Woohoo My Velveteen Lops have arrived

[ckcs]

I went to the Richmond Show today in Aylett, VA. I was hoping to score an English Lop Doe to pair with my buck. Only one I found for sale was $200. As I do not currently show, there is no way I'm laying down $200 for a rabbit. I did however find a very nice lady from New Jersey who had some VLOPs for sale. I couldn't afford a trio so bought a pedigreed pair for $80.

The buck (Chuckie) is an Orange, he has Blk Tort, Fawn, Opal, Chestnut, Tri, Blue and Orange in his tree.

The doe (Angelica) is a Black Tort (???), she has tort (chocolate and black), fawn, tri and Harlequin in her tree.

They are 10-11 weeks old. Most of the rabbits in the tree are 6-6.1 lbs with 15"-16" ears. I couldn't pose them but here are the pictures. I had the doe looking nice until I grabbed the camera. I also ran into a great couple that have gotten rabbits from me before that are going to take 4-5 of my adults (lionheads and 2 mix breeds) to give me more space.

 

[Zass]

Cute, especially that buck!
I hope they are just as sweet for you as mine have always been. <3

 

[WhWRabbitry]

Congratulations! Velveteen Lops caught my eye recently online (I was not familiar with them). I think they are beautiful!

 

[JenerationX]

Congrats! I like seeing the unposed pic... it gives me an idea of what those ears are actually like when they're not laid out on the ground. I like the length on your buck... long enough to add character but not in danger of stepping on them.

Are English Lops usually so much more expensive? $200 seems pretty steep for a rabbit.

 

[Zass]

I spotted a velveteen doe for $200 available locally. I think breeders are asking higher prices for animals that are going to conform to the new standard.

 

[JenerationX]

I spotted a velveteen doe for $200 available locally. I think breeders are asking higher prices for animals that are going to conform to the new standard.

Is this the new standard or the old one? http://www.vlrca.com/standard.html

 

[Zass]

I spotted a velveteen doe for $200 available locally. I think breeders are asking higher prices for animals that are going to conform to the new standard.

Is this the new standard or the old one? http://www.vlrca.com/standard.html

It's the new one. I see I was wrong when I told Bad Habit about one thing, I believe the sr weight of bucks was only 6 lbs in the previous standard. It was raised, but just a bit.

__________ Sun Dec 07, 2014 6:00 am __________

I like the ear placement on the buck more as well, but the overall trend of the breed is moving towards longer, wider, thinner, and lower placed ears like the doe has. That bald or very thin furred patch on the back of her ear is a bit worrysome. It is something that has become a problem recently in the longer eared ones.

 

[Bad Habit]

Weight didn't change, max was always 6.5lbs

I wouldn't trust a pedigree that has all the rabbits so perfectly in weight. Somehow, both of my does(who were 8lbs+) had pedigrees that had nothing over 6.5lbs on their pedigrees.

They're cute, though. The breed's not going where I thought it would, and it will be a long time before the rabbits are being produced consistently. I worry that the COD was pushed through too quickly, and that presentation is going to fail because of the consistency issues. I would have thought they'd raise the weight(which was what the COD holder told me when I got my rabbits from her and asked about their weights),

 

[ilovehome]

Show quality elops are usually between $100 and $200. Non show are usually $50-100. I'm surprised by the velveteen for $200. They are not consistent enough for that price imho. I paid $30-60 each for the vlops I recently purchased. I like the longer ears. I think they need them to balance with the long mandolin bodies. I heard at convention that the maximum weight would be lowered to 6 lbs, so I was surprised when that was not put in the new standard. I don't know if this is true, but I heard the COD holder did not want the longer ears right now, but the committee did. I think it is going to be hard to get them passed in the next four years.

 

[JenerationX]

It's been interesting to become aware of a breed while it's still so new and in progress of getting passed (or whatever the terminology is).

As far as ear length... I don't really know what 14 vs 15 vs 16 inches looks like on an unposed rabbit. I don't really care what the ruler says. My concern would be whether or not I could have a house pet and not have to worry about ear damage.

 

[ilovehome]

I bet there will be some reasonably priced nice vlops with 13-14 in ears that will be on the market the next year. lol

 

[Zass]

There are many who do not raise velveteens for the purpose of owning another exhibition breed.
They really are delightful pets. Very affectionate, and friendly.

I'm sure that the division between breeding for show and breeding for pets has gone a long way towards the inconsistency seen in the breed and the amount of time it will take to get them passed. They have had two passes before, and numerous changes in the breed standard. I think their original ideal weight was something like 4.5 lbs?

I don't believe that the smaller size has been working well with the mandolin body, which is traditionally found in very large breeds.

I'll have shorter eared, pet quality velveteens in a few months if anyone is interested. It will be at pet prices.

 

[ckcs]

Weight didn't change, max was always 6.5lbs

I wouldn't trust a pedigree that has all the rabbits so perfectly in weight. Somehow, both of my does(who were 8lbs+) had pedigrees that had nothing over 6.5lbs on their pedigrees.

They are not all in the 6lb range. Out of the 14 rabbits on the pedigree I think 7 are real close to 6. A couple are under 6 and at least 2 are over 7

__________ Sun Dec 07, 2014 10:28 pm __________

Are English Lops usually so much more expensive? $200 seems pretty steep for a rabbit.

Some are asking a fortune for them. Not sure how often they get it though. I've only seen English Lops 2 times around here in the past 4 years. 2nd time I bought my buck. I've never seen a Vlop before for sale until the other day. I just cruise craiglist, some breeder pages and tractor supply swaps though <br /><br /> __________ Sun Dec 07, 2014 10:32 pm __________ <br /><br />

There are many who do not raise velveteens for the purpose of owning another exhibition breed.
They really are delightful pets. Very affectionate, and friendly.

They sure do. Mine are by far the cleanest rabbits in my heard. They are forever grooming themselves and each other. Their tails are adorable.

 

[Dood]

don't believe that the smaller size has been working well with the mandolin body, which is traditionally found in very large breeds.

I disagree - I have a tiny 3 pound mix breed (1/2 Mini Lop & 1/4LionHead 1/4 ND) who has a terrific mandolin shape she also has a very streamlined and dainty head, her mother even more so and I have seen quite a few small mutts with a similar body shape

I personally think the developer did not want the breed to become too popular in the pet trade or too easy for unscrupulous breeders to produce and so the SOP was changed so Velveteens would more closely resemble ELops :shrug:

 

[Zass]

Never mind with making my response public. I'll send a PM...

 

[JenerationX]

It could be a year before I'm ready... but I'll definitely be looking for pet temperament above all else when I am ready.

 

[Dood]

I had an ELop as a kid and the temperament is very unique and like no other breed Ive ever had experience with BUT those ears are a disaster

Our pet doe spent most of her life with tape attached to her ears to prevent rips and blood splattering around the house.

My dad made a terrific outdoor hutch for her with an insulated house area for her to keep warm in but she was moved into the basement the first winter because of frost bite on her ears and it wasn't even that cold yet - barely below freezing.

She never ran for more than a few steps and was affraid to do binkys as she would often trample an ear in the landing

I am very disappointed that the SOP has turned the Velveteen into a slightly smaller rex coated ELop which, IMHO, is one of the most extreme perversions in domesticated animals and an "exhibition only" breed.

Perhaps those who desired a smaller velveteen with more manageable ears will cross bred into the Plush Lops and the general public can experience the amazing ELop temperament with a less high maintainance body, or a Dwarf Velveteen could be developed with shorter ears :shrug:

 

[Zass]

I'm sure the US will get it's pet sized rexed lop by and by.

For most breeders temper is hit or miss, and I'm no exception.
Mary Crawford was the breeder who worked so hard to get that english lop temperament to present itself in velveteen lops, and that was back when they didn't look anything like english lops!
I've love to have a conversation with her about it.
I know that if I breed two velveteens together, I get really nice rabbits.
Without a really good understanding on temperament, out crossing runs the risk of losing it altogether.

My current goal is to just select for smaller bunnies with better rex coats, well furred ears, and good foot fur. (and root out astrex) I have no idea if Lorri Stillo is going to get her three passes, or if the standard will change again. I'm not sure how other breeders have weathered the standard changes over the years.

I know a lot of people are in-and-out of the breed rather quickly. And....one thing I've noticed is that most long term velveteen lop breeders around here also raise english lops.

__________ Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:18 pm __________

Dood, my oversized velveteen buck steps on his ears too. He won't run or binky, and walks in a weird slinking manner with his chin low to the ground. He has a little over 17 inch ears. I have yet to own a truly small velveteen with 15+ inch ears, so I don't know if they are more "balanced" in their movement.

I DO know that the velveteen forums are awash with people looking for 16 inch or longer ears to correct their shorter eared stock, because too long doesn't DQ, but too short will.

 

[ckcs]

So far I am really pleased with their temperament. Right now they don't look like a mini elop with rex fur. Course I'm comparing a large male Elop to 12 week old Vlops. When do you guys wait to try to breed the VLops?

 

[ilovehome]

I plan to breed my vlops when they are 6-8 months old. If they are like elops, it may take them a little longer to mature and some may need to wait until 8 months or so to breed the first time.