For you teenagers or mothers of teenagers

[dayna]

So my daughter (16) has been dating this boy (17) for a while now. He lives a couple hours away.

His family is somewhat religious. We.. are not. We believe in God, doing good works, leading by example, etc etc. But NOT going to church.

Anyway...

The boy wants my daughter to sign a "purity card".

We (including the daughter) were pretty offended. I mean, I raised her to be able to made good choices.

She does not need some piece of paper to keep her from having adult relations! She is a smart capable young woman. Why on earth would she be unable to control herself? Why would HE be unable to control himself?

I just don't get it. Does this make any sense to anyone else? She has the self confidence and self worth to know she's worth waiting for. We talk about sex on a regular basis in our household. It's not something dirty, it's a fact of life, but one that should be partaken of when older and emotionally ready.

 

[Zass]

I'd be offended. I do have a daughter as well, although she's only 9 now, I can already tell I'll be able to trust her judgement when she gets older.

The churches are generally trying to do good, in their own roundabout sort of way, but in my opinion those purity cards, promise rings, and whatever else they give out are programs intended for children without guidance. To approach someone who isn't a member of the church with something like that kinda suggests that they feel she's without guidance...or that all teenagers are...one of the two.

I'm sure they intended no offense though, probably thinking in terms of "This is a great thing all teens should do!"

I agree that sex is for older, emotionally ready people, not teens, BUT I have no qualms with premarital sex. And honestly, I'd encourage my daughter to "try out" a potential marriage partner prior to legally binding herself to them...see, I've known marriages to fail over it.

 

[dayna]

We have some pretty open discussions about it. She agrees that the emotional commitment to having sex with someone is HUGE. She knows she's not ready for that level of commitment. I'm not saying she should be married, or ever even get married or even be with a boy. She knows all that.


We are very conservative AND liberal in this household! lol

It comes down to respect for yourself and those around you. If she respects herself, and her partner respects her and SHE feels ready, then fine (though I'll never like it! lol) but I have to be realistic. The fact that she's 17 in 2 weeks and a virgin is HUGE in our area. Half her friends have toddlers already.

She wants to be a doctor and knows that going to college/medical school, while not impossible, would be more difficult with a child to care for.

 

[Zass]

Ahh, there it is, 1/2 the kids in the area have toddlers. They are probably trying to reduce that demographic a bit. indiscriminately.

In a weird way they are actually conveying the message that it takes an abnormal commitment to refrain from sexual intercourse though. Kids often sign them or wear the promise rings out of peer pressure, so that they don't seem slutty to the other kids. Dunno how well they actually work on teens, but...from what I've SEEN PERSONALLY, they don't work at all!

(and I wish, I wish that dumb girl my brother mated with had kept her promise! (he's a idiot too)) Instead, now they are two miserable unmarried adults that hate each other with a neglected child that is growing up unguided. The church's promise ring had zero effect one way or the other here. Except maybe to make religious adults favor her and think she was going to be a good little girl?

 

[dayna]

In this culture, having sex and kids at a young age is pretty normal and accepted. Parents allow boyfriends and girlfriends to sleep over and even move in!

Regardless that's not how we roll.... In fact when her boyfriend is visiting this weekend from Kona we have RULES.

No boys in the bedroom. No doors closed in other areas of the house. Kissing/handholding only. No discussion, do not pass go, do not collect $200. My house, my rules.

My daughter once told me she likes the boundaries, that they make her think about what she's doing and WHY she's wanting to do it. Most of the time when it comes to things I'd rather her not do she quickly figures out there is a reason why I don't want her to do it. She is very good at putting herself in the adult/parent point of view and seeing why something is not appropriate for someone her age.

Unlike some parents, I look forward to her going off to college. She has a solid foundation on how to behave and WHY we should behave that way.

 

[Zass]

From what I've seen, parents allowing boyfriends to move in end up with babies WAY too soon.

I don't think I'm even going to allow my daughter to DATE while she lives in my house!
I mean, it's hard to imagine any boy in this little city good enough for her anyway.

I'll tell her to bring a man home from collage

I can't imagine her Dad is going to allow any dating either, haha, the poor thing.

My plan is to keep her too busy with social obligations and extracurricular activities to find time for boys.

 

[Demamma]

I'm very religious. I go to church every Sunday and I'm nursery leader. My kids at home are involved in church. I've never heard of a purity card and think he is stepping over the line asking her to sign it. Sounds like your daughter has a good head on her. I find that sometimes very religious people look like to others who don't go to church as not having standards. My daughter Emmz101 is now off to college. She was ready in every way to go. I trust her judgements. She is a young lady of strong moral fiber. I'm proud of her. I'm really also proud of her loving acceptance and understanding of others. Your daughter does not need a card to remind her of where she stands. Does he need it though? Maybe he wants it to help him remain strong.

 

[ottersatin]

I know that since I am not a Mother
and no longer have a "Teenaged Daughter"
I should not say anything on the subject!
But I am going to: The only thing I will say is,
whatever road one chooses to take in the prevention
of another person doing or not doing what they feel is correct
is a hard choice to police. Because, no one knows what goes on behind closed doors!
One must trust their children to know enough to make the right decisions,
because every action has a reaction.
Ottersatin. ldtimer:

 

[Schipperkesue]

My unsolicited advice....dump him. Asking her to sign this card speaks volumes about HIS frame of mind. He sounds controlling and this kind of behaviour may lead to an abusive relationship. When you fall in love often it is hard to make good decisions regarding an abusive partner.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Why would HE be unable to control himself?
.

You forget, he's a teenage boy!

And we forget that our bodies are biologically ready long before most of us mentally are, and back in the 'old' days, most women were married off in their teen years to start families.

But in all seriousness, if you girl has a level head, I wouldn't worry about the whole card thing. If he gets offended, then maybe sit down and explain to him, or have her explain to him, that a piece of paper means nothing. Actions speak louder than words.

And as far all the OTHER kids out there, not all teens make stupid choices. Sure, a lot do, but some are more mature than others. My boyfriend was allowed to stay the night, and he did practically live at my house too. My mother allowed it because she trusted me. Not to not have 'relations' as you call it, but that I was mature enough to handle making that choice, and be smart about it. It did not end up a tragedy. Actually, we ended up buying a house together when we were ready to move out of our parents' places, and we got married last year. Still no children. We'll have been together for 9 years this upcoming May.

Just because it ended badly for some people you know doesn't mean that the rest should be judged for it. It depends on each individual circumstance. I agree most teens wouldn't be mature enough to handle it, but some might actually be.We shouldn't pass judgement on others because of what someone else has done.

 

[dayna]

@psfangoras

I didn't really say I was judging. Where we live it is completely different than the rest of the country, and I would know as I've lived all over.

It is normal and accepted for the youth to have sex. It is normal and accepted to start having children in your young, middle and older teenaged years. In fact, in many families it is encouraged. It is quite normal for many generations to live in one home here.

I would not say my daughter has "pressure" from her peers to have sex, they just have no understanding of why she wouldn't. There is not the same stigma here about it.

I don't see where I said that these teens are making stupid choices, or that other parents were wrong in allowing children of the opposite sex to spend the night. I'm NOT judging. If you read it that way its your own life experiences jumping in there assuming I'm judging.

In my house, we have different rules than her peers. That doesn't make ours better or worse. It just makes it my house and my rules. I have raised my daughter the way I see fit. She is not emotionally ready to have sex. She is not emotionally ready to have a boy stay over, regardless of where he sleeps. It has nothing to do with trust, I trust her 100%. But as her parent, it's my job to allow her the safe time to grow and mature before being put in those types of situations.

 

[PSFAngoras]

I never said that you were judging, I suppose I should have quoted one of Zass' post before I put those last paragraphs in, where she mentioned that when she sees boyfriends moving in it 'ends up with babies way too soon'. I don't know how to add a second quote...

Anyway, with that post I thought it fair to mention that not every situation ends up that way.

I'm sure you are a wonderful mother and no one knows your daughter better than you.

 

[Zass]

Ah sorry PSFAngoras,
I was probably sounding a bit too judgemental about it. It's just that the situations I've personally seen didn't work out quite as well as yours.
When it comes to my precious daughter it's certainly not something I would want to gamble on. I tend not to leave things to trust in other people very much though.
I am probably overprotective, and I'm OK with that, cause I'd rather be overprotective then under in todays world.

The circumstances between every two people on this planet are definitely unique though, I'm usually the first to say that what is right for one person isn't necessarily right or even good for another.
Thanks for speaking up!

 

[PSFAngoras]

Not a problem, and I don't blame you for being scared of the choices your daughter may make. I'm sure parenting is as terrifying as it is rewarding.

I like to say that I'm old enough to know that I'm still too young for kids. That's not saying that young mothers do terrible, a lot of my friends from highschool already have children and most are wonderful parents. But I realize how terrifying parenting is, and I know that's not something I'm ready for yet, if ever. It's a big deal to try to raise these amazing little beings to be good people, I think any parent would fret over it.

 

[skysthelimit]

I can't see how asking her to sign the card is "controlling."

Did he say he would dump her if she didn't sign it?

Is pressuring her to have sex before she's ready better? That would be controlling as well.

He may think it's something that is a way to honor her, a way to say he is committed to honoring her and he won't back out of it, sealed like a contract. Purity cards are a way to get kids to think about their actions, a way to honor God and their own bodies, and their partners. It's about not going for instant gratification. It's something the church has always taught, minus the card.

The way things are going with split families and divorce rates, I don't know why anyone would oppose anything anyone does to get people to respect their relationships, and break the cycle of use it and toss it.

So if she doesn't want to sign it, tell him ans gauge his reaction.

If he is very religious, this may be the first sign that the relationship will not work. It's very hard to have a relationship with someone who does not have the same set of core values as you do, even harder to have a marriage.

I am a very conservative evangelical christian. Raised that way from the womb to the tomb. There was a man at work, who would try to entire me, which in today's standards, would be seen as romantic, flirtatious, seductive, but not in my moral realm. He of course could not see that. He took every attempt to touch me. I bet some other woman would consider that sexy, I was offended. I told him my views on premarital sex, and the temptations touching brings. He did not see anything wrong with what he was doing. And in today's society, he's just wooing me. It bothered me so much I could not stay there.

It became very obvious, that although he is a good natured, hardworking man, which is hard to come by, that we are not of the same mind when it comes to morals and spiritual matters. That is not the kind of person I would want to enter int a marriage relationship with. Later down the line, there would be other things that will cause conflict (whole wars were started over religious differences, imagine what would happen in a marriage). Not when my views make up the core of what I am.

Better for her to know now than later.

 

[DogCatMom]

Not a mother (sob...), but an aunt of five (talked about sex to the two now-in-their-20s nephews) and a former teacher of middle- and high schoolers.

His request that Dayna's daughter sign a "promise card" seems to be a situation tailor-made for a discussion on "what kind of dating relationship do we have, anyway?" He may be asking Daughter for the card because *his* parents want him to, which could indicate that he's amenable to adult guidance rather than being a control freak. He may be asking because it's something the youth group at his church recommends / suggests / mandates. He may be asking Daughter for the card because he doesn't trust himself. etc.

Perhaps a non-threatening discussion between the two young people, beginning with "Why is this important to you?" would shed a lot of light.

 

[dayna]

I didn't mean to turn this into a religious debate.

My daughter is more than capable of being responsible for her actions regardless of a piece of paper.

Pressuring her for sex would not be okay, and she'd never have a boyfriend that did that. She's broken up with boys for much lighter offenses (she broke up with a boy because he skipped school) !

 

[skysthelimit]

I didn't mean to turn this into a religious debate.

!

Not at all. I don't debate, just trying to explain what this purity card, and the idea behind it, means to this young man, and those that subscribe to it.

You have every right to be concerned.

This is something very important to all of the people involved, and something that needs to be examined before the relationship becomes serious.


But the same way you were offended, I imagine his parents might be offended as well.

Sometimes we jump on the bandwagon of "someone is being too strict" and we fail to see that there is someone on the flip side, making the same decisions about us.

 

[Zass]

I agree with sky that fundamental differences in moral values would make holding a long term relationship tough.
As they are both pretty young, those differences might not have had much of an impact up to this point, but are likely to become more evident as the years pass.

Heavy stuff, and a difficult position for your daughter to be in. (Coincidentally re-enforcing my belief that my own daughter won't need a boyfriend at all until she's older )

On another note, religion plays no role at all in my parenting, and I care not a bit about what is "normal" for teens to do. Because like I said, what is right for others isn't always going to be what is right for me and mine anyway. (this probably goes back to not trusting others I think, but I try my hardest to make all my own choices based on what I FEEL is best)

 

[paradox]

It is likely his church or youth group recently went through one of the programs that talks to teens about abstinence. There are several different programs like this and every youth group I have worked in has done one. Some of the kids wear rings, necklaces, or bracelets, to show they promise to not have sex before marriage. I haven't seen the cards but I am sure it is in the same vein. It is pretty much the same as the teens who sign the contract with their parents saying they will not drink and drive.