabbits because they are too sensitive to bacteria or mold that can contaminate the feed. One rip in your silage wrap and you have no more herd.

Hay is very hard to get right and will always have some amount of mold. Often in tiny tiny amounts that are not important, but even when it gets into amounts that can be dangerous it is very hard to spot. Silage on the other hand, since it is wet will either be completely wrecked and you will be able to tell from 20 feet away or it will be oxygen free and mold/etc. will literally be unable to survive in it.

 

[alforddm]

Maybe dry your greens with a dehydrator and then seal it with a vacuum sealer?

 

[robeyw]

I gave my pet rabbit free access to fresh grass over the summer and she very rarely ate hay. As fresh grass became less available, I found that she hated commercial timothy hay and did not like the hay I made (less mature grass dried at room temperature without sun exposure) much better. I made some silage mid summer and very gradually introduced it to her. My process was to reduce fresh grass then slowly introduce the silage while continuing to reduce the fresh grass which is of decreasing quality and variety. While she prefers the fresh grass she greatly prefers the silage to hay. While the commercial hay is available at all times and everything else I give her is eaten immediately, about half of her calories are from commercial rabbit “pellets” (actually extruded formulated food).

I have seen professional answers, for example https://firstvet.com/uk/questions/712/can-rabbits-eat-silage,saying rabbits can eat silage but that it is not practical. I only use it to provide some relief from hay and made it as follows: The grass was cut before flowering during a dry period and packed into wide mouth quart jars, cut only enough to allow packing, pumped down to .1 atm and back filled with nitrogen with a canning lid tightened enough after back filling to provide a vacuum seal but loose enough to allow gasses to safely escape. Stored at room temperature of about 78F during summer and down to 48F in cool weather and barely above freezing after opening ,I see no indication of mould or rot. For comparison, I prepared one jar with only the air fill and it is not acceptable. The general recommendation is to dry it some in free air before packing but on this small scale production, it is hard to know how much.