What are the correct terms for these colors?

[rawfeeder]

Just hoping I can get a little help on the correct terms for the different shades of Agouti in my nest box. I can see 2-3 different shades. One is your standard 'sandy' Agouti, the rest are dark but still have the Agouti ticking, yellow behind the ears and quite a few of them have lots of grey on their bellies/sides. One of them is super dark. I've had multiple different suggestions from ''Dark Agouti'' to ''Chestnut'' to '' Gold tipped Steel'' to ''they'll probably fade to Chinchilla!''

Mom is a blue NZ (that has Flemish Giant, Beveren and Californian further back in her ped). She could carry chinchilla, blue/seal point himalayan, blue and obviously black as far as I know.

Dad is an Agouti Flemish Giant X NZ, out of an Agouti doe and a REW buck. (pictured at 4 months old)

Here are some pics of the litter:

So what would you call them? I would just like to have the correct term for my own records and interest in genetics. Thanks!

Also if anyone could explain the chinchilla gene briefly that would be awesome. OR point my in the direction? I've done a couple of google searches but keep finding conflicting information about it. All I can seem to find is that it is a gene that lightens the yellowy color of an Agouti to white. But I would like to know if it dominant/recessive? Do kits look Chinchilla from birth or does it fade to it over time? and how does it interacts with other colors? Would my doe carry it for sure when her father was Chinchilla? What would be the best way to breed for it? I think it is a stunning color!!

Thanks again guys!

 

[ladysown]

flemish giant?

Aren't agouti's called Sandy in those breeds? ah looking in the SOP, recognized colours are ... fawn, sandy, black, blue, white, light grey or steel grey.

what you have there are agouti coloured kits....so I'd call them fawn or sandy.

 

[phillinley]

flemish giant?

Aren't agouti's called Sandy in those breeds? ah looking in the SOP, recognized colours are ... fawn, sandy, black, blue, white, light grey or steel grey.

what you have there are agouti coloured kits....so I'd call them fawn or sandy.

The two kits you are holding look like Sandy and Steel (too dark for fawn on the lighter one and also no white underbelly on the darker steel colored one). But those are breed related color terms, and she has meat mutt rabbits there. If the mother was a mix of New Zealand, Beveren, Flemish and Californian in the pedigree, then it's not a new zealand, it's a crossbreed. So you would probably just want the genetic info here. With all that mix, a lot of it might not present itself til later.

 

[rawfeeder]

Yeah not purebred, these are ''meat mutts' that I am breeding with the goal of improved meat qualities, good type/temperament and pretty colors. Rather than to any SOP or real show qualities. Just wondering what to label these guys color as.. as I would like to keep fairly detailed records on my line still! Plus I really liked the chinchilla color and wondering how I can maybe have it crop it up in my litters again?

 

[skysthelimit]

Chestnut and steel would be the short answer.

 

[rawfeeder]

So Chestnut is not just a term used for Rex rabbits?

Are Chestnut and Steel the same thing genetically?

Does anybody know if I can breed in Chinchilla with these two lines?

 

[caroline]

The site for the gene that determines chinchilla color has at lest 5 different alleles. The most dominant is the full color "C" and that's what your kits are showing.

The good news is the the "chd" is next down the line on the list of dominance. The bad news [if you want to see the chin coloration] is that you will not know it's there if it's paired with the "C" since the "C" is ALWAYS expressed if it's there. Thant's what dominant means.

In order to see chin, or himi, or seal, or albino those genes have to be paired with another gene of equal or LESSER dominance.

So a parent has to carry a recessive gene on their "C" locus, in order to see anything other than the full color.

They can BE full color, but carry "chd", "chm", "ch",or "c"

I didn't know that I had any of those genes in my barn but I found out when I bred 2 full color rabbits and ended up with both silver martins, chins and REW [ruby eyed white. also called albino]. Then I looked back in the pedigree and saw the 4 generations before there had been a chin in one pedigree and a white in another. Then I could conclude that my little silver martin's genotype was
at_ B_ chdc D_ E_

and my chin's genotype was
A_ B_ chdc D_ E_

and my white rabbit's genotype was
A_ B_ cc D_ E_

If you want to get chin rabbits, the best way to do it is to get a chin buck and you should see some chin kits when you breed his daughters back to him.

 

[skysthelimit]

I so agree.

Chestnut is the general tern for black agouti. Actually Rex are not called chestnut, they are called Castor, and chestnut looked dramatically different on a Rex. All other breeds call it chestnut.

Chin rips away the rufus from chestnuts, and sometimes chestnuts leave traces of red on the chins. Best practice is not to mix the two, they are basically two opposing genes.

 

[Dood]

The ligher kits are chestnut/agouti and the darker ones are steel. The steel gene the most dominant gene on the E-locus and darkens/blackens an agouti rabbits coat and has no effect on self so your blue doe secretly carries it, since if the buck had it he would look steel. Steel is not a cut and dry colour, there are MANY shades of it, some kits will only be a little bit darker and some will look exactly like blacks.

http://www.thenaturetrail.com/rabbit-ge ... lor-locus/

''they'll probably fade to Chinchilla"

Highly unlikely. Some chinchilla kits can be very 'sooty' but not THAT sooty. The chinchilla gene turns 3 of the 4 yellow pigments in rabbit fur to white, as newborns they look like dark agouti/chesntuts but by day 7 you can see they are definitely grey.

Chinchilla is on the C-locus and there are 5 coat colour genes here. The most dominant is normal colour, then chinchilla, then shaded, then himilayan (califoria) then REW.

More info on the chinchilla and C-locus http://www.thenaturetrail.com/rabbit-ge ... layan-rew/

I am not sure what you mean by "blue/seal point himalayan" It is rare to find seal points in the meat breeds so I think you mean a blue himilayan.

Breed your blue doe to a REW or Himi/Cali that is agouti based. If she carries chinchilla (or seal point) it will crop up since it is dominant to those two colours.

 

[rawfeeder]

Thanks for the explanations... really appreciate it !