Kit color

[skysthelimit]

Litter is five days old. I have two blacks for sure, they are shiny and dark all the way on the belly. The other three I don't think they are black otters anymore. If they were, their fur would be as dark as the blacks, except for eye circles, head triangle, and pink bellies.

They are noticeably lighter than the blacks, a bit brownish. I'm thinking they are castors?

Any thoughts?

 

[caroline]

do they have a tan triangle on the back of the neck? That's the way to tell if they are otter. The "brownish color does sound like castor, unless you could have chocolate otter I'm waiting for one of those myself.

Here's a picture of a litter with amber, Castor and black otter kits. Maybe that will help you ID yours

 

[skysthelimit]

That is a great picture! They are not as brown as the obvious castor on the right (mine are a few days younger than this pict), but they are no where as dark as the otter in between the ambers. Do otters have any agouti markings on their legs? I'm looking at yours, first on the bottom left. Mine have markings like those on their legs. Gotta be castors.

 

[caroline]

Here's a younger litter of all castor kits. They don't look so brown until the fur comes in.

<br /><br />__________ Fri Jan 13, 2012 5:47 am __________<br /><br />I had the thought that the kit could also be silver martin if the otter combined with the chin gene. I see from your signature that you have chin. My black otter doe, who carries REW was bred to a buck who had the chd gene and I have a beautifil black silver martin out of that breeding.

 

[skysthelimit]

This particular litter was castor to black otter. Neither has chin in the pedigree. I heard that they are working on silver martins, which is good because they are beautiful.

Castor it is. The breeder I got her from thought she would produce otters, but I've been reading, oppositely you won't get otters if there are no otters close on the pedigree, and in this case there are not.

 

[caroline]

well otter can be far back on the pedigree if there are a lot of agouti [castor] ancestors, since the "at" is recessive to the agouti "A" gene. If there are selfs back there "a" no otter can be transmitted since the self [black, blue, chocolate, lilac, seal, sable] are recessive to BOTH agouti & otter and cannot transmit them. They can only transmit the "a" and depend on their mate to give anything more dominant.
If the the Castor parent carries either otter or self, then you can get otter from the breeding, but if the castor parent is double agouti "AA" then all you'll get will be agouti. But the good news, if you are wanting otter, is that about half of the castor kits will be otter carriers, or ALL can be otter carriers if the otter parent is double otter "AtAt"
I like keeping a "probable genotype" section for each of my rabbits [that looks something like: Aat B_ Cchd Dd Ee Enen - broken castor that carries otter, chin dilute & non-extension] and then playing with what their kits could be, depending on the rabbit to whom they are bred. Int4ead of counting sheep at night, I search for Lynx, or Amber, or chocolate otter bunnies in my future

 

[skysthelimit]

The castor doe has produced blacks, chocolates, ambers, and REW, her last litter.

The sire has only black or black otter in his pedigree. He is a result of an otter to solid black. So my castors might carry otter? What do I breed them to in order to get otter? A black or blue?

 

[caroline]

If your castor doe carries otter [At] then if bred to a black [aaB_C_D_E_] you could get castors and black otters [and other things depending on what else is carried by both. If the does is double agouti AA, you'll only get agouti kits, not otters or self. If the doe is Aa you can get Agouti and self but NO otter.

If the doe carries At and you breed to a blue [aa B_C_ dd E_] then you can get the same as if bred to a black. In addition, if the doe carried dilute AAtDd then you can get both black and blue otter.

If the doe carries brown "b" and the black or blue buck carries brown,you could also get chocolate otter and maybe even lilac otter, assuming both carry the dilute gene "d"<br /><br />__________ Fri Jan 13, 2012 5:44 pm __________<br /><br />I just re-read your post, & if the castor doe has produced chocolate then she would HAVE to be Aa, and NOT AAt. In that case she will NEVER produce otter kits bred to a self buck, only agouti and self. You would have to breed to an otter, or to an agouti that carried otter to get otter kits from her

 

[skysthelimit]

I think I worded that wrong. She was bred to an otter this litter, but it looks like no otter kits. I believe the breeder thought she carried otter, but she can't carry otter if she produces black and chocolate, right. So the castor kits from this litter might carry otter? So I breed them to a black, or a blue (since I will have broken blacks and blues from another litter) and I might get otters.

This has been every helpful.

 

[akane]

You can never get agouti, otter, and self from the same rabbit. They can only have 2. Your agouti kits if one parent was otter could carry otter but you won't know. Your self kits cannot or they would be otters.