I thought I put two does together, and they fought. Maybe they weren't two does? Maybe it was a buck and a doe?

[YOHONOMOTO]

Let me start by saying I am a moron, and I know it. I bought three meat rabbits a few months ago - one buck and two does. They are New Zealand/Rex. They are just about 5 months old. I separated them at around 12 weeks and have had them separated ever since. I had read that some people keep does together and simply separate the buck. I decided to try and put the two does together and see what happens. I took them each out of their cage and put them into a little pen. They seemed to ignore each other for about a minute, then something snapped and one decided to chase the other. They both had their nose to each others' tails and went in circles for a bit, and then they both ended up on the ground clawing at each other violently. Lots of fur was left on the ground. As soon as they started clawing at each other, I separated them as quickly as I could.

Here are my questions:
1. Does this sound like the behavior of two does? Or does it sound like the behavior of a buck and a doe? I THOUGHT I knew which ones were the does, but one of the does and the buck look VERY similar. It's possible they were mixed up. Is it possible I actually put the buck with the doe, the buck started chasing the doe, the doe didn't want to mate, and things got violent?
2. Do any of you keep does together? If you do, do they have to stay together from the start and not be separated?
3. One thing that reinforced my belief that this one was the doe is that it's a bit less friendly and more moody and likes to be touched less than the other one. The one I think is the buck is much more friendly, easier to pet, more curious, etc. Is it generally the case that bucks are like that? Or is that completely irrelevant?


I know, I know... just look at the genitals... but these things do NOT like to be held, and even then... I am not confident in my ability to decipher between the "taco" and the "burrito". I told you I'm a moron.

 

[MaggieJ]

You're not a moron, but you are new to rabbits and there is a fairly steep learning curve.

1. Does are very territorial. Unless they are sisters or mother and daughter that have been together from the start, they often fight. In small quarters where they cannot get away from each other, they may do serious harm to each other. I suggest keeping them separate. It simplifies many aspects of their care, particularly when they kindle.

2. Does that have always been together often get along fine, but again they need space. I don't recommend it in a traditional cage.

3. Some people find bucks more friendly, but more depends on the individual rabbit's personality.

Read as many of the old posts on this forum as you can. You'll feel a lot more confident when you learn about the problems other people have had to overcome.

 

[ladysown]

You are still learning, cut yourself a break. I would get someone to give you help in sexing them, and then find a way to mark them, or mark their cages. I used to use poker chips with cheap shower curtain rings to help me differentiate.

I am guessing you had two does together and they decided they would rather not share space. often times once does are separated they need to stay separated and sometimes even if they are raised together, unless the area is big enough for both of them AND has out of line of sight hiding areas, they still need to be separated.

 

[Robochelle]

It is definitely a case of personality. And compatibility. I have a black angora that began fighting with his brother. Took the brother away, and eventually put meat rabbit brothers in as neighbors (i have a long cage, with dividers to separate). He climbed over the divider during feeding time, and the brothers welcomed him with chinning! He's been in there for weeks and no incidents. Hated his own brother once his testes dropped, but loves his new posse unconditionally.

They really are tiny children in fur coats, they might want friends but they want to choose their friends. Ever since that happened, I've made neighbors of the ones I want to pair, and look for them nosing affectionately through the wall before I even try to put them together. I also keep an eye on any grouped cages for signs of fighting.

 

[BuffBrahmaBantam]

Thanks for posting this. We have 1 buck and 1 doe and I am hoping to keep a daughter from the first breeding to live with her mom in a modified colony set up. I guess I will need to keep an eye out for this sort of behavior. I’m learning a lot!

 

[Preitler]

I do exactly that, keeping a daughter with each doe. I think that's the most easy way to select a partner, i keep the doelings with their moms for 5 months anyway, by that time it's noticeable which one get along nice with mom - and me.

When one doe dies or gets retired I keep a doeling from the next litter of the other doe.

I have 3 pairs of rabbits, my retired pair (8 and 10yo), my current breeding does (3 and 4yo) and my buck with his spayed cuddlebun as free roam house bunnys.
If does from different pairs meet there always is a scuffle, my oldest the most viscious. Bonding two does can be quite an adventure, and it doesn't always work out, characters need to be compatible. Not seperating from the start and picking a good one imo is the best method.

 

[BuffBrahmaBantam]

I do exactly that, keeping a daughter with each doe. I think that's the most easy way to select a partner, i keep the doelings with their moms for 5 months anyway, by that time it's noticeable which one get along nice with mom - and me.

When one doe dies or gets retired I keep a doeling from the next litter of the other doe.

I have 3 pairs of rabbits, my retired pair (8 and 10yo), my current breeding does (3 and 4yo) and my buck with his spayed cuddlebun as free roam house bunnys.
If does from different pairs meet there always is a scuffle, my oldest the most viscious. Bonding two does can be quite an adventure, and it doesn't always work out, characters need to be compatible. Not seperating from the start and picking a good one imo is the best method.

Wow! That is great to hear and sounds like it works well. Thanks for sharing those details.

How do you house your rabbit pairs? Are they in large cages, or a colony? Is your old 'retired' pair together, or are they in separate cages? Another general question I have wondered is until how old can does can be bred? At what age did you retire your rabbits from breeding and why? Did the doe stop lifting for bucks, or did she have small litters??

 

[Preitler]

Here wood hutches are more common (cages are a No-No because of the polemic about freeing chicken from cages, every cage is now considered cruelty by many), each pair has two hutches that are connected with a tunnel. I think it helps a lot when they can get out of each others eyes when they feel like it, and when necessary, like making them to chose the right nest box, the hutches are easily separated.
Mine usually spend daytime outside, they can go in and out over a ramp, kits start doing that when they manage to jump the 25-30 cm step up to the ramp which is at about 4 weeks.

I don't need more than 2 does, and I retire them when problems start to pop up. Fury, now 10, had her last litter at 7, wasn't planned like so many others she managed to get (record was less than 30 seconds from escaping to being pregnant again), and I still have to be very carefull that she doesn't get an opportunity, I doubt she would survive it now.
Red, her daughter, had a surprise litter too at 7, hadn't bred her for a year, but a kit got stuck and only an emergency spay saved her (God bless my vet, came in on Saturday to do it). Those two old girls live together.
Magda died at 7 and had her last litter at 6, but the last litters were just two kits and sometimes dead kits - I think she had cancer. I kept one of her last daughters, Chantal, with her, and then one of her daughters from her first litter, Ruth.

Although I breed for meat my keepers pretty much have pet status.

 

[RabbitsOfTheCreek]

I've had three young Does that I had stay together (Two we're sisters and the third grew up with them)
They were a little bit rude to each other but overall they were ok with each other.
Soot - She was a black seal and I think the oldest - started attacking the one who wasn't the sister and that's why she died. She also started attacking her sister.
That was the only time I've had more than one Doe in a litter or staying together
But, that was probably because I have small rabbits and they have big attitudes

 

[BuffBrahmaBantam]

Here wood hutches are more common (cages are a No-No because of the polemic about freeing chicken from cages, every cage is now considered cruelty by many), each pair has two hutches that are connected with a tunnel. I think it helps a lot when they can get out of each others eyes when they feel like it, and when necessary, like making them to chose the right nest box, the hutches are easily separated.
Mine usually spend daytime outside, they can go in and out over a ramp, kits start doing that when they manage to jump the 25-30 cm step up to the ramp which is at about 4 weeks.

I don't need more than 2 does, and I retire them when problems start to pop up. Fury, now 10, had her last litter at 7, wasn't planned like so many others she managed to get (record was less than 30 seconds from escaping to being pregnant again), and I still have to be very carefull that she doesn't get an opportunity, I doubt she would survive it now.
Red, her daughter, had a surprise litter too at 7, hadn't bred her for a year, but a kit got stuck and only an emergency spay saved her (God bless my vet, came in on Saturday to do it). Those two old girls live together.
Magda died at 7 and had her last litter at 6, but the last litters were just two kits and sometimes dead kits - I think she had cancer. I kept one of her last daughters, Chantal, with her, and then one of her daughters from her first litter, Ruth.

Although I breed for meat my keepers pretty much have pet status.

How do you keep your rabbits from running off? In one photo it looks like there is no fence.


Can you share photos of your wooden hutches with tunnels?

 

[Preitler]

They don't run off, way less than cats or dogs. Sometimes it needs some work and patience to make them go home, like when they got spooked (they go everywhere else but do not compromise the warrens safety when they think something is off - never make an escaped rabbit nervous) or when a juvenile goes pighead, but that's rare. The most important thing for a rabbit is its home base, its warren. They learn that from the begin, at about 4 weeks they start to leave the hutch. Now it's easier because they learn from the older rabbits. Also, they listen to their names, and the young ones also to the shaking of the pellets pail.
Most time they are inside the fence on about 200m², when I work outside they can go out too, that's because of predators and that I can keep them from raiding the neighbours vegetable plot.
It took me quite some years to figure out what rabbits are capable of, and how to interact with them.

I can make some pictures tomorrow, but it's not a tidy place

 

[Preitler]

I've had three young Does that I had stay together (Two we're sisters and the third grew up with them)
They were a little bit rude to each other but overall they were ok with each other.
Soot - She was a black seal and I think the oldest - started attacking the one who wasn't the sister and that's why she died. She also started attacking her sister.
That was the only time I've had more than one Doe in a litter or staying together
But, that was probably because I have small rabbits and they have big attitudes

In my experience, trios can be difficult. Imho it is easier when there are just two - or more rabbits. Currently Ruth and Chantal live together with a 6 month old doe (needs to go soon, very skittish, I wouldn't sell that to anyone, no fun), an 8 week old litter of 6 and a 3 week old litter of 3. I added a 3rd hutch to the complex.

Characters need to be compatible, and with siblings that's more or less by chance if it works or not. I once tried to keep a 3rd doe with Fury and Red, but she could not handle living under Furys rule (my smallest, oldest and most dominant rabbit) and got depressed. Red is very stoic and can handle it.

 

[Albert]

Let me start by saying I am a moron.

I put two does together in a pen who were litter mates and had only been separated for a day. Wham-O! Fur everywhere!

 

[Preitler]

....


Can you share photos of your wooden hutches with tunnels?

I started a thread about that:
https://rabbittalk.com/threads/some-pictures-of-my-hutch-setup.35302/

 

[hotzcatz]

The bunnies here are angoras and temperament is a breeding consideration. We have had one doe who didn't get along with anybunny else, but usually the doe herd is mix and match in a large two story hutch. Currently, there's six in each layer. The hutch is ten feet long and about three feet deep and has boxes and ledges scattered about so they have places to hide and sit out of other bunny's way if they want. The bucks live in a similar sized hutch except it's been sectioned into six spaces. We did have a buck, Phineas Phogge, who got along with every buck and had the other bucks finding ways to get into his space to be with him. Never did figure out why. But mostly all bucks are kept separate. We only have six or seven bucks at any particular time, though.