When to breed a doe??

[Zass]

I know this comes up often. But opinions change over time..and I wanted to hear everyone's current opinions.
I've seen a ton of people on another forum loudly declaring that commercial sized rabbits absolutely should not be bred under 8 months because they are still devloping until that age.

this same forum bans people for talking about feeding does bacon or any meat

I respect the members of this forum more than any other for their open minded view and willingness to hear outside opinions.

So, what is everyone's take on breeding age?

 

[dangerbunny]

With Hollands, I haven't had much luck with getting young does to take, I generally breed around 7/8 months with the Hollands, occasionally if a doe looks really ready around 6 months I will give her a go. I think there are wide variances in maturity though, even within a breed. I'd say go on an individual basis, if a doe looks and acts ready to breed and is in good health, she likely is mature enough.

 

[Dood]

I know this comes up often. But opinions change over time..and I wanted to hear everyone's current opinions.
I've seen a ton of people on another forum loudly declaring that commercial sized rabbits absolutely should not be bred under 8 months because they are still devloping until that age.

I agree that they are still growing but I don't understand what that has to do with not breeding does at 5 months old?

Do they think it will shorten the production life of the doe?

Compromise her ability to feed kits or get pregnant?

My oldest meat rabbit is 4 years old now, she had her first litter of 11 at 6.5 months and is still producing large litters and on schedule :shrug:

Considering most meat rabbits are rotated out of production by new and improved stock I don't see why you wouldn't

And one of my most disapointing does didn't have kits until 8 months and was a pain to get pregnant and consistently had small litters

 

[Zass]

That's what I'm trying to figure out, Dood, they mostly just compare it to young teen humans being pregnant.

I've begun to worry that waiting too long with pellet-fed does can lead to fatty brood stock. I was actually wondering if body fat could be a factor in poor-first-time-mother syndrome? I've seen others mention on here that their early-bred does are often their star mothers.

On the site that is saying wait until 8 months, they also say that it's perfectly normal for first time does to have one massive kit. (Something that has yet to occur in my herd, but I believe such occurrences are generally attributed to excess body fat.)

I've made a habit of breeding whenever my girls seem ready (and over 8 lbs.)
So far, possibly due to my own experience with troubleshooting,
I've yet to have a first time doe fail completely. They don't seem to do any better or worse then experienced does.

Of course, that wouldn't hold true for every breed, or every line, or even every style of feeding.

I was thinking specifically for pellet-fed commercial breeds.

 

[Dood]

Dood, they mostly compare it to young teen humans being pregnant.

What a ridiculous comparison !

So their worried they'll haemorrage out from trying to pass a huge headed baby? - I've never had stuck kits with my 5 month old meat breed does - actually I've only had stuck kits in older dwarf does who had small litters ! which is why I decided to only breed non dwarf Netherlands and problem solved !

Their optimal growth will be stunted ? Well maybe but who cares in a rabbit?

They'll be more prone to osteoporosis in old age ? LOL since they weight less than 12 pounds and walk on 4 feet instead of 2 it won't be debilitating even if they live that long!

 

[Marinea]

I have gone along with the "breed young for better results" thing. My NZ does are bred between 5 and 6 months. To date, I have not had one miss, no kindle on the wire, no lost litters. All litters have been between 9 and 13 kits. I have two does due in the next day or so, and we'll see if that trend continues.

 

[DBA]

We bred our Holland lop cross at about 6 months old. We bred her to a pet mini lop, she had a litter of 7 almost two weeks ago, in the morning when I found them one was away from the nest, cold and dead, but the other 6 are growing like weeds and she has been a wonderful mother.

 

[SA Farm]

I also tend to let the doe dictate when she's ready. I start checking around 5 months and usually breed either that month or by 6 months for my NZs. Same with my Mini Rex. I start checking them around 4 months and usually breed around 5. I've only had one Mini doe that wasn't ready until she was 6-7 months old, but she had a large litter to make up for it

 

[JessiL]

Same as many of you, I start checking them when around 4 months to 5 months old, and don't force the issue. But many of them are ready at that time, and almost always by 6 months old. They keep growing while nursing litters, nobody has problems making senior weight.

I had one precocious American who was rooming in a double-wide rabbit tractor with one of my herd bucks (cage is safely divided). However, about 3.5 weeks ago we had a horrendous wind storm, and most of my rabbit tractors actually blew open! I would have never guessed that was possible as the lids are full panels of pallet shelving wire decking, and weigh over 20 pounds or so each. Anyway, when I got home, I found the young doe over in the buck's side, and according to my neighbor, she'd had the opportunity to be there for over 3 hours.

She gets her nest box on Thursday. She'll be four months and three weeks old. While I would never purposefully breed a doe quite as young as she was when she "volunteered," she is continuing to grow like a weed even as her little belly poofs out.

 

[ottersatin]

I usually wait till they have reached at least 7 1/2 to 8 Lbs.
Close to senior weight. I do feel that many will not reach
senior weight if bred too soon.
As always, there are always exceptions to the rule.
If I feel the rabbit is ready, and I have the need and space for the litter
the rabbit may very well be bred. One must do what one must do after
accessing any given situation. If it works for you and your herd, it is RIGHT!
Ottersatin. ldtimer:

 

[Dood]

I agree if a person wants to wait that's their perogative and I can understand holding off on a show rabbit so they stay competitive and within the breeds weight range but I thought they were taking about production rabbits and I cannot think of any medical reasons not to breed a production doe early and quite a few reasons why you should

 

[MatSuAK]

Perfectly timed question I just asked the same one in the meat section. Hehehe thanks for all the info everyone!

 

[CochinBrahmaLover]

Granted my experience is limited, but we bred our Hollands at 5 months. Breeder told us to wait until 6, but they were big enough and I'm impatient.. no issues. Both does took.

Same breeder says to breed before a year too, otherwise they can't get pregnant. Well they can, but she has the hardest time to get a >year old doe getting pregnant (if they've never been bred before).

 

[Zinnia]

I'm glad you started this thread, Zass. I've wondered what others think, too.

I have been happy with checking for a good weight (7.5+ pounds) and ready vulva. I sort of shoot for 6 months, but have had two breed at 4.5 months (brother ).

I have not seen a compromise in health whatsoever in the does that bred young. I view it as I view my goats and sheep, etc. I have had more fertility problems with waiting too long vs going earlier.

 

[ladysown]

my rule of thumb is rabbits are rabbits regardless of breed or build. They all grow at about the same rate of speed with the larger breeds taking a bit longer to reach full size (but generally by the time they are 8 months old they are full size)... often even sooner.

So, being that rabbits are rabbits are rabbits.... if polish can be breed at four months, why can't a holland or a meat breed? If they are at 60% of their adult weight then breed them.

If you breed them early they don't get fat. Fat rabbits have trouble bearing live young well, so prevent them from getting fat.

Generally for my rabbits that means I start watching them carefully at four months for signs of readiness. I watch for their attitude to change from baby to adult. Once that changes (anywhere from 4-5.5. months) I breed them. Some take a bit longer, but you know what I've learned? If they don't breed young, you end up having all sort of issues.

EVERY SINGLE time I've given a doe time it's bitten me in the butt.
1. does that WON"T breed. (Culled)
2. does that turn nasty (current example in another thread..gave her a YEAR)
3. does that only bear dead young (sold recently into pet home)
4. does that are sterile (culled)

I currently only have one doe left that seems to be sterile. My hubby LOVES this doe. She is so full of personality and spunk and he says "we need a pet". "I" don't want a pet but I'm willing for his sake to work with this doe and see if it's just a genetic problem with one buck so letting another grow up. She breeds willingly and we've gotten her to "ACT" pregnant (to the point of making a nest and being watchful of it. So we are hoping to get that to actually turn into a litter.

So personally... breed 'em as soon as they act ready and just keep them working so they don't get fat. Fat does are just a pain to get into shape. Can be done, just a pain as it means fussing with 'em. I don't do fussing well.

 

[Susie570]

All this talk of 'breed them when they ACT ready', and 'when you see signs of readiness'?????
:shock:

Ok, call me stupid, but WHAT does this mean?

Does lifting when you pet them? That seems unlikely with skittish does who do the lump imitation when you pet them. Checking the vent? I saw a kit whose vent looked totally ready at about 2 months of age. There must be other signs I'm missing.

I'm asking because I have 3 young does coming up for their first breeding. Two are mini lops (not sure if the breed makes a difference). What signs of readiness should I watch for as they approach approximate breeding age (around 5 months??)

Thanks

 

[Zass]

When you offer her a treat, and her first impulse is to rub her chin on you instead of eating it...that's probably when she's ready.

 

[Susie570]

When you offer her a treat, and her first impulse is to rub her chin on you instead of eating it...that's probably when she's ready.

Interesting. I've been noticing that from the YOUNGEST doe, 'Sprinkles'. Strangely, it seems that this litter, from Scarlett (mini lop) and River (dutch) has reached sexual maturity VERY early.

The little buck had descended testicles and started spraying at just about 8 wks old. Sprinkles just turned 4 months old and she's been rubbing her chin on stuff for a while now. Whether or not these kits are actually capable of breeding or not, I don't know. She doesn't LOOK like a full grown rabbit. She will turn 5 months old on June 17th.

The other two does are just over 5 months old, but still in their 'isolation period'. :/

 

[ladysown]

it's hard to describe but a big part of it is knowing your animals.

A baby or young rabbit ACTS different then one who has reached maturity.

So that's one clue that "I" watch for...that change in behaviour.

Second I watch size/weight. Once they hit half of what i expect at maturity I watch behaviour and look to breed around 70% of expected mature weight.

What you do next depends on how hands on you are.
- checking vent, checking for rising with a hand rub, etc.
- going strictly by age
- watching weight and breeding by that marker

Me I watch behaviour.
The subtle signs... a young doe who is normally placid who is running around with her tail in the air. A young buck that runs and instead of going under my hand for a pet is aiming OVER my hand. A young doe that does a mini lunge. A doe that checks out what I am doing more carefully than normal and watches where I am going after I leave her cage.

These things show readiness in my herd.

You will have to learn how YOUR does show readiness. and then act upon it.

 

[Susie570]

The main personality change I've noticed lately, is that Sprinkles seems to want to dig ALL of her litter out of her litter box. :shock: :evil:

Bad girl!! :x

That's really annoying because she's been really good about using it until now. :/