Do you try to control competition in your area?

[Northwinds Rabbitry]

I am actually hoping someone else will start close bye me cause there is literally no body here (ok that's a lie cause there are but they don't have what I breed or whatever) there are about 7 breeders 1-3hrs away from me lol so I would totally want more breeders here so we can have ARBA SHOWS AAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!

 

[DogCatMom]

I've trimmed nails on three rabbits (a mixed-breed something about ten years ago, a French Angora in July, and Parsley the AmChin). All three had nails slightly different in shape from one another.

--Parsley's are fairly straight and somewhat narrow, but when the rescue contact trimmed them the day I brought him home, they had started to curve.
--The French Angora male in July had straight nails, fairly narrow.
--The mixed-breed something, the pet of my former neighbor's daughter, had very cat-like nails: fairly thick and with a slight curve.

Have I just experienced an odd mix of rabbits? I was thinking that, if ELops' nails are more like the neighbor's pet or even Parsley's, the SoftPaws might work. But the French Angora-type nails from July, nope, no way.

 

[Honorine]

Different breeds do have have different types of nails, Mini Rex have very sharp razor blade type nails, can cut you to bits with very little effort.

I would never try to control the competition just to try and make a buck, you could be shooting yourself in the foot because you may end up with rabbits no one wants. Had that problem with many of my rare breeds, only certain people wanted them, I've actually sold Silvers and Lilacs to pet shops for lack of a market. Took a bunch of pretty nice Lilac, Silver and Creme Jrs up to the Mini Convention in NY one year. Hardly any sales, people just weren't into them. E-Lops are a niche breed, folks have to be into them, they are big, need a lot of care, and eat a lot, not a breed I'd pick as a money maker. I had a pet E-Lop a few years ago, she was a lovely thing, kept her in a wood bottomed 3x5 Flemish cage. She was like a puppy, she'd run and bounce off the walls, shredding her ears. Ate as much as a Flemish, smaller rabbit.

 

[skysthelimit]

It does make it really interesting. I don't believe there is a such thing as an unrelated pair of Rex in Ohio, as we all share the same bloodlines.

 

[SatinsRule]

What is actually going to make or break you is your knowledge of the breed and the success you've enjoyed with them.

And FWIW, the "corner the market" strategy as it pertains to any certain breed will backfire on you. Eventually, potential and past buyers will meet and realize that they can go outside their comfort zones to find better stock than what you're pushing, and whether you want competition or not, it will be there with all guns blazing. You'll be saddled with the reputation that you sell junk rabbits that you wouldn't otherwise keep, and that rep will drive you from the rabbit business.

 

[ckcs]

I don't think you guys have the same crappy type of market that we have here in VA.
People get the same breeds you got from far away States, they breed willy nilly and sell for cheap.
Very few people want to spend money and worry about quality. They just want the new breed or w/e breed for as cheap as possible.
SF are now $35 for blacks! Last year they were $50, even blue and chocolate which were $80 are now being sold at $50! No one can compete with this, they are dropping prices to sell fast and could care less about quality or even breeding for their own meat.
VA is full of people who breed for $$$$, everything else gets tossed to the wayside. It's disgusting, pathetic and impossible to compete with.

It's why there's no point in me getting NZR, Rex, anything at all. There's now some cruddy NZR for dirt cheap, bad color, small parents, small and slow growing kits for sale in a couple places.

Now, don't get me wrong, there are some wonderful people here that do care and have great animals of quality that are trying not to drop prices or don't even bother selling to people who want a cheap rabbit. I'm no longer actively trying to sell mine, either. Not worth the hassle of dealing with cheapscapes.

I agree with only selling one gender, keep all the does [or bucks] for a year, two years, before you start allowing the market to have them. Force them to drive the distance for quality.

BTW, ckcs, you're Lionheads have amazing personalities! Beats most of the ones I keep seeing and running into. They aren't shy or aggressive, they are bold and still very friendly.

Thank you for the kind words about the rabbits. Since I know nothing about showing, I focus on what I do know and that is loving them from day one. You are absolutely right about the SF, I see breeder in VA Beach area blowing them out for $10-20. This area is dominated by cheap rabbits and lots of mutts.

__________ Sun Oct 27, 2013 9:48 pm __________

English Lops are a niche market, they aren't popular for a reason

The ears are a royal PITA and completely impractical. Their large size is also a minus as they eat more, poop more and need bigger cages.

I wouldn't worry too much about competition but yeah, only sell the bucks and keep/cull the does.

I'm gathering you are right about the niche market. Might be why I never see them. I absolutely adore them and thought others would as well.

I suppose I'll keep the same model I have with elops or vlops that I do with lionheads. I manage to do ok even with a lot of Lionhead breeders around me. I breed for looks and personality. I do plan to show the lops if I get them so I will keep that in mind when I buy my stock. However they better look nice to me and be nice as well I'll still have a 4-6 month jump on others.

 

[SatinsRule]

English Lops are a niche market, they aren't popular for a reason

The ears are a royal PITA and completely impractical. Their large size is also a minus as they eat more, poop more and need bigger cages.

I wouldn't worry too much about competition but yeah, only sell the bucks and keep/cull the does.

I'm gathering you are right about the niche market. Might be why I never see them. I absolutely adore them and thought others would as well.

I suppose I'll keep the same model I have with elops or vlops that I do with lionheads. I manage to do ok even with a lot of Lionhead breeders around me. I breed for looks and personality. I do plan to show the lops if I get them so I will keep that in mind when I buy my stock. However they better look nice to me and be nice as well I'll still have a 4-6 month jump on others.

Yeah, he had a really good point. Small breeds are all the rage nowadays. Breeds like Holland Lops, Jersey Woolies, and Mini Rex are extremely popular for generating quick sales for pets, and of course, there are plenty of sellers to go along with the numbers of buyers.

 

[PSFAngoras]

I very much tried to control the competition at first, it then I realized that most of the people around me here try to breed for fun, and aren't really interested in the quality of what they're breeding. Also, they will probably sell them for less too. What that means is that I have people to refer customers to when they are simply looking for a fiber or pet angora, while I can focus on show quality and get what I want for them from the people who are serious about it. Its a win win really, since I usually won't sell pets. Also, it does give me a small local community of other rabbit enthusiests that I can socialize with and we can troubleshoot and talk about things. It does make it more fun.

Also, the breeders I get my stock from (anywhere from 3-5 hours away) are very fun to talk to and trade with, so I can always find some friendly competition and constructive criticism there, when I feel like I'm ready to show.

 

[Peach]

What is actually going to make or break you is your knowledge of the breed and the success you've enjoyed with them.

And FWIW, the "corner the market" strategy as it pertains to any certain breed will backfire on you. Eventually, potential and past buyers will meet and realize that they can go outside their comfort zones to find better stock than what you're pushing, and whether you want competition or not, it will be there with all guns blazing. You'll be saddled with the reputation that you sell junk rabbits that you wouldn't otherwise keep, and that rep will drive you from the rabbit business.

:goodpost:

I see a lot of people around us selling crappy bred animals as "pedigreed". Be careful what you stamp your name on, it can come back to haunt you!

 

[Millinex]

Depends on the competition. Some competition is good... It allows me rabbits from sources other than myself, for costs cheaper than I would spend to produce them, without taking up my space.. I can't keep up with my demand in most cases, for pets, breeders, meat rabbits, snake food... So I sell below pet store costs, below everyone else's feeder costs, and establish a great customer base.

My people usually won't go anywhere else, so the competition can't sell off as many, so I step in and offer all competition to buy up all their rabbits for cheap to save the hassle, then I turn around and resell and make a profit, works great.

I don't want to run out my competition.. even if I end up being able to make more per rabbit, I still have to end up housing more and spending more time to keep up with demand than if I did it this way

 

[CochinBrahmaLover]

They wouldn't fit properly on a rabbit as the shape is completely different, and much smaller.

The glue was my moms idea, we used nail glue for press on nails, I'm not sure if the stuff is still available now a days

Actually, they can:
http://www.softpaws.com/faqs.html#question16
But they use the soft paws for dogs.
Sorry, just wanted to add in case this can help someone ^^

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

You should be wanting MORE competition in the area not less. I highly suggest you rethink if you are wanting to do show rabbits, while some do follow that practice I can't see how its ethical OR helping promote and better the breed. I have had EL in the past, wonderful breed, BUT they do require a good bit of care and can definitely be a PITA. It is better to have 50 EL breeders near you, competing at shows, rather than 0. You can't get legs, you can't add stock easily, it just doesn't work. To get started, some thing decent is going to run you for a pair of over 400. If you had breeders nearby, wouldn't be so bad. Been there done that. They should be approached just as the others, breed and work with only the best you can afford and keep/breed only the best from your litters. Sell some for pets that aren't close to the SOP, sell some that are to the SOP for broods, or eat the ones you don't want or can't to sell.

I kinda feel the same way. The BEST breeders I've met have been excited to see their rabbits go to someone who really wants them...especially the Champagne people, as it's SUCH an uncommon breed there's rarely enough rabbits to get legs.

As a buyer, if I knew someone was purposely trying to deter others from breeding/showing...I wouldn't buy from them. Not to say a breeder is forced to fork over their best rabbits, lol. But still. That smacks of putting their own desire to win over the desire to promote and further the breed. :|

Hey, for what it's worth, I have a trio of velveteens, paid 450 to import them, then found out someone 45 mins away imported them from the same person as me .

I had the sr doe bred before she was sent, and of the 2 kits I had for sale, the other new breeder bought one and found a buyer for the other. She's also offered to let me use one of her bucks to cover my doe(my buck isn't ready to breed yet) in exchange for one of the kits, and asked that I show her any sales rabbits before I post them for sale, as she might want them.

Close competition can be a great thing!

See, I think that's how it should be, LOL!!! I just got an email from one breeder I got some rabbits from, asking if I still have one of the rabbits she sold me. I sure do! She's excited to see what I have to put on the show table next spring, because a bunch of that buck's kits just won a LOT for her. She's HAPPY that she may have more competition next year!!!

Yea, that's why you should get the breed you want, not get the breed you think you can make money off of. Because 99% of the time, you're not going to make money at it. Grumpy is probably the only person on here who makes a modest profit and he has a bunch of rabbits a big setup and a common breed.

THAT. In a nutshell.

Plus...if someone buys rabbits from you...breeds them...and beats your rabbits on the table.......................be EXCITED, because it speaks well for your lines!!!

Wow. Does anyone know whether "Soft Paws" (originally developed for use on cats) work on rabbits, esp. English Lops? I've never used these on my cats, but I make sure to trim kitty nails every weekend.

Plus my own experience with kitty nail caps (soft paws brand and others) is that their use and success highly depends on the animal in question. For example, with Ember, I don't even have to glue them on...I just stick 'em on and she's good to go, it'll be days before she loses one! She just doesn't worry at them. Yvaine on the other hand...she wears hers, glued on, for about an hour before they are ALL off, she hooks a tooth under them and tears them (and sometimes her claw too!) clean off!!!!

I bet a rabbit would worry and fuss over it and "groom" them off in no time.

What is actually going to make or break you is your knowledge of the breed and the success you've enjoyed with them.

And FWIW, the "corner the market" strategy as it pertains to any certain breed will backfire on you. Eventually, potential and past buyers will meet and realize that they can go outside their comfort zones to find better stock than what you're pushing, and whether you want competition or not, it will be there with all guns blazing. You'll be saddled with the reputation that you sell junk rabbits that you wouldn't otherwise keep, and that rep will drive you from the rabbit business.

Like I said, if I knew someone was trying to keep a monopoly on the breed...I wouldn't buy from them, and I'd be very unwilling to associate. It smacks of sourness to me.

Thank you for the kind words about the rabbits. Since I know nothing about showing, I focus on what I do know and that is loving them from day one. You are absolutely right about the SF, I see breeder in VA Beach area blowing them out for $10-20. This area is dominated by cheap rabbits and lots of mutts.

Around here, Mini Rex sell for next to nothing...and sometimes are given away free. I don't want those, though...I want show-quality and am willing to pay for it. If people are buying the $10 SF, they will be disappointed. It will make the QUALITY ones so much the better a find...plus if there's el cheap-o rabbits all around, you KNOW people want your rabbits when they are willing to pay what they are worth.

They wouldn't fit properly on a rabbit as the shape is completely different, and much smaller.

The glue was my moms idea, we used nail glue for press on nails, I'm not sure if the stuff is still available now a days

Actually, they can:
http://www.softpaws.com/faqs.html#question16
But they use the soft paws for dogs.
Sorry, just wanted to add in case this can help someone ^^

You know, it says that...and I can find NO pictures ANYWHERE of a rabbit wearing them. I'll remain skeptical.

 

[SatinsRule]

What is actually going to make or break you is your knowledge of the breed and the success you've enjoyed with them.

And FWIW, the "corner the market" strategy as it pertains to any certain breed will backfire on you. Eventually, potential and past buyers will meet and realize that they can go outside their comfort zones to find better stock than what you're pushing, and whether you want competition or not, it will be there with all guns blazing. You'll be saddled with the reputation that you sell junk rabbits that you wouldn't otherwise keep, and that rep will drive you from the rabbit business.

Like I said, if I knew someone was trying to keep a monopoly on the breed...I wouldn't buy from them, and I'd be very unwilling to associate. It smacks of sourness to me.

True enough, Kyle. Sourness is one of several tags the breeder in question would be stuck with. A breeder who is not promoting the breed they're peddling is pretty much indicating that they will do anything to make a buck. Like most on here who have done this for any extended length of time, breeders who think they have control over their competition usually find themselves on the outside looking in.

I've repeatedly brought in different varieties of satins from breeders who are located outside the state of AR and delivered them to people who reside here free of charge. If I were afraid of breed competition or didn't want this breed promoted, I'd never do such a thing.