New to meat rabbits, wanting advice

[Lightningwolf]

Hello, so I've been hanging around this forum for a month or so now, but never posted anything. I'm very interested in raising meat rabbits, but since my dad Hates rabbits (My aunt had a lot of them as a kid and when I was a kid. They weren't for meat, show, they were barely pets. And they bit a lot), so it will probably be another 3 to 6 years (My parents are letting me start with Ducks though when we get a house, so that I will have some experience with live stock). But I still want to know a lot of things. I've only had one rabbit in my life, and that was when I was 5. He was a Japanese Harlequin Broken, well, a mutt. He was a meat rabbit, but I was 5 and didn't know what that meant so thought nothing of it. Honestly though I don't remember much of him minus that he liked to chew and play with my belts.

So I know that New Zealands and Californians are the recommend rabbits. I like Californians, and New Zealands (mainly the black brokens I think are cool looking). But any experience with Harlequins? I wouldn't mind (with more experience with rabbits of coarse) to try French Angoras, I read that they are good for wool, meat, and fur. Californians are the most common in my area, along with a Havana breeder. Are they good meat rabbits?

So what is the earliest you can breed, recommended first breeding, Latest you should first breed, and age of retirement? Would like it for both Does and Bucks.

Are Linebreeding and Inbreeding ok, or do you have to do Out crosses all the time, or only line breeding and outcrossing, ect?

What are traits you want to cull? I'm planning on Culling breeders or unwanted pups that I'm not using for meat by selling them as pets. I've just heard about Screamers, what is that? is a Rabbit scream distinct? I'm familiar with rats and a Rat scream is the scariest thing you can ever hear. Speaking of which, what is a baby bunny called? Sorry, familiar with rats and in rats their called Pups by most.

Also I'm kind of torn between ways I want to house them. yeah I know I still have 3 to 6 years to learn this, but this really has been confusing me. Ok, at first I thought about just doing the regular wire cages, 2 feet by 3 feet. Then I thought about like Double hutches that I can just move every day so they can graze and get off the grass. Then I started thinking about colony raising, but remembered that even in the wild rabbits aren't the worlds friendliest of creatures, even to their own kind. Now I'm back at the wire cages, thinking about 2 feet by 4 or 5 feet to give them enough room. Or using those storage cube things and making Pens. Though I've been reading that that can be dangerous, I have no plans to put in shelves, would that make a difference or stay completely away from it? Also been thinking about making rabbit tractors and just moving those around every day, but then I heard they can get Worms and other parasites, and I don't think that would be fun. I'm so confused now :?

Oh and also, how do you tell if a rabbit is happy? Rats boggle (grind their teeth so fast that it causes their eyes to vibrate in their head. its kind of funny, cute, and creepy all at the same time. especially if they are a sleep, so their eyes are closed and all of sudden opening vibrating). Do rabbits do something similar?

That's all I have for now, but knowing me I'm going to get confused about something else very soon.

 

[MaggieJ]

Welcome to RabbitTalk, Lightningwolf! :hi: Hang out with us for a while and things will become less confusing.

What breed you would choose will likely change a dozen times before you actually get your rabbits. We have a forum for Breed Discussions (near the bottom of the home page) and I'm sure you will learn a lot there to help you make a good decision.

For does, some people breed as early as four months but five or six months is more usual. Best to have a first breeding before the doe reaches a year old. For bucks, they can breed as soon as they are willing and able. How long they will continue to breed depends on the individual rabbit. Does will begin missing or having smaller litters at some point and then you know it is time. Bucks can keep going for years, but they may become less potent in time. Don't let your rabbits get too fat. They will lose interest in breeding and the internal fat makes it hard for the does to conceive.

Linebreeding and inbreeding are fine, provided you have good stock to start with and are willing to cull hard. Just remember that any trait, good or bad, is likely to be intensified.

I've never heard a rat scream, but a bunny scream will curl your hair. Most of them do not scream unless very frightened. Occasionally you get one that screams a lot and it is best to send it to freezer camp.

Baby rabbits are generally called kits, but you will see many people here using the word "popples". This is just our pet name for kits. You won't likely hear it except on this forum and one other.

Housing is a big issue. There are pros and cons to each kind of set-up. I think individual cages are the best when you start out. If you go to another system such as a colony, you will still use the cages for sick or injured rabbits, for ones you want to handle a lot before selling as pets, for newly purchased rabbits that you want to put in quarantine for a month.

I used wire cages when I started out, but now have my rabbits in an indoor colony (half of a shed). Rabbits that know each other enjoy the social life in a colony. They cuddle up and groom each other and the adults often let the kits hang out with them. They are more interesting to watch in a colony. But colonies bring their own management problems. It is harder to spot illnesses and the rabbits do not usually get handled as much and can be skittish.

I would not worry about being confused at this point. There are very few rights and wrongs in raising rabbits, just choices to make. You will likely find that by the time you get your rabbits, you know exactly what you want.

 

[a7736100]

I cull biters. Don't know why people insist on keeping rabbits with behavior problems.

 

[Mac_]

Maggie, can you tell us what you have for flooring and walls in the section of the shed that the rabbits have access to?

Thanks, Mac

 

[MaggieJ]

The floor is wood from pallets. We reused some paneling that we took out of the house (ugly stuff!) for the walls. This is less than ideal, but you work with what you have. I'd like to put a new plywood floor over what we have and seal it but don't have the money to spare at present.

Here's an old thread that has pictures.
pictures-of-nest-tunnels-in-colony-t2903.html

 

[ZRabbits]

Welcome Lighteningwolf. Smart move on finding as much as you can about raising rabbits. I have to say, mine or more for pets, are in individual cages, but seeing MaggieJ's set up for her "colony", definitely an interesting way to go for your meat rabbits.

Californians and NZ's are really good meat rabbit breeds. But if you like color Silver Foxes, Champagnes, and Americans can help you quench that color need for a meat rabbit. But MaggieJ is right, your breed preference will definitely change the more you research rabbits. Many neat breeds out there that can serve the purpose you want.

Sorry to hear about your parents view about rabbits. Your aunt definitely didn't give rabbits a good picture. And being 5, I'd say it would be tough to really know the experience of a rabbit. I'm finding out that rabbits are very good at giving back. They give us meat, fur and also their poop can truly make a garden grow.

Hoping your duck experience helps you morph into the rabbit experience.

You found an excellent forum to prepare, just ask questions and read all the posts, definitely will help you build your education. But have found actually dealing with rabbits is the best education there is. Hoping that happens for you.

Karen

 

[Piper]

Welcome, Lightningwolf! I have rabbits, ducks (Khaki Campbell, and Cayuga), geese, quail and guinea pigs. Glad you have found us, and ducks are defiantly a start. Showing your parents, that you are taking responsibility, by studying about rabbits, is a good start, too! Nice to have you!
:welcomewagon:

 

[Lightningwolf]

Thanks everyone. Just talked with my mom last night and looks like my Rabbit dream might be closer then expected. As everyone knows the Wife gets to make all the decisions, so after some experience with ducks my mom is letting me get rabbits. they're going to be on the Back half of the property so my dad doesn't complain. He actually seems to be mellowing down on the subject a bit more, he used to yell when I ask, or even talked about, and now just says "We'll see" and the other night even asked some questions. It will still be another 6 months to a year and a half before we get a house, but good to know that its closer then I thought.

Been doing a lot of research lately. There is a breeder who breeds for meat pin just on the other side of town from us So we'll probably start with Californians and go on from there. we'll also probably be used single cages since that just seems like the best idea.

oh I have a few more questions.

Does anyone here use "Burrow nestboxes"? I saw a video of a guy using them, I forgot the video, but it was to simulate how rabbits burrow in the wild But still allow you access to see the babies. they sound like a smart idea but a pain in the butt to clean and check on the babies. Also does anyone know where to get/make Metal nest boxes? I'm in Texas so its hot all year round and also it just sounds easier to clean. Or can I use small plastic tubs?

Best(and cheapest) place to get food and hay? the only website I could find had 25 pounds for around 20 dollars. Oh also just to double check, adult rabbits need 1 cup of food a day, is that right? and free feed for pregnant and nursing moms, and babies under 3 months? is the three months right, in rats 3 months is when they don't need as much protein in their diet.

Oh also, does anyone have any opinions on flemish crosses? (or giant breeds in general) I know that they have terrible meat to bone ration, but would they be good for a cross or further down the line? I think Flemish giants are cool which is why i'm asking. Also there is a breed not that far outside of town who breeds them for meat.

Oh Piper, off topic, do you have experience with Pekin ducks? (Aflaac duck). they are the most common here next to this other breed (Muscovy? the only one that isn't originated from mallards) and we're looking for both meat and eggs.

 

[a7736100]

I found the feed store using the Purina website. You can find dealers in your area that stock Purina Rabbit Chow. Other brands also have a search tool of their dealers.
Horse hay is cheaper than pet rabbit hay. Ask a riding stable where they buy their hay.

 

[-HRanchito]

There are plenty of nestbox patterns online. You can make one pretty quick out of scrap wood

 

[3mina]

I use small plastic totes with a hole cut in the side for nestboxes(no lid)

 

[Miss M]

If it is especially hot, you can even use nestboxes made completely of wire. But you have to make sure all sharp points are properly tucked.

Mine are wood, with wire bottoms.

There is a good sized learning curve with rabbits. My main advice would be to start out as simply as you can. Wire cages, a healthy, nice trio, an easy way to dispose of waste. You can change things later or make it as complicated as you want to later.

Welcome to RT, and welcome to rabbits! :razz: Soon, I hope!

 

[Piper]

Oh Piper, off topic, do you have experience with Pekin ducks? (Aflaac duck). they are the most common here next to this other breed (Muscovy? the only one that isn't originated from mallards) and we're looking for both meat and eggs.

find out about 'NPIP Flock Testing', there is a small fee and it allows you to sell the extra birds and eggs, at aution, ebay, farmers markets, ect. The duck that seems to be the most popular (white flesh), is the pekin, but the duck that lays the most eggs, is the khaki campbell. What do you want to know about the pekin? If you would like to PM or use my email link, you are welcome to do so. If I know which county, you live in, in Texas, I may be of more help.

 

[Lightningwolf]

Any other good rabbit food? Sorry I'm very wary of purina since in the rat community they have a history of adding in too much vitamin d3 (or is it b3) which in high amounts slowly kills an animal. They also have too much protein (not sure if it's the same with the rabbit food, but still wary)

Wire nest box? That actually sounds really good. When we get rabbits I'll have to experiment with that.

Once again thanks guys, I'm out of questions for once, which is very odd for me.

 

[Evvie]

From what I understand, Lightingwolf, there are a lot of brands to choose from when it comes to rabbit food. I have only been looking at 50lb+ bags which are significantly cheaper than a 3lb bag you can buy at the pet store, and they seem to come from a variety of companies.

Most rabbit foods go up to 18% protein, and I've never seen anyone say they needed more than that, even in special situations. Depending on whether or not the rabbit is growing, pregnant, or nursing, 14-16% may be appropriate. So just as long as you check the protein content and make sure it doesn't go above 18%, you should be fine.

 

[MaggieJ]

Contact the company and ask for the actual ingredients list. I did that with the feed I used originally (back in 2005) and was horrified to find that they used animal tallow in the feed. I don't believe in giving animal products to herbivores. It pushed me toward the natural feeding very fast, I can tell you.

 

[RichinOregon]

I am fairly new to raising meat rabbits, but so far it is going great. I found a small ad at the feed store for meat rabbits and found some one in the next town that has a good thing going. I first I wanted the rabbits for there Poop to feed my night crawlers that raise for bait shops. I learned that my new rabbit guy was interested in my worms so we traded, 3lbs of worms for 5 rabbits. He raises a cross between a New Zealand and a Flemish giant. His family has been using this cross for generations and I am now starting to see why. I have two litters. The first litter will be 7 weeks old in 2 days (11 in the litter). They weigh almost 5 lbs! already. Now comes the hard part, I have tried the breaking the neck method (not so successfully) and the whack on the back of the head (blood coming out of eyes,nose and mouth) Yuck. So after some time thing about it I was wondering if anyone has tried or have a opinion on drowning? My Idea was to attach a weight to a small duffel bag, Put some holes into the bag and drop the rabbit in the bag and drop it into a 5 gallon bucket full of water. I feel it would be humane for the rabbit and less stressful on myself. Please help if you can. Thanks Rich

 

[-HRanchito]

I don't think drowning would be particularly humane. If you've ever dove too deep in a swimming pool you know the feeling...

There is a discussion on this very topic here: how-do-you-kill-them-t9957.html
Hope it helps. Seems like it's a matter of figuring out the right method for you, but none are easy.

And.... :hi: :wbounce: :hi: Welcome to the boards!!

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Now comes the hard part, I have tried the breaking the neck method (not so successfully) and the whack on the back of the head (blood coming out of eyes,nose and mouth) Yuck.

Most people want the rabbit to "bleed out". I have had limited success with getting them to bleed out when whacking them on the back of the head, but it sounds like you have been successful- good job!

I would not recommend drowning. I had to do that once, many years ago, when I didn't know how to shoot a gun. I put the animal in a net bag with a rock and dropped it into a can full of water and quickly walked away. The panic of the animal was apparent in the death pose- front feet fully extended, reaching for the surface, and mouth agape... it haunts me to this day, even though it ended its misery. Please don't try it.

 

[MaggieJ]

I agree with HRanchito and MamaSheepdog about drowning. It is not humane and the animal suffers minutes of panic and pain. You want something that is instantaneous.

Many of us use a pellet gun. Some people have a definite aversion to guns of any type, but it is easier for many of us than some of the other methods. Take a look at that thread that MSD listed for you. There are other threads in the Meat Rabbit forum that discuss methods.