Okay... lightly confuzzled. (Kit colors)

[2CrazyFools]

So as most of y'all know I just got blessed with a litter of 6 newborns and their coats are starting to come in and making me scratch my head a bit. Initially when they were furless there were 2 pink kits and 4 blue kits. Mother is a blue American rabbit, and father is a white meat mutt (A&M / NZ), so I assumed the 2 pink kits were white and the 4 blue kits were going to be blue like Momma. That's not what's happening....

So the blue kits are really, really looking like they are black, not blue at all. Blue is a dilute of black so does make sense that she could throw black right? Not too much of a mystery there but what further confuses me is that the white kits are not coming in white at all, more of a cream color. I first noticed yesterday morning (kits were 1 day old) then that got moreso ingrained when I fed them last night. Now this morning they really don't look white and I feel confident they are not going to turn white.

I suppose this means the white meat mutt buck is hiding something under that white coat? What would throw this color? I know it's hard to tell at this point since they really don't have much fur on them at all, but I thought I'd throw this out there and see what y'all thought on it. He's had one other litter with another white meat mutt and they threw black and white kits.

Mother, Clover.


Father, D'artagnan.


1 day old kits


2 day old kits

 

[SableSteel]

I've heard of some blue American carrying non extension, not super often, but that's what it looks like here

It looks like the dark ones are gold tipped black steels (aka just "steel" - they end up dark enough to consider them black) and the light ones are fawns
The black (non dilute) must come from the NZ parent, he's probably not dilute under that white

 

[ladysown]

blacks and two reds.. can't complain.

 

[Dood]

What colour eyes does the buck have? He looks frosty (with brown or grey eyes) to me rather than white (with red/pink eyes)

I also think the "blacks" might turn out steel

 

[2CrazyFools]

Day 3 pictures of the fawn kit.

It looks like the dark ones are gold tipped black steels (aka just "steel" - they end up dark enough to consider them black) and the light ones are fawns

Gold tipped black steel? How is that any different from just self black? They are looking extremely black at this point, lol.

blacks and two reds.. can't complain.

They sure are cuties!

What colour eyes does the buck have? He looks frosty (with brown or grey eyes) to me rather than white (with red/pink eyes)

I also think the "blacks" might turn out steel

The buck has blue eyes and has black individual hairs on his face and on the very tips of his ears.
When would one know if they turn out to be steel or just self black? What's the difference?

Closer picture of the buck's face.

 

[Nyctra]

Papa is a Frosty/Ermine.
I was gonna say, the fawnish kits have some smutty lookin' inner-ears, and that they looked kinda like minimally-pointed torts, but I guess I forgot to hit submit last night. :| Now I wanna say even more, those fawns are torts! :lol:

Now you gotta keep a doe and breed it back to papa for some sallander buns.

 

[2CrazyFools]

Okay! Good to know I'm not crazy! I also had my suspicions about them being torts. It'll be really neat if they do end up turning out that way! I know we're just guessing at this point seeing as they aren't even a week old, lol, but it's kind of fun. Glad to hear someone else was getting the tort vibe. ^_^

 

[Dood]

Gold tip steels are agouti = A_ B_C_ D_ Es_ and silver tip steels are = A_ B_cchd_ D_ Es_

Blacks are self = "aa B_C_ D_ E_" or "aa B_C_ D_ Es_" but steel blacks are visually identical to non-steel blacks so the gene easily hides in self rabbits

I'm not convinced you've got torts :hmm: could you post a picture of the side of the kit with some belly showing like the kit on the left (a gold tip steel) in the picture below ?

 

[2CrazyFools]

I'm not convinced you've got torts :hmm:

That makes two of us! Though it certainly crossed my mind these last few days, I'm still so new at this you could say it's fawn steel and I'd believe you :lol:

Here's what I was able to get this evening, s/he certainly wasn't very willing for a belly shot! I'm assuming fawn has a whiter belly and tort has a darker belly? These guys do appear lighter in my opinion, as well as that lighter ... racing stripe (lol) down the side. I didn't notice it in person but it's pretty apparent in the pictures.



I cannot WAIT for them to open their eyes... overly enthusiastic about eating now and end up inhaling the formula up their noses because they are going crazy. :down: Bad kits. No.

 

[Dood]

Looking more like fawns with those lighter bellies than torts

 

[aussiegirl]

If your white male has Blue eyes then he could be a Vienna carrier. I'm suprised none the kits have broken patterns (Vienna marked) since he was bred to a solid colour if this is the case.

 

[2CrazyFools]

Yeah, no markings other than the weird smuttiness these fawn/blonde kits are getting. Is there a Fawn Smutt gene or something? They have those dark smutty ears and I swear there's a dark smutty shade on the tips of their fur as well as some dark whiskers. I'll try to get a good picture of it tomorrow. <br /><br /> __________ Sun Mar 26, 2017 10:37 am __________ <br /><br /> Here's some pics from this morning. In the first picture you can see the "smuttiness" on her cheeks, ears (hard to see, but very top of her head/ears is smutty, as well as tips -which you cannot see in this shot) side of her body and hind end.



Here you can see the smuttiness on the tips of her fur on her body, on her side in front of her leg, and of course the obvious tail.


The blonde kits have this weird greasy sheen on them, I've tried cleaning them with a moist cotton ball and it hasn't seemed to make any difference.

 

[Nyctra]

Okay, now they look fawn. Really smutty fawn, but fawn. The tail is dark above, and light below; it would be all dark on a tort. The inner ears were pretty dark before, but they've sure lightened up. huh :shock:

 

[2CrazyFools]

Okay, they are older now and I would like to make sure I'm still calling them the right color. (I just edited it to add better pictures)

The blondes are smutty fawn, darker ears, dark little nose, dark whiskers for the first 2/3rds, their toes are always "dusty" and they have a dark tail on the top. This is Louie, Della Rose is more of an orange with less smut.



The blacks are black steel right? How SableSteel and Dood figured this out when they were still bald is beyond me... This pic is from Lady G.'s shoulder blades

And from Pip's shoulders.

 

[Dood]

Yup

Fawn and gold tip steel

PS genetically and statistically it was more likely the black looking kits were actually steel

 

[SixGun]

Gold tipped steel or silver tipped steel? It looks silver in the pic, only reason I'm asking.