MORE GUARD HAIRS

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

I have been going through my rabbits... saying which ones stays and which ones dosnt... Now question is in my whites... I have some really nice whites... but there is one doe that has allot of white guard hairs in her fur.. more than the others... I can spin the whites up and when i come to her fur... I know which does it is because of all the guard hairs...I was thinking of culling her because of the it... would she pass this trait on to her kits.. I am not to fond on spinning her fur to much because of the guard hairs.. I dont know how much of the trait the babies take on for the fibre parts

 

[PSFAngoras]

I have a doe who has a higher amount of guard hairs too, a REW, and the guard hair in her kits is very dependent on each kit individually. Some have very nice coats, and some have more guard hair. It's not necessarily a bad thing depending on what your buyers are looking for.

I traded two kits from the REW to someone that I thought were coming into a beautiful coat, and she culled them because she thought the coat was not coarse enough. A different doe, that she had sold me previously, I'm looking at selling because she has a coat much more heavy in guard hair than my REw doe, and it's a very coarse too, not something I'm too keen to add to my lines, though some of her coat is easily 7" in length. I have held the kit back with what I consider the best coat to see how she matures and see how the kits from the coarse doe turn out, but it's just a waiting game from here.

It depends on what you or your buyers are looking for.

 

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

ok. thanks.. I just did all of my rabbits today as it was a mild day... that one decided to let go of her coat.. So she dosnt have that much guard hair after all.. I will be keeping her now..

 

[skysthelimit]

French have more guard hairs, that's one of the things that makes their coats easy to care for. And remember, more guard hairs means more of a halo when you knit. You don't want a coat as soft as an English. Aslo, guard hairs change as the kit ages, and plucking and shearing both change the amount of guard hairs in the wool when it grows back. Strike a balance if possible.

 

[SelinaDarwin]

Would like to much obliged for imparting this with us..But what are the other alternatives of it? Any suggestions????

 

[Peach]

Could you guys show some pictures of guard hairs on the angora breeds? I get good hands on experience with Mini Rex, but I'm very curious about what it looks like on them, but nobody near me raises wool breeds :-(

 

[skysthelimit]

I will try to get good picts. Guard hair is the same as it is in the Mini lops, the outer hair that carries the color. The undercoat, you know is the stuff that the does pull out when they are making a nest. Well Angoras grow long guard hairs and undercoat, and what we call wool is mostly undercoat. Very dense undercoats. Undercoats are usually slate gray, white, cream, dove gray, and that's the colors you will get with the wool. If you have an animal with a lot of guard hairs, the wool that comes out of it will be darker, because of the undercoat. This is why the colors are more vibrant with Satin Angoras, they have more guard hairs, with shiny hair shafts. You know you have wooler with more undercoat, because it's easier to care for and matts less.

I'd swear my JW's were produced from EAs not FAs, because they matt at the drop of a hat, at lease the selfs do.

This wool is from my black FA. At the bottom see the random black lines, those are the black guard hairs.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Just got back from my first show, I only watched this time to learn, but the doe that took BOV had a coat almost identical in texture to my REW doe that I thought was coarser, so maybe she's not as coarse as I thought after all!

She's certainly still softer than the Brillo pad of a rabbit that my lilac doe turned out to be.

I'll see if I can't find some pictures of the coats on the rabbits (it's easier to see the difference in guard hair and coarseness on the rabbit if you don't already know what your looking at) with different textures tomorrow, sorry, been up since 3 am and I just want to get to bed now!

 

[skysthelimit]

LOL.

I finally pulled those guys out of the cages. They have not been groomed since before thanksgiving. I hope my camera will do them justice. The two REWs are 7 mos old, 3/4 French-English and it shows. One has a cottony coat that would most definitely get him bounced off the FA table. The other has much longer wool than either bucks, not cottony at all, but not as many guard hairs as the black buck, who is the show buck with the correct fur. The black bucks wool lays across the body, but the REWs surrounds them, they look like cotton balls. I was going to cull that buck (REW), I have no love for him, but with that wool, I'd rather not.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Okay, so here are the pics...

They are all order from the softest to the coarsest, so you can kind of look and compare

Poor thing in the bottom pic is my Ruby gal, he one who I thought was too coarse, please ignore the shabbiness of the coat. It's still a good pic to show coarseness, but she just molted and plucked for a litter, so she looks like crap!<br /><br />__________ Sun Jan 12, 2014 6:04 pm __________<br /><br />Or not, maybe it's harder to see since she's white... Anywho, I tried

 

[skysthelimit]

Cottony, soft and silky coats are incorrect. The brillo pad doe had more guard hairs, but would be considered more correct in coat than the softer ones.


This is Ansel, the show buck, short bodies and somewhere around 9.5lbs. He gives the SF a run for their money. He is currently growing in a new coat. The front of his body is all the guard hairs growing in, the back is some left over wool that I haven't gotten out yet, very few guard hairs, but enough that from thanksgiving to now there are no matts. Because I did not clip this time, it's the end of a very long growth cycle. The wool from the last time was 5.5 inches long.



.

This is the bun who bit me. He was slated for the snake guy, but his coat is better than the other REW. Neither is 100% french, but this one is closer in texture than the other.
Ashford Traditional


Look at all the guard hairs. Can we say Halo in our yarn?



Here's Mr. Cotton head for comparison. Lack of guard hairs.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Oh, no no no. The white doe is not Miss Brillo Pad, that's the doe who I though was coarse, but turns out to be almost identical in texture to the 9 year old doe who took BOV at the show.

Let me find you a pic of Miss Brillo Pad real quick.

Between her coat, her recent attitude change (she's started biting this last month...) and the fact that one of my customers is starting to have temperament issues with one of her daughters, Brillo is now in my freezer...<br /><br />__________ Mon Jan 13, 2014 6:35 pm __________<br /><br />THIS is miss Brillo pad, aka Hazel.

And this was BEFORE her coat got coarser...

 

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

that is to much guards hairs for me in the rabbit.

 

[PSFAngoras]

That's why she ended up in my freezer! I was hoping crossing her to my bucks might give me her length with the softness of my bucks, but between her attitude and the one kits attitude I decided she didn't deserve a second chance. Her kit that I saved for show inherited her dad's sweet and playful temperament, and her jr coat is coming in now, so I'll see how it compares. I can always work off of her if I like it so I won't risk anymore rabbits with Brillo coats and bad aditudes.

I think my white doe is a bit coarse for my preferences as far as spinning (those guard hairs can be pokey!) but she does put on a lovely undercoat, so if I work my lines towards her and her brother's (sage's) texture, I should end up with kits that range from a tad bit to soft for show but perfect for spinning, to some that are perfect for show and a tad bit coarser for spinning. Guess its a wait and see game from here!

 

[skysthelimit]

When I saw the picture I said---OHHHH.

Yes, she has too many guard hairs. Prickly in more ways than one.<br /><br />__________ Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:15 pm __________<br /><br />

I think my white doe is a bit coarse for my preferences as far as spinning (those guard hairs can be pokey!) but she does put on a lovely undercoat, so if I work my lines towards her and her brother's (sage's) texture, I should end up with kits that range from a tad bit to soft for show but perfect for spinning, to some that are perfect for show and a tad bit coarser for spinning. Guess its a wait and see game from here!

I had that in mind for Mr. Cotton head and the himi doe. Sadly, the Himi doe was culled last week. She had the most guard hairs of all, and the least density, but her dau went best of show a few weeks back, so she had the genes. Sad I was unable to save her or her kits. Depending on my situation, I may cull Cotton head. At the moment I have no doe Angoras, only the SF cross kits, he might be useful to breed to one of them.

 

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

very nice rabbits sky..

 

[skysthelimit]

Thanks. Now if I could only get breeding does It's an Angora monastery.

 

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

I dont know what happened here.. But i breed all of my does .. and they were willing.. that is a first for me with this breed as i found this breed a little more harder to get breed.

 

[PSFAngoras]

Sorry your having such a hard time sky...

I really wish I could send a couple does out your way, out of my last two litters I had one litter of three that was all bucks, and a litter of six that is 5 does and one buck. Blues and lynx mostly. Be happy to send a couple your way if we could only get the transport sorted out!

 

[skysthelimit]

I dont know what happened here.. But i breed all of my does .. and they were willing.. that is a first for me with this breed as i found this breed a little more harder to get breed.

I don't have any does anymore. They are died/culled.<br /><br />__________ Wed Jan 15, 2014 12:09 pm __________<br /><br />

Be happy to send a couple your way if we could only get the transport sorted out!

Thanks. Of the 4 breeds, the Jersey Woolies are the only ones that have matured like they were supposed to, bred and breed true, did not get sick and died during the ME plague. They are quickly becoming the primary breed here. The others need to get their butts in gear!

The Angoras have been the worst- would not take, bad 'tudes, died during pregnancy, blowing snot day after arriving, 2 litters lost. That's why I am not buying any more Angoras. What's around here doesn't seem particularly hardy.