Color of chestnuts at birth?

[fhjmom]

What color are chestnut kits when they are born? Our chestnut doe, bred to a black buck, had a litter of three babies that are very dark with light tummies. I know the highest percentage of possibility with that mating is chestnut kits, but otters are also possible, although with a much lower chance. This is not her first litter, but the first litter she has had with us, and I don't know the colors of her previous litters, except one daughter that we also have (who is also a chestnut), so I don't know much about what she carries opposite the dominate agouti genes.

Just wondering what the babies could possibly be with dark coloring and light tummies.

 

[Dood]

Yes, chestnuts are born dark with light bellies.

Every day they get a bit more brown showing up.

 

[akane]

You know your rabbits carry otter? Agouti and otter colors are both born with dark backs and pink bellies. The agoutis will get ticking as they grow and the otters will not. Black agoutis will be your chestnuts that get brown and if otter is possible they will be black but with the markings of an agouti. Someone would need a tan gene and the other a tan or self gene to make otters.

 

[fhjmom]

Yes, chestnuts are born dark with light bellies.

Every day they get a bit more brown showing up.

Thanks! That is what I thought, but haven't seen any pics of newborn chestnuts. I am fairly certain these are all chestnuts, then. They are only two days old. <br /><br /> __________ Thu Jun 26, 2014 2:57 pm __________ <br /><br />

You know your rabbits carry otter? Agouti and otter colors are both born with dark backs and pink bellies. The agoutis will get ticking as they grow and the otters will not. Black agoutis will be your chestnuts that get brown and if otter is possible they will be black but with the markings of an agouti. Someone would need a tan gene and the other a tan or self gene to make otters.

I know the buck does not carry the tan (at) allele, since he is a self. The doe has an otter in her pedigree a couple of generations back that may have passed along the at allele but all the rabbits in between are agouti so it would be covered by the dominant A allele. So it is possible the doe carries tan (at) but not likely.

I am sorry if I missed it but I don't understand the part where you said, "if otter is possible they will be black but with the markings of an agouti." I thought otter and agouti were mutually exclusive?

Thanks for the response!

Tamara

 

[akane]

The tan gene is kind of between a self and an agouti. The body is solid without agouti ticking but the white around the neck, inside the ears, under the tail, and the light belly are still there. This is a sable marten instead of an otter but see the white

The white is more of a tan color on black otters.

 

[ek.blair]

Not the best of angle, but this is what my chestnuts looked like at 2 days old... can't really see the belly, but it is pink as well as the inside of the ears and the little bit toward the inside of their feet. Also you can just begin to see the brown at the nape of the neck here at 2 days.

 

[ladysown]

Here's a link to a litter from a Chestnut doe who had a chestnut kit. http://athomepets.weebly.com/at-home-pe ... olland-lop Perhaps it might be of some use to you.

 

[fhjmom]

Here is a pic of the kits in question at three days old. The second pic, while not a great shot, shows the light color on the belly. Thanks for all the comments. I do think they are most likely chestnuts, as you can already see some of the agouti coloring showing up on two of their heads.

__________ Fri Jun 27, 2014 6:32 pm __________

The tan gene is kind of between a self and an agouti. The body is solid without agouti ticking but the white around the neck, inside the ears, under the tail, and the light belly are still there. This is a sable marten instead of an otter but see the white


Ah, I see what you are saying now. I had never really thought about otters being "in between" self and agouti, but rather I think of them as just three distinct expressions of the tan gene. Your explanation does make sense now though. I do know what the otters look like as adults (we have two black otters and two blue otters, plus two litters from the blue otter mommas that are all otters, too, we think) as well as the genetics involved to get them; I just wasn't sure what they looked like as newborn kits. Thanks for the clarification though.

__________ Fri Jun 27, 2014 6:34 pm __________

Not the best of angle, but this is what my chestnuts looked like at 2 days old... can't really see the belly, but it is pink as well as the inside of the ears and the little bit toward the inside of their feet. Also you can just begin to see the brown at the nape of the neck here at 2 days.

Yep, that's what they look like! Thanks for posting a pic!

__________ Fri Jun 27, 2014 6:41 pm __________

Here's a link to a litter from a Chestnut doe who had a chestnut kit. http://athomepets.weebly.com/at-home-pe ... olland-lop Perhaps it might be of some use to you.

Ladysown, I love how you did the "Watch me grow" slide show. I may have to borrow that idea! Yes, seeing the progression of colors did help! Thank you!

 

[ladysown]

thank you.

The blind kit in the litter bugged the snot out of me, ended up rehoming the mom to a pet only home as another kit had bad nestbox eye (blind kit did not) so I figured something was "off" in her genetics.

The kits look to be chestnuts to me.

 

[fhjmom]

Another couple of days have passed and I am sure that two are chestnuts as more agouti coloring has shown up with each passing day, but the little kit in the middle is still very black with a light belly. He is looking more like an black otter. I guess time will tell for sure.

 

[skysthelimit]

somewhere I have some picts posted on the agouti/otter side by side, day 1-3. by day three, I can tell who is who, but not before then.