Cross breed vigor

[BrianRme]

I am just getting ready to set up for meat rabbit production. I am interested in commercial meat rabbits with good feed conversion and quick weight gain. That sort of limits me to the Californian and the New Zealand.

I have read a lot about cross breed vigor in other species and was planning to raise cross breeds for my rabbits also. So my plan was to get Californian Does and New Zealand Buck's or visa versa and this create a hybrid that hopefully will be healthier, larger and grow faster than the pure bred of either breed.

I would appreciate any insight on this if there are commercial producers out the that do this or if anyone knows if this is a valid concept.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Dood]

My American Chinchilla x (New Zealand x Flemish) grow better than my purebred AmChins but so far my AmChin x Cali are a disappointment, on several levels

Because NZ are bigger than Cali's breeders usually cross a meaty fast growing Cali buck onto NZ does with excellent fertility, mothering skills and milk production.

You will need a purebred NZ buck to produce replacement does.

 

[RothsRabbits]

I used to breed those together. But there are lots of other meat breeds to cross breed with those to make excellent meats. Silver fox and champagne D'argent are another popular meat breed now days.

I was first skeptical, raising NZW for about 20 years, then getting into Californians. Then cross breeding those together butchering 5-6lbs in 8 weeks.

Then I got silver fox for pasture rabbits, and have been cross breeding them with californian and cali/nzw does. They have been growing great. But the current two litters are the last meat mutts. I am going to focus on improving the champagne and silver fox breeds in my area.

I have some great silver fox lines that are almost out growing the cali's.

Anyways, stick to breeding two purebreds and your first generation will be great meat rabbits.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

So my plan was to get Californian Does and New Zealand Buck's or visa versa and this create a hybrid that hopefully will be healthier, larger and grow faster than the pure bred of either breed.

I have no personal experience with cross breeding (aside from my pet project of breeding maned Rex furred rabbits), but my understanding is that the first generation crosses have better growth rates, as long as you start with good stock. Crossing two mediocre rabbits will not give you the same results as crossing two outstanding rabbits.

Supposedly the "hybrid vigor" and attendant weight gain is lost in future generations, so as Dood said, you will want to maintain purebred lines of NZs or Cals as replacement animals to cross to one another. For best results, all Cal/NZ crosses should be eaten and not kept back for breeding.

 

[michaels4gardens]

I like to breed an [F1 ]cross for breedstock does, and then use an outside line buck for terminal cross[ F2 ]for market rabbits. that way I get hi-brid vigor for does and the terminal offspring.

__________ Sun Mar 16, 2014 10:17 am __________

for the program I mentioned, the down side is {as Dood said}, -- you have to keep 3 pure but separate lines, and production does [crossbred does] offspring should not be kept as replacement does. -so-- this program is only a financial advantage [keeping the extra pure buck and doe lines]where a lot of breeder does are used.

 

[GBov]

And crosses don't sell as well so, if you want to sell a few to offset costs, pure bred is the way to go.

 

[michaels4gardens]

And crosses don't sell as well so, if you want to sell a few to offset costs, pure bred is the way to go

if your goal is to sell "purebred"rabbits-- then none of this conversation is applicable, and hi-brid vigor can only be achieved [sort of] by crossing unrelated lines within a breed.
If your aim is to sell meat rabbits, then this conversation is very applicable, and if you plan on keeping more then 20 does, the 3 way cross, --F1 breedstock does, and F2 terminal cross is a very good idea with a 10 to 20% gain- [rate of gain, productivity, and feed conversion]

 

[grumpy]

California bucks over NZW does is an excellent avenue for fast-finishing fryers.

I've got some crossbreds I've been trying for over a year. Out of 12 does
bought, only 2 remain. Soon, they will be gone. They're just not as prolific
as my commercial NZW does. Nor, do they milk as well.
I've given them ample time to prove themselves.
Thus far, they've fallen short of my expectations.

I do have one 50/50 NZW/Cal buck that I've used for the past several years.
His youngsters are quick to reach market weight and weigh much more
than they appear to. They surprise me with every litter I send to market.
I don't save any of his youngsters back for breeding purposes.

I keep two lines pure. A small herd of Cal's, and the larger group of NZW's.
I've considered other breeds to cross into the group for faster weight gain.
I haven't made up my mind, yet.

grumpy.

 

[BlueMoods]

I like the Cali buck on NZ doe best for fryers but pure NZ does well too, just not quite as fast growing. I have a Cali doe just for replacement stock and a NZ buck for both meat production and replacement stock.

I have done NZ on Chin and NZ on Cali as well and those are not bad but the best for fast growing and easy mothering for the doe is Cali on NZ.

 

[TwoAcreDream]

Years ago, when I had rabbits for a 10 year span, I had about 30 breeding does. I sold to a meat market and crossed many Cals with NZs. Fast growers.

My current herd has 6 pure cali does, 2 bucks and 3 juniors coming.
I also have several NZ white does ( 1 pure, several mixes). I use the cali bucks on them. I hope to have some pure californian breeding stock to sell versus trying for a meat market. I have 2 current litters of calis. The 2 young moms in my avator here. One had 7 and the other 9. For their first litters, I am beyond pleased. I have only been back with rabbits since last July. This spring and summer will be where I tweek my numbers. I have mini lops, mini rexes, and a few dwarfs. Several mixed does who are pulling their weight by having nice litters and who willing foster other kits. I won't be able to do big numbers ever again, but I am quite happy to be playing with rabbits on my small scale.

If I was able to do it commerical style, it would be NZ and Calis.

 

[Ramjet]

Find an Altex buck & use him as a terminal sire (All offspring are butchered). The growth rate I get from an Altex/Cali doe bred to my rex buck is .... absolutely amazing. They are 1/3rd bigger than my purebred Rex @ ~8 weeks.

 

[michaels4gardens]

I like crossing 2 unrelated lines of pure New Zealand, or New Zealand Flemish cross, to get an f1 doe, and then using a california buck over that cross for my terminal F2 offsping, [for commercial meat production]--But an "All-Tex" or any fast growing white rabbit breed would work for one of the crosses. Some of my best production does were F1 cross does from Flemish over New Zealand, with a California over that for terminal cross.

 

[fogcity]

How many does are you going to have? Is your objective the largest volume of whole carcass weight in the shortest amount of time with the least amount of inputs? Unless it is on a large scale I don't think rabbit x over rabbit y (all other things being equal) will make a difference.

 

[michaels4gardens]

How many does are you going to have? Is your objective the largest volume of whole carcass weight in the shortest amount of time with the least amount of inputs? Unless it is on a large scale I don't think rabbit x over rabbit y (all other things being equal) will make a difference.

IMHO---That has not been my experience, so-- I disagree, -- in my research, there is a significant advantage using an F1 cross in meat rabbit production. [but I may not know what you mean by "large scale" ] --but-- I only have about 25 rabbits now-- and the principal is valid for this "very small scale" home food production, and very small,outside sales, rabbitry.
When we had 148 does in production, it was very important then also-- in that "small" commercial rabbitry-- When I worked at a place tending 450 does it was very important, in that "medium size" rabbitry.
I was once head of a research and development division for a animal feed company, and we did a lot of feed testing on a wide variety of animals, it was well established as a "fact" that hi-bred vigor was an important aspect of meat animal production.---JMHO