Pasteurella or not?

[Caprice_Acres]

The other day I was evaluating kits again in preparation for 2 pairs and a trio to go to their new homes - I was making sure everybody would be happy with their future rabbits.

As I was evaluating them, I saw that most had a little bit of clear nasal discharge. It was hot, so it wasn't particularly worrisome, but MOST of them were sneezing hard and often, with sneezing fits. Some sounded like they needed to blow their nose.

NONE had white/yellow discharge. Their forepaws are clean and show no signs of overproduction of nasal discharge. In the several times I've fed them since, I've sat and listened to them in the growout pen - no sneezing besides normal sneezing. I had some 'keeper' littermates in the barn and in other spare cages away from the growout pen, and all of those are still fine (separated since before the majority were put in the growout pen).

I contacted buyers and told them no sales until I can figure out what's going on.

I am planning on waiting until 10 weeks old (butchering age) to decide if it's safe to sell them. Is this reasonable? I assume between 25+ animals that I will see sure signs of pasteurella, if it is pasteurella, by then.

 

[OneAcreFarm]

I can tell you that in my experience, you should wait until at LEAST 8weeks. That is when mine started showing symptoms. By the time they hit eleven weeks, all but four of the 17 were sneezing with matted paws, etc. Today I went to check the remaining four and they all had matted paws, and they are just over 11 weeks.

 

[ilovehome]

I can tell you that in my experience, you should wait until at LEAST 8weeks. That is when mine started showing symptoms. By the time they hit eleven weeks, all but four of the 17 were sneezing with matted paws, etc. Today I went to check the remaining four and they all had matted paws, and they are just over 11 weeks.

Shoot...I hate to hear that you lost all of them.

Caprice, I hope yours ends up being nothing serious.

 

[Anntann]

Pasteurella manifests in different ways...pneumonia, abcesses, or simple "cold" with greenish nasal discharge. Clear and light is probably..PROBABLY ... nothing more than an allergy or another type of cold virus. Keep practicing good hygiene when you work with them...washing, etc. before touching the other rabbits.

The only way to know FOR SURE if it's Pasteurella multicoida is to have your vet do a culture. There are 2 other virus or bacteria that cause the same symptoms.

The researchers have pretty much concluded that 95% of all rabbits carry the virus. It manifests as cold or abcess or pneumonia when the rabbit is under stress. So...you breed for good immune systems. Ability to fight off colds, etc.

If you contact your vet, and he's a bunny guy or at least can look it up, you can find out what it will cost to do a culture. (for me, it's $100). If you're looking at selling $300 worth of rabbits, that's worth it to find out you can sell them with an easy mind.

 

[akane]

Actually I think the list I found contained 5 or more bacteria/virus that could cause respiratory symptoms in rabbits. You don't know what you've got until it's over (and eve then you are just guessing based on how bad it got) or you've cultured. Some are harmless, some are deadly, and in between.

 

[Brody]

I'm with Ann- rabbits carry it ... no easy way to be sure of what you have or don't - sell healthy rabbits out your door and watch your home crew carefully - I have no doubt at all that stress exacerbates the issues and can turn a 'bit of a bug' fatal for our rabbits

 

[Devon's Mom Lauren]

How does a rabbit "carry" bacteria without being sick themselves? Viruses can become dormant within a body but bacteria?? Interestingly enough the deadly form of pasturella kills within days; a week at most so right there you are breeding/culling for weak immune systems just by default. There are pasturella vaccines available for lambs/goats etc. and I know there has been one tested for rabbits but why there is no vaccine available commercially by now is beyond me. Its become obvious that simple "breeding for strong immune systems" is not enough as referenced by the huge numbers of rabbits that apparently get this disease and suffer horribly as a result. Rabbits have been raised for hundreds of years now so you would think there would be a higher percentage of rabbits pretty much immune to this by now. Its obvious that this immunity is not something that is passed from a doe to her kits in a permanent manner,just perhaps while they are nursing but beyond that I feel no. This is much the same way a pup is given immunities through its mother's milk but after weaning must receive vaccinations in order to be protected. I know some are totally against vaccines but I would suggest they go see a pup with parvo or similar.

 

[akane]

I don't know the details of a bacteria being carried in the body. I would assume a low level just lives in areas like the intestines (carriers are known to shed illnesses in their droppings) and the immune system keeps it low enough to prevent symptoms. I do know they tested a bunch of rabbits and found most already have a form of pasteurella.

I think breeding for immunity is working pretty well. If it wasn't you'd have a lot more herds being wiped out after shows. It would become quite dangerous to take your rabbit to shows since rabbits are rarely vaccinated for anything unlike pretty much every other type of animal that is shown. Kits get sick because there is a gap between when the immunity they get from their mom and their own immunity systems fully kick in. Even if they are durable towards something due to breeding there will still be a weak point before their immune system can produce enough antibodies and any stress will allow them to get sick with even the most minor things. In other animals we give the female vaccinations in a special schedule prior to delivery to make sure the offspring have as much immunity as possible until their immune systems are fully functional. You can't really use young animals as a measure of how immune your rabbits are except to see how easily they recover if they do get stressed and ill. No matter what there will be that period of weakness where they are susceptible to everything.

 

[Frosted Rabbits]

I don't know the details of a bacteria being carried in the body. I would assume a low level just lives in areas like the intestines (carriers are known to shed illnesses in their droppings) and the immune system keeps it low enough to prevent symptoms. I do know they tested a bunch of rabbits and found most already have a form of pasteurella.

Exactly-- there are 'normal' loads of many potentially pathogenic organisms in and on every body. A healthy immune system can handle 'normal' loads, but distress that immune system, then pathogen can then increase in numbers and cause their related illnesses. The unaffected carriers usuallyhave super strong immune systems, that keep the host unaffected, yet don't entirely kill off the pathogen-- so a weakened pathogen is shed, to be picked up by someone with a weaker immune system, The organism gains strength, then takes over.(Typhoid Mary)