Is this kit REW? Genetics?

[Tbgb1912]

Firstly, is this kit a REW?
And two, how do you get REW genetics?

Dam is a steel seal, and sire is a blue agouti chinchilla. In their two previous litters they have thrown blue steel, seal, black steel? magpie harlequin, black agouti chin - bare with me as I'm still learning genetics.
When breeding my doe's sister, with the same buck, I have had harlequin and blue agouti chin.

My buns are surprising me with what they are carrying and throwing.

Also, the other kits in that litter are blue steel and seal? I think

Apologies for the photo, I didn't want to spend too long holding the wee guys as it is winter here and rather cold.

 

[akane]

If one parent is a seal you can't get a rew. You can only get chin, seal, and if the chin carries himi or rew you can get sables out of the cross. REW is the bottom of the c locus genes. There is C-full color, chd-chinchilla/dark chinchilla, chl-sable/seal/light chinchilla, ch-himi/californian, c-rew. That is the order of dominance. Out of any pair whichever is dominant is what shows. A Cchd rabbit is normal colored. A chdchd rabbit is chinchilla and so is chdchl, chdch, and chdc. With chl there is a slight difference. 1 chl-sable gene with ch-himi or c-rew is sable and 2 chl genes is seal. That means a seal chlchl cannot carry c for rew. A chinchilla can but you need cc so 1 from each parent to express rew. You can only get sable if the chinchilla carries a gene recessive to sable.

A nonextension rabbit is the other common reason for a solid pink besides rew. That would be rabbits with ee such as sable points, torts, red, ermine/frosty if it's agouti... but having steel and harlequin in the mix complicates things on whether that is possible.

 

[Tbgb1912]

A nonextension rabbit is the other common reason for a solid pink besides rew. That would be rabbits with ee such as sable points, torts, red, ermine/frosty if it's agouti... but having steel and harlequin in the mix complicates things on whether that is possible.

So would fawn be likely? I am assuming my seal doe carries non extension, due to her dam and sister being fawn.

 

[Dood]

steel seal x blue magpie chin :roll: cannot produce fawn, which is a full colour, they can only produce recessives like chinchilla, sable, himilayan and REW, dependingon what the parents secretly carry

I think the kit is a frosty (AKA ermine) which is a non-extension chinchilla and will have dark (brown, grey or greyish blue eyes) = A_ B_ cchd_ (OR cchl_ ) Dd ee

If the kit turns out to have red/ruby/pink eyes then I think your steel seal doe is a steel Siamese sable instead, and she has a very dark steel gene making her look like a seal

 

[akane]

Fawn is full color which is the C gene. You cannot get a C gene from a chinchilla who's most dominant gene is chd or from a sable/seal who's most dominant gene is chl. There cannot be a C. If it's an ee rabbit it would have to be chinchilla or sable unless your seal is not a seal.

 

[Tbgb1912]

Wow, this is so confusing to get my head around :lol:

steel seal x blue magpie cannot produce fawn

You mean 'x blue chinchilla' not magpie?

I think the kit is a frosty (AKA ermine) which is a non-extension chinchilla and will have dark (brown, grey or greyish blue eyes) = A_ B_ cchd_ (OR cchl_ ) Dd ee

That's exciting, that would be a keeper! :3 how do you get a frosty?
If she were Siamese sable, how do the red eyes fit into the picture?
This darn steel gene.

 

[Dood]

Only REW and Himilayan have red/ruby/pink eyes.

Sables, and chocolates, can have a reddish CAST to their eyes but they are defintley NOT red

 

[Tbgb1912]

If the kit turns out to have red/ruby/pink eyes then I think your steel seal doe is a steel Siamese sable instead, and she has a very dark steel gene making her look like a seal

So here you are saying if the kit turns out to have a red cast to its eye, then my doe would likely be sable not steal?

 

[Dood]

If the kit turns out to have red/ruby/pink eyes then I think your steel seal doe is a steel Siamese sable instead, and she has a very dark steel gene making her look like a seal

So here you are saying if the kit turns out to have a red cast to its eye, then my doe would likely be sable not steal?

No, the steel gene has nothing to do with it.

If the kit is a REW (or himilayan) and not a frosty then the doe has to carry a REW (or himi) gene and cannot be a seal, as they have two sable genes = "cchl cchl" and she must be a dark steel sable "cchl ch" or "cchl c"

 

[akane]

Sable will have a red cast to the eye that can be picked up by camera flash and bright light but without looking closely in bright light they will not show any red. Himi and rew have obviously red eyes at all times. As soon as the eyes open you will be able to tell.

 

[funnies50]

Don't ask me, I know nothing about genetics and whatnot, but that little pink one is absolutely adorable, Tbgb.

 

[Tbgb1912]

No, the steel gene has nothing to do with it.

If the kit is a REW (or himilayan) and not a frosty then the doe has to carry a REW (or himi) gene and cannot be a seal, as they have two sable genes = "cchl cchl" and she must be a dark steel sable "cchl ch" or "cchl c"

I meant seal, not 'steal' XD
Would the steel gene cut out any facial markings/points that sables have? As I have a recent picture of the doe, where she very visibly has sable point facial marking characteristics.
If my doe were sable rather than seal, would that make any difference to her producing the magpie harlequin kit? I know that magpie has to do with the chinchilla gene, which my Buck is, but how does it link in with the does genetics?

Basically, I would know the kit would be a frosty if it had dark colored eyes, otherwise it would be a REW if it had red eyes? They are the only two possibilities?

Sorry for all of the questions

 

[Dood]

Yes, steel darkens agouti based rabbits, I don't know if it will darken a self sable :shrug: but suspect it will

The following newborns are often or always *pink* at birth and your kit could turn into any one of them
frosty
REW
himilayan
BEW
sable point
fawn (this one is ruled out due to the parents colours)

Magpies are not always chinchilla, you can get magpies from the sable gene as well - nearly all my Mini Lops are sable based magpies, including this guy = aa BB cchl cchl Dd ej e

 

[Tbgb1912]

Thanks! I will keep this post updated as the kit grows

 

[funnies50]

Ohhhhhh how adorable

 

[Tbgb1912]

So I am still assuming REW, as the kit looks albino. It is still pinker around its ears, eyes and face, even with the fur growing through. What would a frosty kit look like?

And if the kit were indeed REW that would make my doe Siamese sable? What offspring would I expect from that? I haven't researched anything about the sable genes..

 

[Dood]

Frosty kits are white - you've got to wait for the eyes to open to know if it's a REW or not.

 

[Tbgb1912]

Does this wee splodge on his nose indicate Himalayan? Although it isn't dark..

8 days old, for reference

 

[Dood]

No

 

[Tbgb1912]

Unfortunately this wee guy took a wander out of the nest on a freezing cold night and I found him frozen and stiff in the morning Mother Nature sucks. Why did the favourite kit of the litter have to be too inquisitive? I was intending to keep him too - he was gorgeous. So distraught at my lack of responsibility. I should have brought the nest box inside for the night :/ what a horrible way to die..