Is this fur mites?!?!

[Green2Rabbits]

Bought my first pedigree silver fox and didn't look him over well enough. Got home cut his nails and brushed fur to find a bald spot of light pink skin between shoulder blades area behind neck. I can see the dandruff but it's not as big of chunks as YT videos and the dandruff is not moving when I staired at it for maybe like 10 seconds.
Thinking worse case scenario I ordered food grade DE and neem oil for the wire cage.
Besides nutrition issue what can cause this. Can fur mites be hard to see or stand still for several seconds while I parted fur and looked at bald spot?
He is in my quarantine pen for now anyways which is good.

Wouldn't you know the helpful seller didn't reply after I sent a pic and asked her nicely what was this. She lives farther away than it pays to return him and he is big and healthy besides the possible mites.

My DE from amazon should be delivered in 4 days. Can I use non food grade DE on his coat or is even one application of non food grade going to be dangerous?
Trying to avoid poisons either topical or injected since he will one day be food.
Btw my female had dandruff that cleared up due to extra sun but since this one has a bad spot I'm thinking it's probably not nutrition or vitamin issues.

 

[michaels4gardens]

looks like it

 

[Green2Rabbits]

looks like it

That's what I was afraid. Thanks!

 

[hotzcatz]

I use Ivermection horse wormer for wool and ear mites. Just a dab in their ears will fix them right up. It's 1.87% Ivermection and doesn't have any other active additives to it. It's a green apple flavored paste and not very expensive, it's about $5 a tube here in Hawaii. The whole tube is one dose for a horse but it will treat the whole herd of bunnies here with leftovers. The dab is about the size of three grains of rice and I'll usually put it in both ears. The DE would probably work, too, but around here the horse wormer is easier to get.

 

[Green2Rabbits]

I use Ivermection horse wormer for wool and ear mites. Just a dab in their ears will fix them right up. It's 1.87% Ivermection and doesn't have any other active additives to it. It's a green apple flavored paste and not very expensive, it's about $5 a tube here in Hawaii. The whole tube is one dose for a horse but it will treat the whole herd of bunnies here with leftovers. The dab is about the size of three grains of rice and I'll usually put it in both ears. The DE would probably work, too, but around here the horse wormer is easier to get.

Thanks I actually did some snooping around the sight and saw you recommend that to another user. I went to my local farm/general store and they had it for $3! I was shocked. So I bought it! I also found food grade DE and neem oil (for the cage strictly).

I dusted the buck today well and sprayed neem oil on the cage. It rained though only 45 mins later with some getting on part of the cage.

I didn't use the horse medicine yet because of meat contamination. This should be 1 of my 2 buck studs but I still plan on eating him after he "can't" anymore. Won't this be in his meat forever? I was excited to hear it works so well but I didn't know how the body stores this type of treatment? Any risk with eating later on?

Also he has only been in the cage for 2 days before I dusted him but see picture. Should I treat the female in the cage next to him? She has never been bred and is 8 months old so plenty old enough to handle it without possible kit damage but I don't want to jump the gun. There is a piece of cardboard I put up before he even arrived so hopefully that slowed any mites. As you can see they sit on a 2x4 frame that does go from under his cage to her cage. (Male top left, female top right) the mom and kits are bottom right but hopefully the poop ramp blocks any possible mites.
This is my first experience with mites but thinking back to my time with fleas I'm trying to be extra careful.
Btw its night here so I used a flashlight. Bad picture but you get the idea.

 

[michaels4gardens]

I didn't use the horse medicine yet because of meat contamination. This should be 1 of my 2 buck studs but I still plan on eating him after he "can't" anymore. Won't this be in his meat forever? I was excited to hear it works so well but I didn't know how the body stores this type of treatment? Any risk with eating later on?

Also he has only been in the cage for 2 days before I dusted him but see picture. Should I treat the female in the cage next to him? She has never been bred and is 8 months old so plenty old enough to handle it without possible kit damage but I don't want to jump the gun.

[/quote]

The ivermectin is only in the body for about a month [according to literature]
so waiting 2 or 3 months before butcher, should be plenty long enough..

If it were me I would treat the doe also..and.. wait a month before breeding her.

 

[Green2Rabbits]

I didn't use the horse medicine yet because of meat contamination. This should be 1 of my 2 buck studs but I still plan on eating him after he "can't" anymore. Won't this be in his meat forever? I was excited to hear it works so well but I didn't know how the body stores this type of treatment? Any risk with eating later on?

Also he has only been in the cage for 2 days before I dusted him but see picture. Should I treat the female in the cage next to him? She has never been bred and is 8 months old so plenty old enough to handle it without possible kit damage but I don't want to jump the gun.

The ivermectin is only in the body for about a month [according to literature]
so waiting 2 or 3 months before butcher, should be plenty long enough..

If it were me I would treat the doe also..and.. wait a month before breeding her.[/quote]
Perfect thanks she won't be able to be breed that long anyways. Ok good so just a real small amount of the stuff at the base of the ear and massage it around?
What about her cage should I neem oil that with her removed also or no just treating her is fine?

P.S. Dabbing some in the ear will kill the mites everywhere right? It goes into the blood and is distributed everywhere.....right?
P.P.S I put about that amount in the next door female cage and rubbed it a little. WAY less traumatizing than a DE bath. Is brushing required like fleas on pets?

 

[michaels4gardens]

no just treat the buns, wait 2 weeks and recheck, if still infected retreat them.
Although sanitizing cages is good protocol, it won't change the infection curve for fur mites or ear mites.
Yes, the ivermectin treatments are designed to be "systemic"..
you don't need to brush them, unless you're unsure of whether or not the dander is new.
I have not had any trouble with reinfection myself.

 

[Green2Rabbits]

no just treat the buns, wait 2 weeks and recheck, if still infected retreat them.
Although sanitizing cages is good protocol, it won't change the infection curve for fur mites or ear mites.
Yes, the ivermectin treatments are designed to be "systemic"..
you don't need to brush them, unless you're unsure of whether or not the dander is new.
I have not had any trouble with reinfection myself.

2 weeks......glad you said that I thought 10 days. The new buck who has it I only dusted with DE and online they say dust again in 10 days (eggs hatch). Should I quick also give him the ivermectin even though he has been dusted? Or wait the 10 days and then instead of dusting him give him ivermectin, or just dust him again without ivernectin?

So far I only gave the doe on the same top level across from him the ivermectin as a precaution. Since he was dusted I didn't yet BUT will if you recommend it.

Since the setup is a two story 4 cage setup with one empty cage should I just treat them all twice? I have 1 buck (culprit), 1 doe (across virgin), 1 doe bottom layer w/ eight 4 week old kits.....still kind of nursing. If treating all should I only use FG DE powder on the mamma doe and kits? I only treated top row so far.

After doing some more research. Great so I guess they can jump and live in the house just like cat fleas. I'm planning on buying a microscope to be sure dandruff is not mites. Till then assuming mites.

Should I go full ghost busters suite here also using a tyvek one piece suit? The cage is set on my porch by my front door. What should I treat the porch with?

Brings back 2 months of flea infestations years back. Lol.
Thanks!

 

[hotzcatz]

It's not that viral, just put a dab of Ivermectin in their ears and you're basically done. FWIW, Ivermectin can be used on humans, too, for head lice or some such thing (they say by prescription only for topical use) so you don't even need to use gloves to administer it. But, I'm not a veterinarian, I don't even play one on TV so this is just what we do over here.

I've bred does after they've been dosed with Ivermection. Same with PenG penicillin, too. They still seem to have litters with no problems, but if you can wait a week after dosing them it may be better (or maybe it doesn't matter at all). There's been tons of medical research done using rabbits, there's probably some sort of research paper out there somewhere about it. They're usually written in 'medicalese' but you can generally get the gist of it even ignoring the Latin words.

If you get a flea infestation on your bunny (this doesn't usually happen unless there's nowhere else for the fleas to go) then there is a cat flea medicine that can be used. Revolution or Advantage for cats, I think it is. But check that one first to make sure. Actually, your DE would probably keep down fleas and you've already got that.

I have a friend who takes DE herself to keep away internal worms. Not sure why she thinks she could have worms, but with the DE now she's certain she doesn't have any.

 

[michaels4gardens]

My experience with using DE for mites ,has not been very good.
In theory it should kill the mites.
But in practical application, there are a lot of places on the rabbit
that don't, or may not have DE in full contact with the skin.
I had "re-infection" issues when I used that method.
I have had no reinfection with ivermectin, as long as I treated all the rabbits
that "could have" been contaminated.

 

[Green2Rabbits]

It's not that viral, just put a dab of Ivermectin in their ears and you're basically done. FWIW, Ivermectin can be used on humans, too, for head lice or some such thing (they say by prescription only for topical use) so you don't even need to use gloves to administer it. But, I'm not a veterinarian, I don't even play one on TV so this is just what we do over here.

I've bred does after they've been dosed with Ivermection. Same with PenG penicillin, too. They still seem to have litters with no problems, but if you can wait a week after dosing them it may be better (or maybe it doesn't matter at all). There's been tons of medical research done using rabbits, there's probably some sort of research paper out there somewhere about it. They're usually written in 'medicalese' but you can generally get the gist of it even ignoring the Latin words.

If you get a flea infestation on your bunny (this doesn't usually happen unless there's nowhere else for the fleas to go) then there is a cat flea medicine that can be used. Revolution or Advantage for cats, I think it is. But check that one first to make sure. Actually, your DE would probably keep down fleas and you've already got that.

I have a friend who takes DE herself to keep away internal worms. Not sure why she thinks she could have worms, but with the DE now she's certain she doesn't have any.

I'm not looking for medical studies as long as you have experience with it working it's not like I'm planning on doing this often. So your experience is good for me.

Oh wow didn't know that. That's cool humans can use it too. All I know is back when I had fleas that poison was supposed to be wicked stuff.....but "safe" as soon as it dried.

Yes before they had that poison for people to take that killed worms I know they used food grade DE which is cool. I've heard of people claiming to dose them selves weekly and some how there hair and nails grow amazingly fast. They must enjoy parasite eggs like caviar lol. Here I wish they grew slower so I didn't need a hair cut. Lol.

Ok true lots of tests on rabbits.
Thanks.

-- Mon Aug 24, 2020 8:02 am --

My experience with using DE for mites ,has not been very good.
In theory it should kill the mites.
But in practical application, there are a lot of places on the rabbit
that don't, or may not have DE in full contact with the skin.
I had "re-infection" issues when I used that method.
I have had no reinfection with ivermectin, as long as I treated all the rabbits
that "could have" been contaminated.

Yeah....that doesn't sound like much fun. Since he will hopefully be my breeder of them I will go out and treat him then this morning thanks! <br /><br /> -- Mon Aug 24, 2020 12:22 pm -- <br /><br /> Great......no fur lose but the kits from down below are scratching around there neck and one I picked up had visible dandruff.
Should I use I ivermectin on them they are only 25 days old and possibly still doing some breastfeeding from the doe in the cage. Also would it hurt the kits to give ivermectin to the doe that might be partially still breastfeeding them?

 

[hotzcatz]

If it were me, I'd dose the doe and see if that clears up the kits. If they're still being fed by the doe, then there will be some Ivermection that goes through the milk. If they're not, well, then maybe a tiny dose on the young ones, but I've not tried dosing really young buns. Maybe dose your least favorite one? Let us know how it works?

 

[Green2Rabbits]

If it were me, I'd dose the doe and see if that clears up the kits. If they're still being fed by the doe, then there will be some Ivermection that goes through the milk. If they're not, well, then maybe a tiny dose on the young ones, but I've not tried dosing really young buns. Maybe dose your least favorite one? Let us know how it works?

Thanks I actually decided to do that. Then to be safe I put DE over all the kits. It seemed to stop the itching. Now in 10 days I'll do it again to be safe because this Tue they will officially be 5 weeks old. I see them go crazy for the grain so I'm thinking they might be not breast feeding anymore.

What does it mean when one shakes its head back and forth, grabs down its ear, then scratches and jumps, then repeats the process. 2xs before stopping. Sounds like mites but I dusted them like 5 days prior. If I see that again today I'm going to take a good look in that ear.

Thanks have a good weekend!

 

[michaels4gardens]

In my experience DE wasn't very effective for mites.
Take a good look inside the ear and see if there is any scabby areas.

 

[Green2Rabbits]

In my experience DE wasn't very effective for mites.
Take a good look inside the ear and see if there is any scabby areas.

Dang I saw a youtube video where they were like yeah works great killed in 20 days. Lol.

The kits are now 5 weeks old and gonna go to freezer camp at 8-10 weeks. If I poison the kits can I still safely eat them in under 5 weeks or should I just treat them and let them go for longer. I rather kill the mites and feed them longer as long as the mites are dead.

Is 5 weeks to young for ivermectin?

 

[Zass]

In my experience DE wasn't very effective for mites.
Take a good look inside the ear and see if there is any scabby areas.

For ear mites, I've never tried DE, but I do have to say my results with DE for fur mites and fleas have been more positive.
A few treatments were all it took in the past to get rid of both. I haven't had very many breakouts of either over the years though.

Ear mites have been a bigger issue, I have accidentally brought in rabbits with ear mites a couple times now.
Oil treatments for ear mites do work pretty well, but they have to be repeated.

I think feeding hay from local farms increases my risks of bringing mites in, but it's a risk I'm more than willing to take.

When treating for any kind of mites, it helps to treat the entire area they are exposed to, and not just affected animals.
My current protocol for either type of mites is to sprinkle the DE in trays under the rabbits, and on the floor of the rabbitry. Wash as many cages and surfaces as possible, and use ivermectin on adult animals. (It is inexpensive and very safe.)

A little DE rubbed into the fur hasn't caused mine any harm, and it has helped in the past. A little oil in the ears for rabbits with earmites still removes flakes, smothers adult mites, and helps them heal faster.

I guess I'm saying I favor a combined treatment plan these days.

 

[Green2Rabbits]

In my experience DE wasn't very effective for mites.
Take a good look inside the ear and see if there is any scabby areas.

For ear mites, I've never tried DE, but I do have to say my results with DE for fur mites and fleas have been more positive.
A few treatments were all it took in the past to get rid of both. I haven't had very many breakouts of either over the years though.

Ear mites have been a bigger issue, I have accidentally brought in rabbits with ear mites a couple times now.
Oil treatments for ear mites do work pretty well, but they have to be repeated.

I think feeding hay from local farms increases my risks of bringing mites in, but it's a risk I'm more than willing to take.

When treating for any kind of mites, it helps to treat the entire area they are exposed to, and not just affected animals.
My current protocol for either type of mites is to sprinkle the DE in trays under the rabbits, and on the floor of the rabbitry. Wash as many cages and surfaces as possible, and use ivermectin on adult animals. (It is inexpensive and very safe.)

A little DE rubbed into the fur hasn't caused mine any harm, and it has helped in the past. A little oil in the ears for rabbits with earmites still removes flakes, smothers adult mites, and helps them heal faster.

I guess I'm saying I favor a combined treatment plan these days.

I checked the ears on all and don't see anything nice and clear but the kits do look like they paw at their ears. I combined it for all but 5w old them only got dusted real well NOT in the ears though. The adults got ivermectin and a dusting. I didn't put much under the cage on the poop deck but I will and on the floor. (Its on my deck)

Thanks for your experience. Should I put oil with tea tree in all 8 kits ears just in case? They look clean but they are pawing at the ear area of the head....

 

[Zass]

Tea tree oil has been implicated in poisonings in dogs and cats, I wouldn't use it on rabbits.
Here is the pet MD article on it:
https://www.petmd.com/blogs/thedailyvet ... pets-31282

-- Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:54 pm --

Any plain vegetable oil will work. Olive, coconut, corn, soy, canola, sunflower, etc Those are safe to put on them at any age, or even just as preventative measure.

 

[Green2Rabbits]

Tea tree oil has been implicated in poisonings in dogs and cats, I wouldn't use it on rabbits.
Here is the pet MD article on it:
https://www.petmd.com/blogs/thedailyvet ... pets-31282

-- Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:54 pm --

Any plain vegetable oil will work. Olive, coconut, corn, soy, canola, sunflower, etc Those are safe to put on them at any age, or even just as preventative measure.

Wow thanks I never knew that! Ok great I thought I needed essential oils of some kind to kill them quicker. Even better I don't need it!

-- Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:53 pm --

The skittish male doesn't trust me so I only touched him with the tape before running into his hide but saw this on it. Guessing it's an egg? Its 60x zoom from a $12 microscope shot using my cell but check it out.