another stupid question, lol

[tracie123]

ok with breeding broken nz, do you breed the broken to another broken to get alot of broken kits or do you breed brokens to solids? I have blk and white brokens 2 does and 1 buck. Have 3blk nz & 1 white nz does, also have a blk buck and white buck if this helps.
Tracie

 

[caroline]

Broken is dominant, if they carry the gene they will show it.
If you breed broken to broken you will get [on average]
1/2 broken EnEen
1/4 solid enen
and 1/4 charlie EnEn

if you breed broken to solid you will get
1/2 broken
1/2 solid

the charlie kits are not recognized in any breed that I know of

The only advantage to breeding broken to broken is that you may get more varied pattern because of some of the modifier genes [that I don't know a lot about yet]

If you have a charlie & breed it to a solid you will get ALL broken, no charlie or solid.

 

[tracie123]

What is charlie? I dont have a clue on all this breeding or even the gens or how even how all this works. :shock:
Tracie

 

[Secuono]

I guess the Charlie should be recognized, then, if it makes all broken! At least as a useful breeder for more brokens, eh?
=D


I also have no idea what a Charlie is, I keep seeing/reading about it, but haven't really gotten it yet..lol.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Charlies are usually very lightly marked brokens- they may have the nose spots (which look like a Charlie Chaplin mustache), ear color, and very little spotting. But- I have been reading up on them, and some Charlies have more color than others depending on the modifiers at work, so can look like a lightly marked broken.

A true Charlie comes only from a broken to broken breeding- a "False Charlie" is a very lightly marked broken coming from a solid to broken breeding. It may look like a charlie, but it cannot be one because it got one solid color gene from the solid parent.

A true Charlie will only have broken colored kits, so if you breed your alleged charlie (from a broken to broken breeding) and find a solid kit, it is a false charlie.

 

[ottersatin]

The Charlie got the nomenclature
after "Charlie Chaplain.
He was a Comedian actor
with a small mustache.
Most charlies have little color markings with a tiny
mustache a normal part of that.
Ottersatin. ldtimer:

 

[tracie123]

Ok if I have read this correct this is what i get??
Parent 1 parent 2
Solid solid 100% solids
Solid broken 50% solids& 50% brokens
Solid charlie 100% brokens
Broken broken 25% solids 50% brokens 25%charlies
Broken charlies 50% brokens 50% charlies
Charlie charlie 100% charlies so dont do this!!!
Is this correct??

 

[Bill]

The percentages are actually that each offspring has that percentage of being that, not that the litter would be split evenly. For example if you breed a broken to a broken each kit would have a 25% chance of being solid, a 50% chance of being broken and a 25% chance of being a charlie. If you have a litter of 4 you could possibly get 1 solid, 2 broken, and 1 charlie, or 4 solids or brokens or charlies, or any of a limitless combination.

 

[tracie123]

This is sooooooo confusion, I just want to breed and get brokens for my daughter to have a meat pen for ag. project :x :? :shock:<br /><br />__________ Wed Aug 22, 2012 12:01 pm __________<br /><br />I will just have to play with this I guess, lol and just see what happens.

 

[Miss M]

Ok if I have read this correct this is what i get??
Parent 1 parent 2
Solid solid 100% solids
Solid broken 50% solids& 50% brokens
Solid charlie 100% brokens
Broken broken 25% solids 50% brokens 25%charlies
Broken charlies 50% brokens 50% charlies
Charlie charlie 100% charlies so dont do this!!!
Is this correct??

Those are your probabilities. As Bill said, what would actually happen could be quite different. It all depends on what genes are in the eggs and sperm that meet up.

You breed a broken to a broken, you could end up with all solids, all brokens, or all charlies. But it's very unlikely. Chances are, half or so of them will be brokens, with a charlie or two and a solid or two. The percentages will vary a bit, but that's probably what you will get.

 

[caroline]

I also have no idea what a Charlie is, I keep seeing/reading about it, but haven't really gotten it yet..lol.

here are some pix

 

[Miss M]

If I remember right, a Charlie is a broken with no more than 10% color. Often the majority of the color will be on the eyes, nose, and ears. They tend to have terminal birth defects at a greater frequency than non-Charlies.

 

[tracie123]

These picture are they of a charlie,?

 

[caroline]

yes

 

[countryhorse]

I also have no idea what a Charlie is, I keep seeing/reading about it, but haven't really gotten it yet..lol.

here are some pix
View attachment 1View attachment 2

Hi
The one in the box standing uP look like the only Charlie there, the blue one and black one looks like it may have at least 10% color so it would just be a lightly patterned broken.
We have charlies and never had have any terminally ill problems ever...or any problems of any kind with them. Genetic etc.
So not sure I believe that post above as we have never had anything to substatiate that.

 

[akane]

Problem is you can have a genetic charlie (2 broken genes) with more than 10% color and you can have a broken (only one gene) with less than 10% color. I've gotten plenty of brokens from one line who only have the back stripe and dark ears without a butterfly or even eye markings. I know they are not genetically charlies.

 

[Miss M]

We have charlies and never had have any terminally ill problems ever...or any problems of any kind with them. Genetic etc.
So not sure I believe that post above as we have never had anything to substatiate that.

I was merely stating what has been stated quite a few times here, which has been out the experience of others. That they have a tendency to have birth defects at a higher rate does not mean you as a particular breeder would ever see such defects.

 

[akane]

Even those without birth defects are known to have intestinal problems or sensitivities and benefit from a diet with extra fiber such as unlimited hay instead of just pellets.

 

[skysthelimit]

They pretty much say that in the book you get with an ARBA membership. Not that I believe everything I read, but if the ARBA books says it, I assume that there must be something to it. There is supposedly something in the spotting gene, not just in rabbits (think piebald) that causes immune issues.

I breed broken to broken frequently. A charlie would have to be very nice for me to keep it, so far I have not kept any.

 

[akane]

Spotting is actually lethal in a lot if not most mammals who develop the gene. Gerbils reabsorb offspring with 2 spotting genes, frame overo (a certain pattern of spotting) in horses results in a foal without functioning intestines that dies within a few days.... Spotting and dilution type genes tend to always come with health problems whether they are very minor and only rarely noticed or major and results in half the offspring guaranteed to die.