Q: Cage Size for Doe w/Kits

[Bekah-n-Tennessee]

Hi everyone! Another newbie question if you would please entertain...

My first litter is now 4 1/2 weeks old and (knock on wood) all 9 littles are doing great. They are in a 30x36 cage, nesting box out, two shelves added (untreated pine) and have an extra feeder and water bowl which are cleaned and refilled regularly. I was really hoping to keep them all together until 8 weeks old as I understand that is what is best for the kits health wise, then separating till processing at 12 weeks.

My question is will that even be possible with just a 30x36 cage? I could see it possible with maybe a litter of 4 but 9? And having stacked cages with trays...yeah, you know where I'm going with that!

What do you all do? Could it actually be feasible to keep with my original plan?

I really don't want to go the route of an outside hutch with the way this heat and humidity is and they have AC in my little rabbitry so they're definitely not acclimated. I have two more 30x36 holes with shelves open in that tower I planned to use to grow them out after 8 weeks once fully weaned.

 

[CedarRidge]

We had the same problem. Momma and kids in a single 30x36 cage. Ended up buying a 2 hole 30x36 each, and had the manufacturer add a swinging door between the 2. We raise in one, then when the buns start to roam (about 3 weeks), we open the door and give them the added space. As a matter of fact, we ended up doing this with our 3 holes too. It's great to have options.

 

[CedarRidge]

Oh wait, I didn't see the poster. You've seen our setup. Never mind.

 

[Bekah-n-Tennessee]

We had the same problem. Momma and kids in a single 30x36 cage. Ended up buying a 2 hole 30x36 each, and had the manufacturer add a swinging door between the 2. We raise in one, then when the buns start to roam (about 3 weeks), we open the door and give them the added space. As a matter of fact, we ended up doing this with our 3 holes too. It's great to have options.

Ooh, you gave me an idea...I could build short wire tunnels between between adjacent cages with a removable divider. I'll have to think on that...

 

[Bekah-n-Tennessee]

Oh wait, I didn't see the poster. You've seen our setup. Never mind.

Hahaha! But I had forgotten about how exactly your cages were because I was so enamored and distracted by your rabbits!

 

[Alaska Satin]

Hi everyone! Another newbie question if you would please entertain...

My first litter is now 4 1/2 weeks old and (knock on wood) all 9 littles are doing great. They are in a 30x36 cage, nesting box out, two shelves added (untreated pine) and have an extra feeder and water bowl which are cleaned and refilled regularly. I was really hoping to keep them all together until 8 weeks old as I understand that is what is best for the kits health wise, then separating till processing at 12 weeks.

My question is will that even be possible with just a 30x36 cage? I could see it possible with maybe a litter of 4 but 9? And having stacked cages with trays...yeah, you know where I'm going with that!

What do you all do? Could it actually be feasible to keep with my original plan?

I really don't want to go the route of an outside hutch with the way this heat and humidity is and they have AC in my little rabbitry so they're definitely not acclimated. I have two more 30x36 holes with shelves open in that tower I planned to use to grow them out after 8 weeks once fully weaned.

IMHO, raising livestock is the art of the possible.

I myself have had cages that were filled past technical capacity when the options available for moving the rabbits were less attractive than leaving them crowded, which sounds like your situation. Since the litter is used to each other, they may well be able to manage to get along even as they grow. As long as they are acting normally, eating and drinking and showing no signs of stress, I leave them be when the options are worse. Of course the bigger area the better, but sometimes that's not the highest priority, at least in my experience. Shelves definitely open up a lot of square footage and are a great idea. The tray cleaning would be the biggest headache for me, but then I have gone to the nth degree to avoid trays...

My bunnies tend to be happy to snuggle in heaps literally on top of each other, even when they have plenty of room. Here's mama Crabapple looking smothered by the huddle of eight 6-week-old babies, all packing into about 1/6 of their cage space (and it's over 70F in the barn, which in AK is hot - go figure):

 

[Bekah-n-Tennessee]

IMHO, raising livestock is the art of the possible.

I myself have had cages that were filled past technical capacity when the options available for moving them were less attractive than leaving them crowded, which sounds like your situation. Since the litter is used to each other, they may well be able to manage to get along even as they grow. As long as they are acting normally, eating and drinking and showing no signs of stress, I leave them be when the options are worse. Of course the bigger area the better, but sometimes that's not the highest priority, at least in my experience. Shelves definitely open up a lot of square footage and are a great idea. The tray cleaning would be the biggest headache for me, but then I have gone to the nth degree to avoid trays...

My bunnies tend to be happy to snuggle in heaps literally on top of each other, even when they have plenty of room. Here's mama Crabapple looking smothered by the huddle of eight 6-week-old babies, all packing into about 1/6 of their cage space (and it's over 70F in the barn, which in AK is hot - go figure):
View attachment 42226

Yes, they do all get on really well and even the two runts have made great strides in closing the gap in weight. They're all eating hay and pellets along with mom and drinking well, but weaning enteritis and mastitis worry me so i want to lessen those risks where I can. And they do still all pile in together and for now they're fine, but at the six to seven week mark...I'll definitely need to reassess! At least at that age, I'd feel more comfortable starting to pull a few of the biggest out for their own cage.

Thank you for the feedback, much appreciated.

 

[Bekah-n-Tennessee]

IMHO, raising livestock is the art of the possible.

I myself have had cages that were filled past technical capacity when the options available for moving them were less attractive than leaving them crowded, which sounds like your situation. Since the litter is used to each other, they may well be able to manage to get along even as they grow. As long as they are acting normally, eating and drinking and showing no signs of stress, I leave them be when the options are worse. Of course the bigger area the better, but sometimes that's not the highest priority, at least in my experience. Shelves definitely open up a lot of square footage and are a great idea. The tray cleaning would be the biggest headache for me, but then I have gone to the nth degree to avoid trays...

My bunnies tend to be happy to snuggle in heaps literally on top of each other, even when they have plenty of room. Here's mama Crabapple looking smothered by the huddle of eight 6-week-old babies, all packing into about 1/6 of their cage space (and it's over 70F in the barn, which in AK is hot - go figure):
View attachment 42226

Oh, and the trays....yes, I do forsee setting up a gutter system in the future as dumping/cleaning those will get old quick. But I've ramped up quickly in my "acquisitions" and now I'm beginning to get the real feel of what is working, what I know I need to make more efficient/easier, etc. so I know I'm in for a few rounds of rearranging, building, organizing and I need to get pretty finalized there before addressing a waste collection system. Realistically, that won't come till this winter as I hash things out. But I am so thankful I got the ABS plastic trays rather than the galvanized steel...geesh! Highly recommend!

 

[eco2pia]

I have 2x5ft cages for moms, and I often leave them together until 6 weeks, or even longer.

I remove them a few at a time, boys first to avoid crowding. They either go direct to the freezer (for smaller litters left longer), or as a group/pair/trio to a grow out cage.

In the summer I use large/XL folding wire dog crates as tractors and let them eat grass. I move them twice a day. They mow my yard.

You do have to flip the crates over and add hardware cloth/chicken wire to what used to be the "bottom" to keep them from escaping. Then I put the tray that comes with the crate on top for a roof. because I have lots of scrap wood I set it on the roof to keep it from blowing off, but you could easily do something more attractive, like drill a couple of holes and use zipties or clips or something.

I have gotten all of these free off Craigslist, and they fold flat in the winter for storage--I do not typically overwinter litters. They are a GREAT tool for separating or quarantining also.

 

[Bekah-n-Tennessee]

I have 2x5ft cages for moms, and I often leave them together until 6 weeks, or even longer.

I remove them a few at a time, boys first to avoid crowding. They either go direct to the freezer (for smaller litters left longer), or as a group/pair/trio to a grow out cage.

In the summer I use large/XL folding wire dog crates as tractors and let them eat grass. I move them twice a day. They mow my yard.

You do have to flip the crates over and add hardware cloth/chicken wire to what used to be the "bottom" to keep them from escaping. Then I put the tray that comes with the crate on top for a roof. because I have lots of scrap wood I set it on the roof to keep it from blowing off, but you could easily do something more attractive, like drill a couple of holes and use zipties or clips or something.

I have gotten all of these free off Craigslist, and they fold flat in the winter for storage--I do not typically overwinter litters. They are a GREAT tool for separating or quarantining also.
View attachment 42227

I like this idea but unfortunately, not an option for me. We have 80 acres but it's steep and uneven timberland and mostly heavily wooded. We had to escavate just to get an open and level spot for the 10x20 building that is my rabbitry. There is lawn down on the front end of the property but it's just shy of a 1/2 mile from the rabbitry and house. Love the idea of them mowing the lawn!

 

[Julie Stade]

My question is will that even be possible with just a 30x36 cage? I could see it possible with maybe a litter of 4 but 9? And having stacked cages with trays...yeah, you know where I'm going with that!

We don't wean our Rex until 8 weeks, and most of our inside doe cages are only 36" wide and 24" deep (18" tall). And one of the most recent litters we weaned was one of 10. Of course, with our triple-digit heat and high humidity here, we also don't have litters born in the summer either (unless we're committing to raising them in the cellar which stays in the 60s).

Yes, they get crowded, and yes, the tray has to be done constantly. Normally, in the summer, trays are an every 4 day thing, but with a big litter toward the end, it may need to be done every other day. None of the rabbits ever seem to mind being super crowded toward the end. In fact, after weaning at 8 weeks, they sometimes seem a bit "lost" without their siblings/mom mashing them. LOL

 

[eco2pia]

I like this idea but unfortunately, not an option for me. We have 80 acres but it's steep and uneven timberland and mostly heavily wooded. We had to escavate just to get an open and level spot for the 10x20 building that is my rabbitry. There is lawn down on the front end of the property but it's just shy of a 1/2 mile from the rabbitry and house. Love the idea of them mowing the lawn!

With 80 acres of timberland I would build a big communal grow out cage like @Olbunny has, pictures here: https://rabbittalk.com/threads/grow-out-cage-to-max-12-week-kits.34898/post-340315. I have chickens and no Alaska weather so I would not do the tray under, but I would really love to have the space to ramp up production to this level. Check out that feeder! (also, do note that he agrees that this is an overcrowded pen, it was the day he separated them. I still like the size and shape.)

Then again, that sounds like a fair bit of work come freezer camp day...

 

[Bekah-n-Tennessee]

We don't wean our Rex until 8 weeks, and most of our inside doe cages are only 36" wide and 24" deep (18" tall). And one of the most recent litters we weaned was one of 10. Of course, with our triple-digit heat and high humidity here, we also don't have litters born in the summer either (unless we're committing to raising them in the cellar which stays in the 60s).

Yes, they get crowded, and yes, the tray has to be done constantly. Normally, in the summer, trays are an every 4 day thing, but with a big litter toward the end, it may need to be done every other day. None of the rabbits ever seem to mind being super crowded toward the end. In fact, after weaning at 8 weeks, they sometimes seem a bit "lost" without their siblings/mom mashing them. LOL

Thank you! I go every 3 to 4 days on the trays for the individuals and I'm up to every other day right now for the doe with kits and I suspect in another week it will be daily.

 

[Bunnies4me]

I like this idea but unfortunately, not an option for me. We have 80 acres but it's steep and uneven timberland and mostly heavily wooded. We had to escavate just to get an open and level spot for the 10x20 building that is my rabbitry. There is lawn down on the front end of the property but it's just shy of a 1/2 mile from the rabbitry and house. Love the idea of them mowing the lawn!

Don't underestimate the advantages of a sloping area - you can stack them higher where the ground goes down! I've had that for the last few years (and a wood chip floor) and it's been marvellous. Just last week and today I've changed to a level floor on piles as I managed to "inherit" a big wooden floor free.
Re cage size, shape makes a big difference. I have 1200x600mm (23 x 47 inch) which in square spare is not much bigger than your 30 X 36, but it's twice as long as it is wide. They'll live in this as long as possible, usually to 8 weeks with mum. I've got others that are for my grow outs in the last few weeks where they are all individually housed that are more square and less rectangular - and they're a lot harder to make homes comfortable.