IACC strikes again....

[owlsfriend]

I work third shift and stopped at the grocery to get bananas and kale for the buns, ironically enough. I say ironically, because when I pulled up to my house, the Animal control van was waiting. They'd had an anonymous tip that I was neglecting my rabbits....I could barely talk. All my worst fears come to greet me. The officer was nice and patient as I called my husband. He was at physical therapy (due to his brain surgery a month ago.) so he couldn't really talk to the officer on my behalf. He just said to make sure the dogs were in the house when I took her out to the shed. (No duh....)

I had 5 new rabbits on the back porch in quarentine. They're in smallish cages but had water and feed, the trays weren't spotless, but the cages didn't have any fur on them....(an issue with Rick's cages, I think I heard.) Then we went to the real shed. I had done all the tray cages a week ago. The crates-over-tubs, not so recently. All three fans were blowing, there was water and feed, although it was past my normal feeding time. I showed her my "running water" a hose with spray nozzle. My easy chair was beside the grooming table, and I'd brought the bananas and Kale with me to cut up later. One rabbit near the front caught her attention....a stupid buck that only poops in one corner....of course it was through his floor.

She took photos of that. I lifted the hatch so she could take a very good picture of it....being helpful in my sleep deprived haze. I couldn't even tell her how many rabbits I have (since I just sold two last Saturday.) Her guess was pretty close. Now that I'm thinking, I can visualize and count....yes, there are 19 cages and 26 rabbits in the shed plus the 5 on the porch....31, I have 31 rabbits. I said if she was worried about hoarding I could assure her that wasn't an issue as I frequently sell my rabbits "to people who want them." I was explaining about wool harvesting.....and I vaguely remember talking about the American Blues, who were very curious and doing the periscope to get a good look at the stranger in the shed.

Long story short (I really do have to get some sleep) I have 14 days to clean my trays. It means rearranging the entire set up, except for the ten cages with trays. I don't foresee any problems, really. It's just such a anxiety producing thing. IACC isn't really wanting any more publicity on it's rabbit theivin' ways. (And I doubt my neighbor would have thought to call them on my rabbits if Rick's seizure hadn't gotten so much media attention.) I have a case number. I have an officer assigned to that case number. She has to make a report. I have cages to clean and that should be it. I hope.

 

[SarahMelisse]

Oh man. That sucks. There's just no better way to say it. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you that clean cages will be the end of it.

 

[trinityoaks]

Oh, dear Lord! What a nightmare! Praying that you can get everything worked out!

 

[TMTex]

Wow! I read that as the neighbors kicking you when you're down. Maybe I have that wrong, but if your DH had a medical problem and they used that as an excuse to call Animal Control, it just seems heartless.

I'd be pretty upset with those neighbors. Turnabout is fair play if they step out of line, even by a small technicality.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Oh no! What a terrible thing to come home to. :x

It seems to me that trays are the culprit in most of these cases. There simply is not enough room between the cage floor and the tray since rabbits so often poop in one corner.

Since you have to rearrange your setup anyway, is there any way you can install slant boards instead? That way the waste will all fall to the center of the rows. My slant boards are not steep enough for the waste to fall by itself, so I made a push stick out of corrugated plastic (same material as the slant boards) and simply push it down every couple of days. The bottom tier of cages is easiest of all because it falls straight to the ground.

If the floor of your shed is wood or concrete, you could perhaps buy a piece of linoleum to put under the cages so the floor wont absorb urine.

I hope you can get everything up to AC standards, and hopefully find a way to simplify the rabbit care so they will have no cause to bother you in the future. :good-luck:

 

[Pepperoni]

That's ridiculous. At least she waited for you instead of snooping around on her own (supposedly). It always seems like this type of thing happens at the worst time, after someone's been injured or unusually busy at work. I hope that once they check back after you've cleaned everything they'll leave you alone. I hate to say it, but now that you're on their radar it's going to be a waiting game until they get another complaint or want to do a follow up.

I think this is every animal raiser's worst nightmare and I'm very sorry you have to deal with it. I honestly wouldn't have handled it as well as you did. I would have told her I wouldn't take her anywhere or show her anything without my husband present and a warrant. I know some people think that makes you look guilty but it's well within your rights.

 

[AmysMacdog]

Sending prayers your way! [[HUGS]] Bless your heart Owlsfriend, hope all goes well for you from hear on out!

 

[Cottie]

That's horrible. At least they gave you clear-cut rules and a deadline.

What do you use in the pans? I was using kitty litter to keep the smell down in the heat, but recently switched to shredded newspaper. It absorbs the moisture and I can just dump it in my garden area. Makes it a lot easier to do it on a semi-daily basis.

 

[Frecs]

That sucks! Wish I could come help you get cleaned up but all I can do is send prayers and best wishes.

I was thinking just yesterday about AC and the Rescue community in my area and how blessed I am. Yeah, you read that right: blessed. Because, you see, I work along side ladies who have husbands that are deputy sheriffs, one of which works at the AC center. And, I also work along side ladies who's mother runs the largest animal rescue group in the county (NOT, btw, HSUS). And, they all know that I raise rabbits for meat and that my rabbits are in wire cages. I was asked one time about the cages and after I explained that wire is the most hygienic housing and that the rabbits are comfortable on it, they were fine. In fact, the deputy at the AC has asked his wife to advise me when they had rabbits dropped off.

I used to know (emphasis on *used to*) a wacky ARA lady but I've cut ties with her. I fretted for awhile that she might try to cause me trouble. Either she couldn't get anyone else stirred up about it or...well, I'm not sure. All I know is she has left me alone. Now, a lady at my church has started posting things to her FB about animal rights. I'm waiting for a good time to address that issue with her.

The reason I was thinking on this yesterday is that I called --again-- to report a neighbor's stray hunting hound. The report I filled out stated on there -- "the hound was harassing my chickens, ducks, and rabbits". I had a moment of panic...do I want to tell them I have these animals?...will they insist on seeing my animals? Would this neighbor, in revenge, try to get me in trouble about my animals? Well, I don't think I have to worry about that latter question. He relies on the county regs on numbers of animals the same as I do. His poor next door neighbor has to listen to his barking hounds 24/7 because of those regs--he (we) can have as many animals as we wish as long as they are cared for...

As I read the OP and thought about how my rabbit cages would appear to an AC Deputy, I thought...

1. my rabbits love to pile hay in their poop corner. why? I have no idea. I clean it out every few days.
2. poop and dropped food goes straight to the ground below. The chickens keep it stirred and it is not smelly even though I've not mucked the rabbitry in two weeks. (The only time I had an odor problem was during our monsoons.)
3. I'd probably have to explain why Maggie's leg has dried ointment on it still...it is all healed and the ointment is coming out...slowly.
4. Depending on the time of day, my rabbits would not have food in their dishes. I give the adults food in the evening and they have it eaten by morning. They have hay and/or twigs to nibble at other times but they would be fat if I free fed them. They always have water--unless they decided to play with their water bowl and spilled their water...not all of them drink out of bottles and the stupid bottles leak.

I'd have things to explain and I hope I would be clear headed enough to explain it. But, I think I'd be okay. Now...if they came when I was not home and talked to my mother...she, bless her heart, would have no idea how to answer their questions.

__________ Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:59 am __________

I think this is every animal raiser's worst nightmare and I'm very sorry you have to deal with it. I honestly wouldn't have handled it as well as you did. I would have told her I wouldn't take her anywhere or show her anything without my husband present and a warrant. I know some people think that makes you look guilty but it's well within your rights.

It is your right to require a warrant or even (I believe) an attorney present. Yes, that can make you look like you are hiding something. But, at the same time, trying to "look innocent" can be used against you in a court of law. I don't know that I'd be so clear headed as to insist on a warrant on the first visit, but I would try to secure the services of a lawyer there after.

You may also want to take pictures of your rabbitry, cages, and animals. Document anything you think an ARA might take out of context. So, if they were to suddenly return to raid and remove your animals, you would have pictures to counter their pictures. A little paranoia never hurt anyone. ;-)

 

[Prisma]

Ditto on the warrant or at least a law officer present or some thing else more to protect yourself, like Frecs said. They are very good at pointing out things that aren't really there by sheer appearances only, (pictures, record in notes, etc kept/cropped to look worse than really are or not note your side correctly) and use any thing with in their site even if they did not ask Keep a close eye out, and if you don't have locked doors, I would be doing that too. I hope all blows over and no more issues! Did you ask who made the complaint? I'd be finding that out too, maybe it was a disgruntled buyer or neighbor that just doesn't like you for some reason either way, better to know and be able to keep an eye out then deal with it again. I'd also take before and after pictures that are dated, just incase it comes up that they were never moved or changed.

 

[Marinea]

You may also want to take pictures of your rabbitry, cages, and animals. Document anything you think an ARA might take out of context. So, if they were to suddenly return to raid and remove your animals, you would have pictures to counter their pictures. A little paranoia never hurt anyone. ;-)

This is what I was going to post after reading. A dated video explaining your set up might be even better. Definitely have one on day 14. So sorry you have appeared on their radar.

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Wow! I read that as the neighbors kicking you when you're down. Maybe I have that wrong, but if your DH had a medical problem and they used that as an excuse to call Animal Control, it just seems heartless.

I'd be pretty upset with those neighbors. Turnabout is fair play if they step out of line, even by a small technicality.

TMTex, that was EXACTLY what I was thinking-- you hit the nail clear on the danged head. :evil: TOTALLY heartless.

That's ridiculous. At least she waited for you instead of snooping around on her own (supposedly). It always seems like this type of thing happens at the worst time, after someone's been injured or unusually busy at work. I hope that once they check back after you've cleaned everything they'll leave you alone. I hate to say it, but now that you're on their radar it's going to be a waiting game until they get another complaint or want to do a follow up.

I think this is every animal raiser's worst nightmare and I'm very sorry you have to deal with it. I honestly wouldn't have handled it as well as you did. I would have told her I wouldn't take her anywhere or show her anything without my husband present and a warrant. I know some people think that makes you look guilty but it's well within your rights.

Seconded. Nobody gets to see my rabbits without a danged warrant. :evil:

As I read the OP and thought about how my rabbit cages would appear to an AC Deputy, I thought...

Sadly a lot of AC people don't know what is "normal" for a rabbitry. My trays are emptied every few days...but the trays under my moms with litters get pretty full in that timeframe because there's SO MANY. Breezy's tray looks awful after just one day...two Mini Rex and three Champagnes produce a LOT of poop!!! Plus the kits are messy so spilled pellets, chunks of treats and bits of their alfalfa are all over...and when they spill their water it becomes a swamp.

But for a lot of people, "looks" are everything.

You may also want to take pictures of your rabbitry, cages, and animals. Document anything you think an ARA might take out of context. So, if they were to suddenly return to raid and remove your animals, you would have pictures to counter their pictures. A little paranoia never hurt anyone. ;-)

This is what I was going to post after reading. A dated video explaining your set up might be even better. Definitely have one on day 14. So sorry you have appeared on their radar.

GOOD IDEA. :goodpost:

 

[ladysown]

so why don't folks empty trays everyday????

I don't get that. Takes nothing to empty a tray every day. Especially moms with litters.

I should have added this
I am sorry that you are dealing with animal control. Sounds like they were reasonable about everything and didn't just do a grab and confiscate and bill for board.

 

[Cottie]

so why don't folks empty trays everyday????

I don't get that. Takes nothing to empty a tray every day. Especially moms with litters.

I don't empty daily. I do it at least every third day, usually every other. I think it really depends on cage size and how deep the trays are.

 

[Pepperoni]

so why don't folks empty trays everyday????

I don't get that. Takes nothing to empty a tray every day. Especially moms with litters.

I don't empty daily. I do it at least every third day, usually every other. I think it really depends on cage size and how deep the trays are.

Yeah, that. I use wood shavings and shredded paper in our pans to soak up liquid, if I cleaned the pans every day I'd be wasting so much bedding. I find that every third or fourth day is right for our rabbits. Of course, if a pan needs it before then I'll empty it out, such as with does with litters or if someone spills all their water and gets everything all sloppy.

After I read this thread the first time I went out to check on the rabbits again because it was unusally hot today. I stood there and thought about how my setup would look to an AR person or anyone simply not familiar with livestock. I actually just emptied pans yesterday, so things were pretty clean. On the other hand, it was hot and I had a few rabbits who needed water refills. One doe had chewed a hole in her frozen water bottle and made her pan into a swamp. Since I feed early in the morning most everyone had cleaned up their pellets by then. I also had a few juniors in heat distress who I ended up bringing into the house for the rest of the afternoon. I thought, "this is the type of thing they'd get me for" because intentions don't mean anything and even if they saw you moving rabbits indoors or refilling empty water bottles they'd say "oh, well you should have done that sooner"

 

[Desert Rose Rabbits]

This terrifies me. We've moved from a rural-ish area to smack dab in the middle of town. The people around us have chickens and a few roosters (been here for as long as my husband can remember and he's in his 30's... we've moved into his childhood home as his dad bought a new house), which is completely illegal so I'm hoping that'll offer me a bit of protection. No one wants animal control called to our area. I can tell you right now that if AC were to come out they wouldn't be thrilled with me. Cages are clean but low to the ground right now, and while I have a mister system set up for the heat, the only protection they have from the sun is a tarp folded over the top of their cages. On top of that, I haven't been able to clean underneath the cages for a week due to surgery for a burst ectopic, and my husband is horribly allergic to the rabbits so he can't clean for me.

Our move into town was incredibly rushed due to our house foreclosing so I don't have the setup that I was hoping to have when we moved in. No one is in 'ideal' cages, though we have the wire. We just don't have the wood for the frame yet.

Ick... it does sound like someone is being an arse, though. I really wish that people would mind their own business. Rabbits poop, a lot. They also can't be free fed, which is something that people seem unable to wrap their minds around. *sigh* Owl, I'm so sorry you ended up on their radar!

 

[owlsfriend]

Why don't I dump my trays every day?
I dump the trays weekly, which is generally good enough. But there are very few of my cages with trays (less than 10 of 26)....most are sitting on top of 6 inch deep concrete-mixing-tubs. The cages have to be lifted off and put somewhere else before the tubs can be dumped.

I use wood shavings and Sweet PDZ stall deodorizer as the litter medium.

I think actually, this may prove to be a good thing.....(eventually, when I can look back and laugh--not yet, by any means) I have a plan for suspending my cages above the tubs so the tubs can be pulled out without disturbing the cages and rabbits...Also, going to re-build the roof...before winter snows pile on top. I think it will be okay.

I do like the idea of before and after videography. To show how much work it is and how I found a solution...Thanks to everyone for your encouragement and suggestions.

(My neighbor, called to have my "abandoned car" impounded the week after I got new tags on it., so I aired up the tires and jumped the battery so I could put gas in it. When I got back home, the only place to park was sort of (but not completely) in front of her house...so, she's been 'after me' for a while...She runs renting crack dealers out of the neighborhood by calling code enforcement and the cops on them and writing down the license plate numbers of their visitors...etc over and over until the dealers go some place else. But I'm not a renter, and not a crack dealer...guess she just thinks I'm driving down her property values....of course she's nice to my face....I've known her almost 15 years and watched her work many times before...)

So, I decided to "kill her with kindness"--first, I will move my car and second, I will take it to the car wash, so it looks more loved. (I haven't been using it often because it has no AC and my little truck does, so I've just been using my truck.)

Then, I will casually mention how my husband's recovery has been since the surgery, etc, next time I see her, but will not mention the rabbits or IACC. (By the way, she did take the offered organic fertilizer for her roses last spring.)

Next, I will screen and cover my worm bed, which the IACC did not notice--yet. Followed by an intense day of moving all the rabbits out of the shed, cleaning all the tubs and trays, firing all the wool off the cages and chain-link walls. Making frames to hang the cages from. Removing all the pallets from the floor and "cleaning" the dirt underneath. Putting up an improved roof made of hog panels, and finally putting everything back together.

I haven't decided how many rabbits I should "sell" in the next two weeks. But I think it would be reasonable for me to move a few somewhere out of the county...especially the 5 English Angoras I have in quarantine. I bought them from a lady who was moving into assisted living, the five best of her rabbits that she couldn't bare to part with until the last minute. It would be truely tragic if anything happened to them.

 

[tailwagging]

http://thecavalrygroup.com/

call them now! AC taking pix is never good!
take your own pix now.