Country Mile's First Kindle -- First Pic

[Frecs]

Country Mile has given birth! She gave birth to 8 kits but 3 are stillborn. I came home from work and found that she'd given birth on the wire not in the nestbox. The stillborn ones were covered with hay. The live one's were partially covered and a bit of fur was over them. When I started uncovering the stillborn ones she watched and whined. I put the live kits in the nestbox. I didn't know whether to cover them or leave them so she would see them. I hope someone will respond with advise on that and if there is anything I can do to encourage her to care for them. They seemed cool to the touch. Will she take care of them? Is there anyway I can encourage her to care for them?

Jumpp still has not given birth. I'll give her another day or so before deciding she isn't pregnant after all.

 

[mystang89]

Congrats! Is that the SF? I hate giving advice as most of the times I'm wrong but if it were me I would punch a hole with my fist in the nest and then put the kits in there slightly covered with fur. That's pretty much what my NZ did and her's always seemed to stay covered without me doing anything. Is Country mile a first time mom or has she done this before?
I hope someone who knows more about his will tell you for sure though.

 

[Frecs]

Yes, Country Mile is an SF. This is her first time giving birth/being a mom. I probably should put them deeper under the hay and perhaps close together?

 

[garden lady]

Congratulations!

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I would suggest putting a towel in the dryer and warming it up. While it is getting warm, you can keep the kits in your shirt against your skin so they start to warm up. Once the towel(s) are warmed up, make a hollow in the center and put the kits in it. Close the dryer door to keep the heat in, and tell everyone that is home not to turn the dryer on. Leave them in there for about 15 minutes or so until they are completely warmed up.

While the kits are out of the way, try to pull some fur from Country Mile's sides and belly. Make a hollow in the hay as Mystang suggested, so they have a little "bowl" to keep them contained. Place some of the fur in the bottom, and when you put the kits in put more fur over them.

If you can't get fur from the doe, you can use dryer lint, feathers, or pulled cotton balls... but fur is the best thing, so try to get that.

Good luck! :clover:

:congratulations:

 

[mystang89]

I hear that first time mom's often lose their first litter. My Cali lost 4/6 of hers so I had to take the others away and give to a surrogate. I would keep an eye and check to see they were getting fed. If not then you might want to think about a surrogate if you have one.
I'm sure when MSD or Maggie or Oneacrefarm....or pretty much anyone else other than me, sees this they will know what to say.
EDIT: LOL, I knew we could count on MSD

 

[Frecs]

MSD, thanks for the advice! I did what you said with warming the kits in the warm dryer while I pulled fur from Country Mile. I thought I'd never pull enough fur to make a difference but I finally got a decent amount. At least, I think so. The kits seemed more active coming out of the dryer. So, I put them into the bowl of fur in the nestbox and covered them a bit with fur and hay. I made myself leave and go to church rather than fret over Country Mile and her kits. I just checked after getting home and tending to the dogs and so far, so good I think. I guess the next hurtle is to see if they survive the night and if there is evidence of her nursing them.

Is it normal for a doe to stop eating her pellets around kindling time? She is eating hay and she ate a grape I gave her but she isn't eating much if any of her pellets. Yesterday, I gave her some cuttings from a rose bush and she ate that...just not the pellets.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I'm glad they seem to be doing better.

This post will help you determine if they have been fed:

fed-vs-unfed-kit-pictures-t3052.html

My does go off their feed a bit before and after kindling, but they never refuse the greens I give them as a "post-kindling treat"! I have been giving parsley lately, and found out that parsley stimulates contractions, so it was a lucky accident. Parsley is also an appetite stimulant, so is a good choice in more ways than one.

 

[ZRabbits]

Congratulations! Had my first litter and my doe stopped eating pellets right before kindling. But the next day she absolutely devoured everything. Gave her parsley and wheat grass when I woke up and saw kits. She's been eating her pellets regularly ever since.

I was nervous about Luna's first time because does do sometimes have a bad experience the first time. Hoping all continues to go well. Look forward of seeing updated pics when they start to get their fur.

Karen

 

[Frecs]

Morning update: 3 kits survived the night. Country Mile was pulling fur in a serious way during the night but did not put it on her babies but rather piled it in the corner of the cage by the door. I added that fur to the nest. One of the kits had a swollen/full belly but the other two did not so much so I'm not convinced she nursed them or perhaps it was an incomplete nurse? Anyway, a friend who also breeds rabbits had two does kindle yesterday and has offered to foster the survivors to one of them. We'll make the transfer today. She has both SFs and NZ and it was the NZ that kindled so we'll know mine from her's. I'll probably gift her one of the survivors for her efforts if she wants one for her herd.

I could be wrong but it seems to me that Country Mile is trying to figure out what to do but is just not figuring it out fast enough to successfully mother her first litter.

Next question: once the kits are fostered out, what do I do for Country Mile? do I need to feed her anything to help dry up her milk? anything to help restore condition before breeding again?

 

[mystang89]

I don't have a good answer. All I can say is to keep an eye on her nipples and make sure they don't get swollen. The last thing you want is for her to develop mastitis.

 

[AnnClaire]

Actually, I would not consider fostering the kits just yet. Your doe should feed 2x per day with such a small litter, so if you don't think 2 are getting fed, just take out the biggest one and let the smaller ones get a head start on nursing. The larger kit won't be hurt with only one meal one day, and it will give the smaller kits a chance to get a good start. The doe will only nurse the kits about 3-5 minutes 1-2x per day.

You can also hold the doe in the box for an extra minute if you really think it is necessary, but I really don't recommend that because if she struggles she could stomp the kits. You could also flip the doe in between your legs and put the smaller kits on her tummy for nursing if you want, then put them all back in the cage and she should still nurse the one kit, giving the smaller ones a second go at the milk bar.<br /><br />__________ Fri Oct 26, 2012 2:54 am __________<br /><br />If you do foster, I would foster the largest kit and keep the smaller ones on her so they can nurse from all the teats and help her dry up naturally.

You are probably right that she sort of knows what to do, just not quite all at the right time just yet. The more success she has this time, the better success she will have the next time

 

[ZRabbits]

I had one smaller kit in my first litter. For the first couple of days, I flipped my doe to give the littlest one an extra feed. At 3 weeks old, he/she is still the smallest but is doing well.

Have to say, I got lucky with my First Time Mom and my first litter so far. It's like she's done this all before. Just needed to give her littlest one some extra feeds.

Karen

 

[Frecs]

My friend's husband came yesterday and agreed that the two smaller ones were definitely starving and the larger one was questionable. We decided to go ahead and foster them to their doe. Word this morning is that the doe took the babies without a problem (they put vanilla on her nose) and the babies are feeding well.

I'm going to feed Country Mile some mint to dry her up, parsley and other herbs and weedy-goodies to build her up and re-breed both my does in a week. (Jumpp, the other doe, apparently was not pregnant after all.) They and I are learning this thing together.

 

[OneAcreFarm]

My friend's husband came yesterday and agreed that the two smaller ones were definitely starving and the larger one was questionable. We decided to go ahead and foster them to their doe. Word this morning is that the doe took the babies without a problem (they put vanilla on her nose) and the babies are feeding well.

I'm going to feed Country Mile some mint to dry her up, parsley and other herbs and weedy-goodies to build her up and re-breed both my does in a week. (Jumpp, the other doe, apparently was not pregnant after all.) They and I are learning this thing together.

Frec, I am glad the kits are going to be ok. For next time, you can try holding the doe over the box to let the kits nurse or flipping her in your lap, on her back, and holding the kits to nurse one at a time. Sometimes, it just takes a day or two for new does to "get it"...like her fur pulling after the fact. That was very nice of your friend to offer to foster the kits. Just FYI...most does will accept foster kits, no vanilla required! Good idea on the mint, but hold off on the parsley, as it is actually a lactation stimulant. I bet her second litter is a home run! You could go ahead and rebreed her right away, since she is not nursing. She will be most receptive in the few days after kindling, and may have a larger litter. That tends to be the case when they are bred back soon after kindling.

 

[Frecs]

Thanks, OAF! I'm still learning and appreciate all the info!

I'll hold off on the parsley and as soon as Sandy passes us by, I'll re-breed Country Mile and try again with Jumpp.