Commercial Producers Feed - Pellets only? Or Hay supplement?

[CanadianRabbit]

Just curious what the bigger sized producers are doing. Do they only feed pellets (for speed and ease).

I feed a lot of hay with my pellets - and a fair bit falls through the cage as the rabbits sort through it. I can see how in a large commercial setup this could mean more management.

Anyone seen any research on pellet only vs pellet + hay? (and also vs pasture finished)

 

[grumpy]

I've fed pellets only...AND I've fed the combo.

My own opinion is that the hay adds a needed
ingredient for the lower gut to function at its best.
I've had problems recently with youngsters
coming down with lower gut issues. They usually
don't last very long once they become symptomatic.

The addition of hay, hopefully, will ease this problem.
True there's a fair percentage that is lost.
However, the potential benefits may well outweigh the cost.
I feed a higher percentage protein 18%...so that may well
add to the problems.

grumpy.

 

[CanadianRabbit]

Grumpy - I'm going to start another post as well on this topic - but interested in your thoughts on the higher protein pellets. I also am feeding my kits 18% protein because that is what I continued to give their mother after she gave birth. The kits then started the 18% pellets and I didn't even think to switch.

 

[SatinsRule]

Hay helps, but it is not an end-all, be-all food source for rabbits.

Feeding nothing but grains works and makes sense for a lot of breeders who may not be able to find a cost-effective pelleted ration local to them, but for breeders like myself who use pellets on a regular basis, buying several bags of straight grain for $25+ per 50 lb. bag, then spending all the time either sorting and/or mixing it makes less sense, whereas using a pelleted ration which contains all the grains I'd ever want to feed them in the first place for less money per bag makes all the sense in the world. The key is to pay close attention to the ingredient labels and know what the feed contains. If the label lists "plant products, plant by-products", etc., as its primary ingredients, that feed is probably not a quality feed to use IMHO.

As Grumpy indicated, hay works very well for keeping the chutes cleaned out, but it is hardly a food source in and of itself. Someone may chime in and label me as a liar for daring to state as much, but they're as entitled to their opinions as I am to mine.

And if I lived in your locale, I'd never give a second thought to the 18% ration you have them on now unless it wasn't yielding the results you wanted. IMHO, that percent ration gives better results in northern locales than in southern ones, and that explains why it's so difficult to find 18% rations down here other than by special orders that take weeks to get here.

 

[CanadianRabbit]

SatinsRule - I'm replying to you in both threads now

Don't worry I'm not out to call you a liar! I appreciate all feedback and being part of the discussion as I continue to learn about raising rabbits.

I did find an interesting research paper that found some interesting results. http://om.ciheam.org/om/pdf/c08/95605295.pdf

Berseem Clover Hay and Barley performed just as well as pellets in their study (and they claim it's economical efficiency blows pellets out of the water.)

Anybody using Berseem Clover?

 

[grumpy]

We've had some dramatic swings in daytime highs
and night time lows this past month.
Some mornings were downright chilly.

Now the high today was 96 degrees.
Crazy weather, for sure.
It can't help but mess with their innards.

Grumpy

 

[fuzzy9]

I'm not a large breeder, but I feed a combo of hay and pellets to my breeders, and weaned kits that I'm raising up to keep in my breeding line. For freezer camp kits they get pellets and hay until they are weaned. Once they are weaned I take about a week to wean them down to no hay, and all pellets. It's not a matter of hay loss, it's a matter of my grow out time decreases significantly on an all pellet diet, and since I only have limited cage space now, I can move them out quicker to save space by the time the next litters are ready to wean.

Have never really had a problem with an all pellet diet. I think here alot depends on the water intake along with the pellets. I've seen some "air filled intestines" a while back, but those had run their water out.....someone had laid on the valve overnight, and ran the water bottle dry. Have never seen it since.

 

[SatinsRule]

SatinsRule - I'm replying to you in both threads now

Don't worry I'm not out to call you a liar! I appreciate all feedback and being part of the discussion as I continue to learn about raising rabbits.

I did find an interesting research paper that found some interesting results. http://om.ciheam.org/om/pdf/c08/95605295.pdf

Berseem Clover Hay and Barley performed just as well as pellets in their study (and they claim it's economical efficiency blows pellets out of the water.)

Anybody using Berseem Clover?

There is a particular statement which stands out to me in that study:

"hay-barley diet could be recommend as non-pelleted rabbit diet if ìt is enriched with vitamin-mineral premix as feed additive to improve more its nutritive value."

Everyone can interpret however they wish, but to me, that is the person's or study group's way of outright admitting that the proposed grain diet is lacking in key nutrients.

It also depends upon the type of feed in question used in the study. There are some commercial feeds on the market that you couldn't give to me. Their nutritional content is such that they'd be far better suited for use in a deer feeder than in any of my rabbit feeders.

As for clover, I generally stay away from it. There are types of clover that aren't particularly good for use with rabbits, and trying to get a straight answer from anyone who bales it as to which type of clover is in their hay is like trying to get our president to admit that he's ever wrong about anything.

Not sure what it typically costs in Canada, but I will repeat that a 50 lb. bag of barley or any type of oats (whole, crimped, rolled) generally costs over $25 here. Buying it would be counterproductive in terms of cost and time because I'd be nearly doubling my feed costs by doing so, and the time spent storing and mixing it prior to feeding would amount to an annoyance more than anything else.

As for hay, it does well to keep digestive systems regular and maintains apetites during the summer months. It adds little nutritionally in terms of vitamins and minerals.

 

[Mary Ann's Rabbitry]

Feeding hay is your choice to do so.....Hay also give them something to do and helps keep there teeth down..

 

[Secuono]

Use hay cubes and there won't be a massive mess and waste issue. There are several types of cubes out there, in the horse section. Takes a lot of time to get some rabbits to eat them, but they are very fresh, they don't bleach out like loose hay does.
Many give wood blocks for wearing teeth down and something to do.
Lots say to use high protein and high fiber pellet with low fat. They don't give hay, as the fiber is already in there.

 

[akane]

Our loose hay is so rich(high quality clover/alfalfa) it was causing constant molt in one of the breeds so we are feeding only pellets right now with some treats. Not noticing any health problems. The coats are clearing up and aside from the netherland pen which has too many rabbits per feeder everyone is a good weight. The floors are staying cleaner and easier to keep dry in the summer humidity with no bad hay. When we cleaned out a colony earlier this year as we went through the layers of wasted hay we started having rabbits die from eating the wet stuff under the top layer. Now I just have to scoop up hair from old nests that are being dug out by the rabbits before making new nests. The cages are easier to clean too. We may go to hay cubes for everyone. My indoor rabbits eat them no problem since it's the only hay they've ever gotten.

Most breeders I know if they give hay say to give a handful per rabbit a couple times a week for digestive health and entertainment. That's all they do.

 

[ckcs]

I've not seen any difference when using a Pellet only vs Pellets and hay. I use hay for 3 of my rabbits as a bedding in their solid bottom cages. There is enough in their cages that they can eat as much as they like. All my rabbit are healthy. My death rate of kits (30-40 so far) and adults (14) is zero. Other than kits that were born dead I have not lost a single animal. One several days old did fall out of a top cage in a three tier unit but I don't count that as it was accidental. This is over a 4 year period and one year of breeding. I attribute most of my success to the environment. All my rabbits are raised inside our home spread out over 4 rooms. They enjoy a relatively constant 72 degree temperature and environmental stress is minimal.

I see no harm in adding hay to their diets though. I have some rabbits that I through some in once or twice a week but others see little to no hay. In wire bottom cages I find a lot of waste but I don't use hay racks either.

 

[SatinsRule]

Use hay cubes and there won't be a massive mess and waste issue.

Anytime I've ever tried to use hay cubes in the past, I've wound up with hay soup in each of the cages. There is a mess and waste issue when that happens.

 

[GBov]

I usually give hay as well as pellets but its getting hard to find good hay, with all the rain we had this summer every bale I buy seems to be musty. Breaking them open and fluffing it up to air seems to help but its a right pain to have to do.

Some of my herd waste it all and others eat every whisp, seems to be an individual rabbit thing.

Air in the guts? I get that in my fryers, what causes that?