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WildWolf

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I'm not sure if this is the right topic to post here, but...
I want to get a breeding pair of Silver Fox rabbits. But, the breeder only has a pedigree for the kits' Dad, and the mom is not completely pure bred. Should I try to find a different breeder? Is there a major increase in sales if the rabbits' offspring have full pedigrees and are completely pure bred?
 
what are you 'mainly' breeding for, meat, pelt, or show?
 
Like Piper stated, depends on what you want to do. If you want them to sell as "show", pedigrees are big and you can get a better price if you supply pedigrees. If it's for meat and pelts, I think the condition of the rabbits is more of an asset than a piece of paper.

Karen
 
In three generations you will have your own pedigree on the rabbits you breed.
 
Technically yes, because rabbits are exhibited by phenotype (how they look) not genotype(what "blood" they carry) if these babies were to be bred to a pure SF now you have in 2 Gen a 75% SF cross which depending on the type of the original crossbreed may look exactly like a pure SF if you then take the SF from the 2nd Gen and breed it back to a pure SF for a 3rd generation, you now have a 87.5% SF that will look just like a SF. And that's all assuming that this Original doe was not a SF cross herself. By that point you may have ears that you need to fix, fur texture, pinched rears, depth, and shoulder issues, but even pure (for many generation) SF breeders encounter issues like that.

If/when you get these babies you should get an incomplete pedigree. Showing the bucks complete pedigree, and for the does side you should get a name, tattoo, color, and breed or crossbreed.

If you choose to show, you might want to start with your SF crosses to develop your own SF line. And obtain a pure SF that you can get immediately on the show table. If however your looking at this from a meat perspective I doubt anyone will care about pedigrees "yes honey that rabbit your eating is out of the national convention best of breed winner, so it better taste good!!" lol
And if for fur once you have the SF type then just breed for that.

Personally I breed for show,pet,meat,and fur. I figure why not I'm feeding them for 1 thing why not include others. I do keep pedigrees for all of my rabbits, though I may not pass them on to anyone who isn't showing them.

If you decide to breed your own line and sell for show, I would note on the pedigrees that X generations back there was a mixed breed
 
If one starts off with NO pedigree, but takes photos of the bucks and dams in one's own herd, and keeps records on what babies were produced by whom, is there ever a point where the babies are considered to be "pedigreed" or maybe I mean "purebred"? I know in the early days of horsebreeding, if all the babies by a particular sire came out looking like him, and then his sons and grandsons too, he was said to breed "true", and was a new "breed", rather than just a "sport"(I am thinking specifically of Morgan horses). Is it the same with rabbits, or must you always outbreed or "bring in new blood" at a certain point? I have one couple who "look like mini-rexes" but are of unknown pedigree, one obvious mutt-couple who seem (from their first litter) to be a Checkered Giant/Lionshead papa and a paint-spattered black on white ? mama, and one purebred (not papered) Argent buck with a 3/4 A/SF doe and a 7/8 A?SF doe who are unrelated to him, supposedly, plus the older doe has been bred to a different purebred Argent buck. All the Argents are from the same breeder, so I don't know HOW far "unrelated" they all are. I am not thinking I ever want to show, but I would like to eventually not have every litter be "surprise" babies, especially the Argents, as I am planning on selling furs, and it's nice if they match.
 
Depends if they look like a breed. If they don't look like anything in particular that's already in the standard then you have mutts forever. If they look like a breed they can be shown and if you want sold unpedigreed claiming they are that breed. After 3 generations of pedigree of all matching the breed standard they are overall considered that breed. However a rabbit from mixed stock with only a 3generation pedigree generally won't do as well on the show table as a rabbit with a long history because more of the desired traits for that breed will be set. For example a rex coat or silvering takes more than 3 generations to recover the same quality after crossing out.
 
I have a doe that is from 4 generations of my stock, Standard Rex is the Majority of that breed BUT!!!! the coat is definatly NOT Rex LOL. However she is just a meat doe so that does not matter to me other than I know whats back in the color pool for thouse 4 generations. and I got a Sable. The Doe is a Broken Black, Buck REW Flemish with tans and Sandies in the back ground. sooo I guess there is a sable in the woodpile somewheres lol. Im breeding her to flemish so the kits will be 3/4 flemish. Now Watch will geta broken black LOL. Also, then, by definition if I breed a kit out of that litter and is broken it would be "Pure" Flemish right?
 
thanks everyone! I know I haven't been on as frequently as I wanted...
I want to breed/sell meat, fur, show, and pet. Do you have to have a pedigree to enter a show? And with the whole 3 generations thing... If you have 3 generations of rabbits that look like the breed, then the offspring is a purebred, even if you don't know if the original 2 rabbits were purebred? If you have a half SF doe to a mixed (a little bit of D'argent) SF buck, what do you call the offspring? If that offspring looks like a purebred, can you call him a purebred?
This is very confusing... :)
 
Showing a breed, as I've learned is 4 generations. For Example, Lion heads. I have one DM Lion head but love the coloring of the Netherland. That starts with FI. Continuing the line, by the 4th Generation, I have purebred lionheads. Talking to the breeder who uses Netherlands in her Lionhead breed (Netherlands have been the founding stock along with angora), using the 4th generation and showing the time line, will get your purebreds. Was confusing to me too at first, but had a breeder who really helped me understand.

With your goals as Pet/Fur/Meat, you will have no problems. Just with the Show, you need to show 4 generations for purebreds.

Karen
 
I never put two and two together! I always wondered why my lionheads were so cranky when I had them. Netherlands!
 
LindseysWoolies":2wm325x0 said:
I never put two and two together! I always wondered why my lionheads were so cranky when I had them. Netherlands!

Gee, shame you cranky ones. I've never had a Netherland, lionhead or purebred Netherland that was cranky. Love those little critters.

Karen
 
So, if you have a mixed rabbit and breed it with another mixed rabbit, do you still have a mixed rabbit, or is it a half purebred? Do you have to breed it to a purebred, or can you just keep breeding mixed?
Also, by 4th generation, does that mean that its parents and grandparents are purebred, mixed, or half, or...?
Thanks!
 
It's still a mixed rabbit. With my Lion heads, I know the foundation started with Netherland and Angora. But if I mix it with lop, I no longer have a Lion head. Even after 4 generations. Starts an all together different line. To get a purebred, you need to know what the Standard of Perfection is for a purebred. And then you go from there to get your generations to that purebred structure and appearance. Best bet if you start with mixes is to know what the Standard of Perfection is for the purebred you want to finally obtain. It's not something that will happens overnight. Could take generations.

Karen
 
ZRabbits":ai3oh2q0 said:
LindseysWoolies":ai3oh2q0 said:
I never put two and two together! I always wondered why my lionheads were so cranky when I had them. Netherlands!

Gee, shame you cranky ones. I've never had a Netherland, lionhead or purebred Netherland that was cranky. Love those little critters.

Karen

I understand what your saying. It's sad that some people don't breed for temperament, it gives a lot of breeds a bad rap. I have always heard about cranky Netherlands. My Lionhead doe I had about 5 years ago was the same way. She was the crankiest rabbit in the world. She was an awful mom too and it really turned me off the breed. Your lionheads are gorgeous though! They are really making me respect the breed again. :)
 
LindseysWoolies":2u57hag4 said:
ZRabbits":2u57hag4 said:
LindseysWoolies":2u57hag4 said:
I never put two and two together! I always wondered why my lionheads were so cranky when I had them. Netherlands!

Gee, shame you cranky ones. I've never had a Netherland, lionhead or purebred Netherland that was cranky. Love those little critters.

Karen

I understand what your saying. It's sad that some people don't breed for temperament, it gives a lot of breeds a bad rap. I have always heard about cranky Netherlands. My Lionhead doe I had about 5 years ago was the same way. She was the crankiest rabbit in the world. She was an awful mom too and it really turned me off the breed. Your lionheads are gorgeous though! They are really making me respect the breed again. :)

You are so right. Can understand how a cranky miserable doe can throw you off a breed. It happens. But so thrilled that you found a breed that you can truly enjoy and show the benefits of the line.

Karen
 

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