What To Do About Weights On Pedigrees?!

[KKRabbitry]

I'm interested to hear opinions on pedigree weights.
I've always wondered what most people think of this, and after I saw this questions posted on a Facebook group last week, and no one seemed to agree, I'd like to hash it out a little more.
The question is, if you have a rabbit you need to get registered, and your missing weights on the pedigree, what do you do?

Some people said they just make something up...after all the rabbit must have been that weight at some point in their life, and they would just fill in something close to the breed ideal. If they really need to get that bunny registered they won't think twice about filling in fake weights on the whole pedigree.

Others were completely apalled that anyone would even consider this. To them it seemed like a completely immoral thing to do. They couldn't imagine how the unhonest people who dared fill in fake weights could sleep at night!
If your pedigree was missing weights, well to bad.......that rabbit would not be able to be registered even it got 20 legs.

Others seemed to fall somewhere in between, saying they wouldn't have any qualms about filling in maybe a 2 or 3 weights if that was all they needed, but filling in a whole pedigree that was lacking weights was going to far.
They would draw the line there.

So what's a self respecting rabbit breeder to do?
I have boughten dozens of rabbits from dozens of different people.
Some of them have every single weight filled in, others are missing just one or two weights, others don't have a single weight on the pedigree!

It can be very frusterating! :x I have a couple Jersey Woolies that are close to becoming GCs. They are both missing just one or two weights on their pedigree.
Of course, ideally you would be able to track them down, but that is not always possible.

I don't know why some breeders don't fill in weights.
Maybe they just don't know it's necessary, maybe they just forget, maybe they think you'll just make it up later, I don't know......

So you do you think it is acceptable to make up weights, or not?
What do most people do?

 

[Whipple]

I would just fill them in. Its weights, not color or breed. If its meat buns, then it is nice to know weights of relatives. But for show, meh. I only care about the one on the table.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Falsifying information on a pedigree is a BIG "no-no" in my book. If someone is willing to lie about weights, what is to keep them from lying about any other aspect on the pedigree?

You only need three generations of accurate history (with no DQ's) to register a rabbit. It is easy enough to raise two generations per year, so why compromise your integrity?

 

[Oceanrose]

It is especially frustrating when the rabbits missing weights have legs.. I blame computer programs for this a lot, I think people forget to enter a sr weight, adn if they don't register, they don't care.

 

[Demamma]

I sympathize for those with missing weights but feel it is wrong to falsify any information on a pedigree.

 

[rittert3]

With my pedigrees I get the feeling most of them were never actually weighed anyway and were falsified before I bought them, and the breeder I bought the most from is shade blind so alot of colors are wrong too. If there was a "6" or 2 missing I might fill them in but wouldn't make a habit of it and never on a rabbit that I had my own records on as I'm very meticulous about recording ever detail anyway. As far as meat vs. show I think the meat breed being shown (along with dwarfs and maybe giant breeds) are the most important when it comes to weight where breeds that are more or less just for exhibition and have a 2 lb weight range in the middle of the size spectrum, I don't think, would matter quite as much.<br /><br />__________ Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:25 am __________<br /><br />Also I've gotten some opinions from other breeders here about pedigree information. Rabbits, as individuals, fluctuate in weight quite a bit... how often are you supposed to weight them and change this? Also if the rabbits in the pedigrees get additional legs from when you receive the pedigree do you record them? what if they get legs and you aren't notified? I talked to one breeder that doesn't apply for legs and throws them in the trash... is that falsifying?

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

I personally could never fake weights on a pedigree...if it isn't there, it isn't there. It was something I looked for when I bought my unregistered rabbits, in case I registered them ex post facto. It helps to predict things. I like knowing that my Mini Rex have no monster-huge rabbits behind them. Or that my Champagnes have no weedy little bitty thing behind them. Of course, I'm trusting that the pedigrees are honest and truthful, not falsified, so who knows? Maybe I've been "had."

For me though, it is a part of the "honor code." Any breeder who falsifies pedigrees is not one I would want to deal with.

 

[Secuono]

Where are these weights shown on a pedigree? I've never seen anything other than the weight of the animal around the time it was bred or sold and I don't see room where life long weights could possibly go...

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Where are these weights shown on a pedigree? I've never seen anything other than the weight of the animal around the time it was bred or sold and I don't see room where life long weights could possibly go...

Yeah I agree on that...my buck Boss had no weight on his pedigree (all his ancestors did though) so I just had the registrar weigh him when he was registered. I bet he's put on an ounce or two since then...and of course when he was a spry young thing he likely weighed less, LOL.

 

[SyP]

Falsifying information on a pedigree is a BIG "no-no" in my book. If someone is willing to lie about weights, what is to keep them from lying about any other aspect on the pedigree?

You only need three generations of accurate history (with no DQ's) to register a rabbit. It is easy enough to raise two generations per year, so why compromise your integrity?

I want to buy Rabbits from this person. :goodpost:

 

[skysthelimit]

I'm missing one weight, but the rabbit after is registered, so the missing weight rabbit would have to be registered. I will talk to the breeder at the next show.

 

[Whipple]

Can you tell I have no intention of ever registering rabbits? Lol

I do plan on keeping track of all this stuff anyhow, so hopefully it won't be an issue if anyone was to ever buy a rabbit from me they intend to register.

Maybe once I have rabbits that do decently on the show table, then I'll take registering more seriously.

 

[Frosted Rabbits]

I am of the beleif that the rabbit being registered is the one the registrar will be concerned about-- Yes, you need a three generation pedigree-- BUT-- some DQs are not genetic-- so the animal COULD be used for breeding, but is not registerable( torn toenails, hunks bitten out of ears, etc...) A Charlie could very well pass along excellent body or coat type- but due to markings, not be registerable. I have one pedigree here where registered animals in the pedigree are 'clustered'- and the weights are, as well.

 

[KKRabbitry]

Well it looks like the majority of you on RT don't find it acceptable to make up weights.
Honest folks
But it's going to KILL me not to register my best Jersey Wooly buck!! All he needs is 1 more leg, and 3 missing weights

I am seriously considering writing a letter to the ARBA, just to get it straight from the source. Might as well ask a few Registrars as well, they should know something about it.....
Even if ARBA says filling in weights is strictly forbidden, (and they probably will) maybe I can at least do something to encourage them to spread the word a little more. Either people just don't know, or they don't care.
But it sure is not helping the ARBA's registration and GC programs which support the ARBA.
Honestly, missing weights seems to be getting pandemic!
Out of my 35+ pedigrees, maybe 5 of them are not missing any weights.
It's just to bad

 

[luvabunny]

Fill 'em in! Especially if they are second or third generation.

I just had several rabbits registered. Registrar told me straight up to fill the missing info in. If the rabbits are registered, ARBA will send you the registry with the correct weights filled in anyway, no matter what you submit.

I look at it this way. If you have a rabbit that is winning, it obviously didn't come from something that isn't true to the breed, whether that is a different breed, or a rabbit that is way too large or too small. It takes more than 2 or 3 generations to breed that out.

IMO, the weights are really an unnecessary part of the pedigree anyway. I get my rabbits registered as soon as I can, usually just after they turn 6 months old. There is no possible way that my adults, and especially my Sr does who have had litters, are anywhere near the weight I registered them at.

I see no problem with filling the weights in.

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Well it looks like the majority of you on RT don't find it acceptable to make up weights.
Honest folks
But it's going to KILL me not to register my best Jersey Wooly buck!! All he needs is 1 more leg, and 3 missing weights

I am seriously considering writing a letter to the ARBA, just to get it straight from the source. Might as well ask a few Registrars as well, they should know something about it.....
Even if ARBA says filling in weights is strictly forbidden, (and they probably will) maybe I can at least do something to encourage them to spread the word a little more. Either people just don't know, or they don't care.
But it sure is not helping the ARBA's registration and GC programs which support the ARBA.
Honestly, missing weights seems to be getting pandemic!
Out of my 35+ pedigrees, maybe 5 of them are not missing any weights.
It's just to bad

Do you know who bred/owned those missing weight rabbits? Contact them and ask???

 

[KKRabbitry]

Do you know who bred/owned those missing weight rabbits? Contact them and ask???

That's always the first thing I do when I'm trying find correct weights. But it seems to rarely work......often times breeders no longer raise rabbits, or they sold the bunny as a jr. and don't know it's weight. But, ideally that always should be the first plan of attack when your trying to track down weights.

Fill 'em in! Especially if they are second or third generation.

I just had several rabbits registered. Registrar told me straight up to fill the missing info in. If the rabbits are registered, ARBA will send you the registry with the correct weights filled in anyway, no matter what you submit.

I look at it this way. If you have a rabbit that is winning, it obviously didn't come from something that isn't true to the breed, whether that is a different breed, or a rabbit that is way too large or too small. It takes more than 2 or 3 generations to breed that out.

IMO, the weights are really an unnecessary part of the pedigree anyway. I get my rabbits registered as soon as I can, usually just after they turn 6 months old. There is no possible way that my adults, and especially my Sr does who have had litters, are anywhere near the weight I registered them at.

I see no problem with filling the weights in.

luvabunny, you bring up some really good points!
Your apsolutely right, rabbit that are winning are highly likely to be from a quality background.
Also that weights do fluctuate quite a bit throughout a rabbits life.

At least once you do get the rabbit registered and down the road register babies that have correct pedigrees it won't matter as much...since ARBA will have the correct version already. That's why I'm trying to start registering as many of our bunnies as we can. Won't have to worry about incorrect pedigrees later on.

Makes me feel better about fudging it on a few pedigrees if I have to. Especially if it's 3rd generation. Those weights won't even be on the pedigrees of that rabbits babies.

 

[tailwagging]

Well it looks like the majority of you on RT don't find it acceptable to make up weights.
Honest folks
But it's going to KILL me not to register my best Jersey Wooly buck!! All he needs is 1 more leg, and 3 missing weights

I am seriously considering writing a letter to the ARBA, just to get it straight from the source. Might as well ask a few Registrars as well, they should know something about it.....
Even if ARBA says filling in weights is strictly forbidden, (and they probably will) maybe I can at least do something to encourage them to spread the word a little more. Either people just don't know, or they don't care.
But it sure is not helping the ARBA's registration and GC programs which support the ARBA.
Honestly, missing weights seems to be getting pandemic!
Out of my 35+ pedigrees, maybe 5 of them are not missing any weights.
It's just to bad

All registrars that I have talked with (and most have become judges) say fill in a average weight. they say that it is THAT rabbit that is important. that THAT rabbit shouldn't have DQ but that whats behind it shouldn't matter on whether THAT rabbit should get reged. if THAT rabbit fits the standards (and pure for 3 gens) then THAT rabbit should be able to be reged.

 

[Big Tom]

When is the weight that goes on a pedigree supposed to taken? When the rabbit was sold, when it was bred, after it kindled? When?

 

[skysthelimit]

When it reaches senior age, that's when I do it. Pretty much after it's show carrier is over, I don't generally weight them again, but I won't put a weight on the ped if the bun has not reached senior age.