feeding fodder when temp below freezing question

[Rainey]

We've just gotten settled into growing and feeding wheat fodder and now the temps are going to drop well below freezing (expected here, but it came on us rather abruptly this year). I've read in various older sources about natural feed not to feed forage that has been "frosted". I hope to hear from someone with experience feeding fodder at well below freezing. Do you just feed less more often to be sure it is eaten before it freezes? Do they eat it when frozen and if so is that a problem? And I guess I should ask the same about roots--will they freeze if not eaten immediately in very cold weather and will the rabbits eat them frozen and is that a problem? I keep thinking we've got this figured out but there are so many things I don't think of until they happen.

 

[MaggieJ]

I'll take a stab at this. The old books say not to feed forage that has been "frosted". I think (but I'm not certain) that the rationale for this is that in some plants chemical changes occur when the plants freeze.

I used to worry about feeding "frosted" greens but then it occurred to me that the wild European rabbit from which domestics are descended certainly do not stop eating plant leaves when frost hits. So I stopped worrying about it and have never had any problems.

Usually greens/fresh roots etc. are eaten first by the rabbits, so they would only rarely have time to freeze. I don't feed huge quantities of fresh foods in winter because they are simply not available. Fodder changes this, but I don't have a set up to grow large quantities, so again, it would be eaten promptly. In a colony there is more competition for the preferred foods so the rabbits tend to cluster around the fresh foods and eat until they are gone.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I'll take a stab at this. The old books say not to feed forage that has been "frosted". I think (but I'm not certain) that the rationale for this is that in some plants chemical changes occur when the plants freeze. Usually greens/fresh roots etc. are eaten first by the rabbits, so they would only rarely have time to freeze.

I'm unsure of the chemical changes as well, but have an observation to offer, so will also "take a stab at this".

I have noticed that in my garden "live" plants still rooted can recover from a hard frost. I have harvested lettuce growing in snow and had spinach plants frozen solid that once thawed were perfectly healthy and normal looking, whereas the lettuce and spinach that is cut and in my refrigerator turns to mush if exposed to the same temperature extremes.

I would definitely feed fresh forage in small enough amounts that it can be quickly consumed (as Maggie does) after being cut from the parent plant.

Following the line of thought that wild European rabbits eat plants after hard frosts, I think that your woodier bramble type plants would likely make up more of the winter diet than those with tender leaves, with the bark and inner cambium layer being a large part of the diet.

Wild rabbits probably don't have litters during the winter months as a result of the limited nutrients available, so being able to supplement with fresh greens, grains, and so forth would likely be important if you want continued production during those months.

 

[Rainey]

I would definitely feed fresh forage in small enough amounts that it can be quickly consumed (as Maggie does) after being cut from the parent plant.

Following the line of thought that wild European rabbits eat plants after hard frosts, I think that your woodier bramble type plants would likely make up more of the winter diet than those with tender leaves, with the bark and inner cambium layer being a large part of the diet.

Wild rabbits probably don't have litters during the winter months as a result of the limited nutrients available, so being able to supplement with fresh greens, grains, and so forth would likely be important if you want continued production during those months.

I'm feeding wheat fodder that I've grown, not cutting wheat grass grown in soil--does that make any difference?

We're also giving twigs cut now and will be giving willow and brambles cut in the summer and dried.

Not planning to breed again until late winter/early spring because of limited space but want to keep feeding some fresh stuff since that is what they were on all summer and will be again come spring.

This is more about how to participate on this site than about this particular thread, but is it ok to excerpt part of a post when replying? And how do some folks manage to put their reply within the quote but in another color so it is clear what is quote and what response? I tried but couldn't do it?

Thanks to all for help and patience.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I'm feeding wheat fodder that I've grown, not cutting wheat grass grown in soil--does that make any difference?

I don't know, since I haven't grown fodder... you will have to try it and see. The soil around the roots in a traditionally grown (in dirt!) plant are probably more protected and don't freeze solid, as the exposed fodder roots likely will.

This is more about how to participate on this site than about this particular thread, but is it ok to excerpt part of a post when replying?

Yes. I delete whole portions so just the parts that apply directly to the question or answer are in the quote. That way there isn't a huge block of text that people have to read over again.

By the way, I fixed your quote in the above post. The text needs to be bracketed on both ends like this:

[quote equals "MamaSheepdog"]text[/quote] except that in the first bracketed part there is an equal sign = not the word, and there are no spaces... like this:

quote="MamaSheepdog" but surrounded by the brackets.

And how do some folks manage to put their reply within the quote but in another color so it is clear what is quote and what response? I tried but couldn't do it?

Just insert your text in the quoted body, highlight it, and then go up to font colour and click on the color you want.

 

[MaggieJ]

If you want to have the quote included in your reply, just click on the QUOTE button for the relevant post. You'll find it at the top right of every post, along with buttons for editing, etc. If you only wish to excerpt part of the post, just delete the parts that you don't require.

When you are composing a post, you will see formatting buttons above the box where you type. These are pretty standard: B = bold, i = iltalics, u = underline. You can also change the font size in the drop down marked Normal. If you click on the Font colour button it will open up a box with lots of colours. Have fun!

I see MamaSheepdog types faster than I do! She beat me to it, as usual.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I see MamaSheepdog types faster than I do! She beat me to it, as usual.

MWA-HA-HA-HA-HAAAHHHH!!! :twisted:

Victory is MINE! AGAIN! :hooray:

 

[Rainey]

Thanks. I have used the quote button sometimes when replying, but other times have tried to quote shorter bits on my own and not gotten it right. Also saw the color option and tried but did something wrong because I just got text about color inserted at either end of the selected text. Don't know why I can grow fodder without mold (partly from all the good advice on the fodder threads, but seems some folks still find it problematic) but can't make my computer do what I want it to do. Will keep trying. Thanks again for corrections and advice and patience.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I have used the quote button sometimes when replying, but other times have tried to quote shorter bits on my own and not gotten it right.

The "other times" were probably when you hadn't yet hit the "Post a reply" button. If you highlight the text before doing that and then just hit "Quote" it gives you the entire post. Been there, done that. :roll:

Also saw the color option and tried but did something wrong because I just got text about color inserted at either end of the selected text.

It doesn't change the color until you either "Preview" or "Submit" your post. Being a Techno-Peasant myself, and one with a strong aversion (okay, okay... abnormally strong!) to typos and other errors, I generally hit "Preview" prior to submitting a post.

 

[WhiteWingRabbitry]

I personally freeze extra fodder (salad) for "emergencies" and for transitional feed for rabbits sold. I've never seen a problem occur from eating "frosted" greens. This is just my personal experience. A lot of old books also say not to handle kits, and not to feed greens to kits until they are at least 6 months old. I bundle it up with "old wives tales" and look at the rabbit in their natural environment. I have seen rabbits eat grass after a frost, and snitch plants from gardens that didn't get harvested before the frost. It might not have quite as much nutritional value (same as cooked), but I don't think that it is "unsafe".

We are below freezing now (most of the time), I feed once a day. Except for the growouts and nursing does, who get more, most of the rabbits finish their food within an hour or two, so probably not very frozen before being finished.

 

[JessiL]

Good point, WhiteWingRabbitry - if feeding frosted grass was a problem, I would lose all my tractored rabbits every year! We have sub-freezing temps off and on from October to May around here...

For what it's worth, I raised a litter on barley fodder and hay last winter. They grew ok, not quite as fast as pellets and hay, but about equal to pasture at that time. I did like how they seemed to be better hydrated than the pellet rabbits, because even the rapidly frozen fodder contained more moisture than what the other rabbits got from their twice daily water visits. But everyone survived and did just fine, just not as awesome as spring and fall grow-outs.

I would watch your rabbits closely and be ready to supplement with oats or pellets. But I bet they'll do just fine, and probably learn to eat their fodder while it's still nice and fresh.