Is there something wrong with his front paws?

[Aviodont]

We have a 16 week old purebred Standard Rex buck who was the sole buck of a litter of 4. I am wanting to retire his 4 year old father who has become a bit too ornery and keep this buck going forward.

However, just today I noticed his front paws point inward when he walks. His left more than his right. Could this be a genetic defect? Or could it have happened during/after birth? If the former, better to cull? If the latter, would it affect his ability to mount effectively?

Here are links to two videos I made showing the problem. One is 8 seconds long, the second one is 39 seconds.



Video 1





Video 2

 

[tambayo]

For me this would not be breeding stock regardless of the cause. You may have a feed or housing related issue, it may be genetic (and then likely both parents have contributed).
So take a good look at feed, housing and the parents + siblings of this buck.

 

[Aviodont]

For me this would not be breeding stock regardless of the cause. You may have a feed or housing related issue, it may be genetic (and then likely both parents have contributed).
So take a good look at feed, housing and the parents + siblings of this buck.

How would feed affect it?

Housing was KW cages 14g floor 1/2x1 inch for the first 10 weeks, then he was separated from his sisters and mom and placed in a tractor on the grass (which allowed him to start digging holes).

Parents and sisters have normal feet. His paternal grandparents had normal feet, but cannot speak for the maternal grandparents.

 

[Alaska Satin]

How would feed affect it?

Housing was KW cages 14g floor 1/2x1 inch for the first 10 weeks, then he was separated from his sisters and mom and placed in a tractor on the grass (which allowed him to start digging holes).

Parents and sisters have normal feet. His paternal grandparents had normal feet, but cannot speak for the maternal grandparents.

Like @tambayo I might consider not keeping him for breeding. But since you don't know and probably won't be able to figure out what caused this, and he's the only alternative to an ornery buck, it would be hard for me to make a firm determination about how to proceed. So I don't actually have an answer, but can offer some things to consider.

One thing you might check is to see if he has sore feet, which many Rex can develop, and could cause him to hold his feet in a strange position, and walk strangely.

Bent limbs can be the result of a nutritional deficiency. However, if his sibs don't have the same issue, I wouldn't think it was a feed issue. If it resulted from a nutritional deficiency, this particular rabbit could have a higher need for or an inability to process some nutrient(s) compared to other rabbits, which isn't something I'd want to perpetuate.

If it's a bone or soft tissue malformation issue due to his genetic makeup, it would not necessarily show up in his sibs or parents; he could be the only one to show it. Many characteristics result from the combination of many different genes (known as polygenic traits), so the chance may be slight that you'll see it again, in his offspring or even from the same pairing that produced him.

Even if the trait is based on a single recessive allele (aka simple Mendelian inheritance), that allele needs to be contributed by each parent, which might only happen in one kit in a litter. But if it's genetic, especially if it's due to simple Mendelian inheritance, the problem might start showing up more often if you breed this buck, especially if you breed him with a relative or other individual that also carries the allele/alleles that are behind it.

Another thought that occurs to me is that it might be due to some sort of injury, whether in utero, during birth, in the nest box, or at some later point. This seems the least likely to me, since both front legs are affected, but it's within the realm of possibility. Maybe he was squashed in a less-than-ideal position in utero, or was delivered in a poor position, or was constantly pushed into a corner by the other kits in the nest box. If it was an injury unrelated to the kit himself, IMO it would not be necessary to cull him. But if it was an injury, there is the chance that he has some inherent (genetic) predisposition to sustain such an injury, which is a weakness you would not want to perpetuate.

If it's a choice between a possible genetic defect versus nasty attitude, I might actually lean toward going with a possible genetic defect, which I would just be vigilant about culling, going forward. (I really don't like unpleasant animals.) Either buck could pass on his negative trait(s); is it possible to keep the original buck while your young buck proves himself? At 16 weeks, he's getting pretty close to when he can sire his own kits. You could see if he produces kits with this or other problems, or not.

 

[Aviodont]

Like @tambayo I might consider not keeping him for breeding. But since you don't know and probably won't be able to figure out what caused this, and he's the only alternative to an ornery buck, it would be hard for me to make a firm determination about how to proceed. So I don't actually have an answer, but can offer some things to consider.

One thing you might check is to see if he has sore feet, which many Rex can develop, and could cause him to hold his feet in a strange position, and walk strangely.

Bent limbs can be the result of a nutritional deficiency. However, if his sibs don't have the same issue, I wouldn't think it was a feed issue. If it resulted from a nutritional deficiency, this particular rabbit could have a higher need for or an inability to process some nutrient(s) compared to other rabbits, which isn't something I'd want to perpetuate.

If it's a bone or soft tissue malformation issue due to his genetic makeup, it would not necessarily show up in his sibs or parents; he could be the only one to show it. Many characteristics result from the combination of many different genes (known as polygenic traits), so the chance may be slight that you'll see it again, in his offspring or even from the same pairing that produced him.

Even if the trait is based on a single recessive allele (aka simple Mendelian inheritance), that allele needs to be contributed by each parent, which might only happen in one kit in a litter. But if it's genetic, especially if it's due to simple Mendelian inheritance, the problem might start showing up more often if you breed this buck, especially if you breed him with a relative or other individual that also carries the allele/alleles that are behind it.

Another thought that occurs to me is that it might be due to some sort of injury, whether in utero, during birth, in the nest box, or at some later point. This seems the least likely to me, since both front legs are affected, but it's within the realm of possibility. Maybe he was squashed in a less-than-ideal position in utero, or was delivered in a poor position, or was constantly pushed into a corner by the other kits in the nest box. If it was an injury unrelated to the kit himself, IMO it would not be necessary to cull him. But if it was an injury, there is the chance that he has some inherent (genetic) predisposition to sustain such an injury, which is a weakness you would not want to perpetuate.

If it's a choice between a possible genetic defect versus nasty attitude, I might actually lean toward going with a possible genetic defect, which I would just be vigilant about culling, going forward. (I really don't like unpleasant animals.) Either buck could pass on his negative trait(s); is it possible to keep the original buck while your young buck proves himself? At 16 weeks, he's getting pretty close to when he can sire his own kits. You could see if he produces kits with this or other problems, or not.

After I posted, I was thinking the same thing. I could squeeze another litter out of ole ornery and maybe get something better.

But let me apologize for the confusion and by what I meant by ornery. He is sweet and always has been to humans.

We are on a suburban HOA lot and trying to fly under the radar. I have run out of cage space and cannot build a third hutch for fear of tattletale neighbors. So ole ornery was put “out to pasture” in the yard awhile back and he is sweet to humans letting my five year old pick him up and carry him anywhere. But then one of the grow outs from his “Hurricane Helene” litter (who was also beloved by my kids) at about 11 weeks old started attacking the other three bucks in his grow out cage. More than the usual pecking order stuff. Even the does would be doing some mounting to establish a pecking order in their own grow out cage.

So since he was a kid favorite and I wasn’t going to process him, I decided to let him “out to pasture” with his dad . In the first day, there was the usual territorial stuff and ole ornery came out on top, but he was OK after that. Fast forward another week, and one of the “does” had a fall off in the doe grow out cage. I was horrified. It was hanging out there unmistakably.

I yanked him from the doe cage and pondered what to do. I feared that putting him back in the buck grow out cage would start an epic battle since he had been gone awhile. And since he is sweet to humans as well, I put him out to pasture as well.

So of course ole ornery established dominance right away, but now he became increasingly intolerant of the first son I put out to pasture with him (the kid favorite). Now I find his particular fur all over the yard in clumps. He has numerous sores on him in various stages of healing.

So, my wife and I felt it might be time to retire ole ornery. Since he is really sweet to humans, I am sure I could find him a home off property. If not, the white box.

I apologize for the confusion again.

I think I will breed him again and see what I get. Thanks for the answers!

 

[tambayo]

Competition between intact males animals is normal. They are fighting over breeding rights for the females that are right there. Keep them seperated, because this will continue with pretty much any combo of breeding bucks.