Harlequins - white foot

[ladysown]

Been doing a bit of reading here and there on the white foot factor in Harlequins.

Some breeders/sources say to cull it out hard that it is usually the result of something in the buck. And to cull out everything from that line.

other breeders/sources say that it's an anomaly that just shows up once in a while and to cull out any that exhibit it.

Still others say it's the result of breeding magpie to japanese varieties.

What do the rest of you harle breeders think?

I just figure..they can't be shown, so why not pet them out or add them to the stew pot. Seems incorrect to use them for breeding. But I'm still fairly new at this game and wonder what others that breed them think.

 

[Anntann]

I don't know about whitefoot in harlies, but since you're talking harlequins...thought I'd ask how big do they get? I know they're a meat breed, but they're supposed to be a bit smaller than the NWZ...and also how quickly do they grow to the fryer size?

 

[ladysown]

7-9 pounds, though I have one big doe pushing that limit.

as to how quickly they grow to fryer size? about two weeks longer than New Zealands though I had one litter grow as quick as one new zealand litter. NZ litter had ten, the harle litter (raised by mini rex doe) had four.

 

[moonkitten]

When you join the American Harlequin Club they send you a booklet with articles written by LONG LONG time harle breeders. It's got tons of great information about breeding harlequins. They do address the "white spotting gene" issue. It appears most commonly as white toes or white feet, but the gene itself can cause white patches to appear anywhere on the Japanese harlequin. (This is not just a harlequin gene, it causes havoc in other breeds as well).

These articles suggest that it is a random sort of gene that pops up now and then. Not unlike the astrex fur or satin fur genes which also pop up from time to time, but don't appear with enough regularity to be easily culled out. A gene like DD (dilute) appears with such regularity that it is easy to identify. If both parents are dilute then all kits will be dilute. If both parents carry dilute there is a VERY good chance that some of the kits will be dilute. The white spotting gene (and astrex or satin gene) don't behave with this much predictability, making it very difficult to remove from the gene pool.

My policy is that no japanese with white spots will leave here except in a freezer bag. I've got so many good rabbits being produced and there is so little understanding of the breed out there, that I want to make sure only the best rabbits get spread around. I don't breed or sell those who display the white spotting gene and I'd like to try to remove it from my herd, but I think I would need a full barn of japanese to choose from and it would still take years. I do explain about the white spotting gene to anyone who buys a japanese from me, and how it might pop up and it's a DQ to be avoided/culled. Hopefully they pass on this info when they choose to sell white footed japanese.

I don't believe that it has anything to do with crossing magpie to japanese, just like I don't believe that breeding a white rabbit to a black rabbit will produce a gray rabbit. :lol: Of course, not all harlequin breeders agree, and there are plenty out there who will swear that white spots come from magpies or it's carried on the buck's line or whatever. Without an easy way to read the genetic code of each individual rabbit, I guess we will never know for sure (or until someone with thousands of $$ decides to test hundreds of harlequin rabbits just to see).

 

[AprilW]

This is very interesting to read. I just bought a few Harlequin youngsters myself. I must get my application for the Harlie breed club in ASAP. There doesn't seem to be a lot of information online about Harlequins. Can anyone direct me to a good site? I have seen the breed club site, but nothing else.

 

[moonkitten]

Thinking more....

It's also quite possible that if you had a "clean" japanese herd without the white spotting gene and crossed with magpie that you could introduce it unknowingly. I mean, how would you know if the magpies were expressing the gene since white on white doesn't show up? :?

I haven't seen a lot of good detail on harlequins on the net. The best information comes with membership to the American Harle club. They have a newsletter with articles as well as the breed book that is sent out when you join. A few years back one of the members did a study on inheritance of the split face. I don't think her sample size was big enough, but there was no correlation between split face on parents and kits. Very interesting stuff!

 

[goslingfever]

As an aside, I am seeing that with the exception of AprilW and myself, other harle owners posting here are in Canada.
Are they a popular breed up North then or is this a coincidence?
If they are big in CA I will *try* not to be too jealous... (as I desperately search in TN for breeders nearby)

 

[rabbitgeek]

We had Harlies for a while too. They are a little smaller than the standard meat breed. Because of the focus on markings, not enough people pay enough attention to the body type. So try to work on the body too.

They reach fryer size at 8-10 weeks, if you don't mind a 4 lb fryer. When you get past 12 weeks, the weight gain drops off so each pound of meat requires more feed per pound, so is more expensive. Also the hormones start kicking in and you get a stronger tasting rabbit, so you might as well harvest at 10 weeks, even if they haven't hit 5 lbs.

The white spotting gene does crop up in Harlies, and other breeds as well, like our friend on the home page with white spot on nose. While some people will cull an entire bloodline, I only cull the rabbit that has the white mark.

Some folks say it comes from crossing the Magpies and Japanese, but I don't think so. I treat it as just one of those things.

We also had Harlequin Dutch for a couple of years. If you think breeding for Harlequin markings was a headache, you should try putting it on a Dutch rabbit.

At least the culls are popular at the pet store. And you can harvest Dutch at 10 weeks with an excellent dressout percentage if you don't mind 1-1/2 lb carcass.

One more thing - While Harlequins can be hard to find, they are not one of the rare breeds. But a perfectly marked Harlequin is rare.

Have a good day!