Our first large litter. Lots of questions.

[TerriG]

One of our does kindled 12 last night! Our other litters have been 1, 4, 6, 5, 4, and now 12. I kept hearing about the large litters that people have and couldn't figure out what we were doing wrong.

I bred another doe at the same time, but she hasn't kindled yet. She is a first timer. If she missed or has a large litter of her own, what do I do? How many can a doe handle on her own? There is already one little guy that is much smaller than the rest. I don't think he will make it.

I have two other does that still have milk (we are weaning right now), but don't think they would take to newborns, would they? One is the daughter of the doe with 12. Do I just let nature take it's course?

 

[OneAcreFarm]

You can split the litter into two nest boxes and bring her one to feed in the AM and one to feed in the PM and keep the boxes inside.

 

[TerriG]

You can split the litter into two nest boxes and bring her one to feed in the AM and one to feed in the PM and keep the boxes inside.

That was exactly what I came up with and my family questioned me. They thought I was crazy. They didn't think it would work. Glad to know I'm not completely off my rocker.

 

[Dood]

I was going to suggest you pull the nestbox, feed twice a day and organize it so the weakest kits get fed first then let the larger ones have a go.

You can also pull the almost weaned kits from their mothers and use these does to supplement the thinner newborns. The milk will not be as rich since their kits are at the weaning age but it will help. Some does will tolerate this more than others and are grateful the pressure is taken off their teats, but regardless you should restrain them or they could kick, scratch and or bite the newborns. I am currently using this technique with my recently born litter of 7 mini lops on an Am. Chin. doe

I would wait and see what happens in the other nest box before deciding to cull but I don't let my does feed more than 10 and less if she is not in top conditionor or a bit on the pudgy side. I cull the less thrifty newborns and those who seem to have less milk in their bellies, they would be the first to go anyway. I think slowly starving is a horrible way to die so I do not let 'nature take it's couse'.

 

[TerriG]

Dood, how do you cull little ones? My kids were asking me. We haven't ever had to cull one younger than 3 wks. We just use a pellet gun for the ones younger than weaning age. Not sure how to even cull a little one if it is suffering.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Dood, how do you cull little ones?

MSD here, not Dood... but I think the easiest way to cull little ones is to put them in a paper sack and whack it against a wall. That is how I used to dispatch mice when I was feeding an orphaned hawk.

 

[TerriG]

Thank you MSD.

I posted pics of the popples on RRR

 

[Dood]

A pellet would work well but I prefer to use cervical dislocation, their necks snap quite easily, it is actually more of a stretch and pop than a snap, and not as messy as a pellet. I don't like to 'slam' anything larger than a fuzzy mouse but I feel very comfortable doing CD and it is my go to method.

 

[jollysrabbits]

I just want to add (i think were having this same convo on another topic) with litters this big make sure you are feeding properly or your doe might not produce enough milk. Oats or BOSS works great to help with extra nutrients. congrats on the litter. Oh on another note, MSD uses the paper bag method but we have stucco on our walls so it rips the bag open, but a ziploc bag with a heavy stick, large screwdriver handle or small hammer with one quick strike to the head works very well.

 

[skysthelimit]

I don't cull anything unless it is obviously dying, I've had supposed runts grow so i could not even tell who was the runt. You will know within a few days.

 

[TerriG]

We picked up some BOSS tonight so we will add oats and Boss for this doe. I also have to remember that she is a meat mutt, so she isn't going to feel like my other rabbits that are bricks. She doesn't feel quite as thin now that she doesn't have such a huge belly. Guess 12 kits will do that to you. I thought my 9+lb babies made me miserable ...

 

[rittert3]

I agree with sky, also want to add that dispatching not for human consumtion is often done with CO2, it slows down their breathing and they fall asleep.

ETA: alot of pet stores will do this for free or it's easy to make a small setup too, either using dry ice and water or a CO2 tank and rubbermaid container/s. Very peacefull and fairly quick.

 

[TerriG]

Just ftr, I won't being culling anything. I can't do it. My kids were just asking me. I thought it was good to know though. It would have to be an extreme situation for me to be able to cull something so young. That's just me. My dh and ds do all of the dispatching, even with the enteritis kits. I am the nurturer.

 

[rittert3]

I understand, I'm not one to cull much myself.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I don't cull the little ones either. The youngest I have ever had to do was out of the nest already and had a very runny nose. Probably pneumonia. It was big enough to whack with a stick, but I sure didn't like doing it.

 

[SarahMelisse]

You can split the litter into two nest boxes and bring her one to feed in the AM and one to feed in the PM and keep the boxes inside.

I had a doe with a litter of 11 last spring and that is what I did. Totally works!

 

[OneAcreFarm]

I agree with sky, also want to add that dispatching not for human consumtion is often done with CO2, it slows down their breathing and they fall asleep.

ETA: alot of pet stores will do this for free or it's easy to make a small setup too, either using dry ice and water or a CO2 tank and rubbermaid container/s. Very peacefull and fairly quick.

CO2 is only humane if it is carefully administered at the right level...it works by displacing O2 and if you give too much at once, it simply suffocates them. I find a quick blow to the head works well...fast and humane.

 

[TerriG]

Everyone made it through the night!<br /><br />__________ Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:37 pm __________<br /><br />Our other doe finally kindled today! She had 6, but is a first-timer. I want to make sure she is taking good care of hers before I move any over to her.

What are your suggestions of how to divide up the litters. With 6 and 12, I can give each doe 9. Is that my best bet?

 

[Dood]

You can go two ways, give the 3 weakest kits to the other mom or the 3 strongest.

From being on this forum i am coming to learn that I am pretty critical of my herd and i am comparatively quick to cull any undesirables, having said that, please keep it in mind when considering my advice - I would give the 3 weak kits to my weakest doe, expecting them not to thrive and possibly having to cull them with the hope that she would be feeding fewer kits.

9 is still alot of mouths to feed. Give the girls lots of hay, fat and protein and wean as close to 4 weeks as possible.

 

[TerriG]

I was going to do the 3 weakest, but after looking at kit size I think I will do the 3 biggest. There is only about 36 hrs difference in age, but the difference in size between the two litters (try fitting 12 in, they can only get *so* big) is quite large. The only ones that will be able to compete with the ones in the smaller litter are the biggest ones in the huge litter. I think I will take out both nest boxes tomorrow and get everyone moved around. By doing the largest, it will also be easier to identify. They are all the dark kits, where the smaller litter are all pink. No confusing those!

We have already added oats and BOSS to the does diet.