Coccidiosis clarification

[Miss M]

I think I've just seen our first case of coccidiosis. The liver had a number of white squiggly lines on it that you could feel.

I've done some searching around, and I just want to make sure -- this renders only the liver inedible, but the kidneys and heart would still be okay, right? The reason I ask is that I don't know which kidneys and heart went with that rabbit, so I would need to discard them all. I do know the rabbit meat is still fine. I discarded the liver in question.

Also, the livers in this bunch generally don't look quite as good as I'm used to. No more with spots, but I discarded another one just because it was a bit too light, and, I don't know, it looked kind of like it had a brain print on it or something -- it was smooth and firm, but the color was off, and it was like some of it was lighter, and gave it the look of a maze. I didn't know what to think of it.

So that was two livers down, but I have a couple more that have that maze-like look. Just not as light. It's really very subtle. They are smooth and firm. I'm guessing they're okay, but I just want some confirmation since they're just not as dark, rich, purple-brown as I'm used to getting.

 

[ladysown]

just toss the liver.

I tend to toss mine too if they don't look quite right.

so now you medicate and get rid of the problem.

 

[Miss M]

The whole litter is gone now... do I need to medicate? I was going to burn the cages involved tomorrow.

 

[ladysown]

biggest thing with coccidia is keeping the cages clean. It's not hard to medicate.

they probably got it from their parents...

comes for ingesting occysts that are 24 hours old. I'd medicate the parents to keep it from re-occuring. and then focus on keeping all those bunny berries cleaned up.

 

[MaggieJ]

I would definitely toss any livers from that batch that do not look perfect. It sounds like a very small infestation. Disinfect the cage for sure.

The only time I had coccidiosis in a litter was in a particularly filthy bunch that routinely pooped and peed in their food and water. It never recurred and I did not medicate. But it may be a good idea to medicate the parents... particularly the doe as she was in contact with the kits, which presumably the buck was not.

 

[fuzzy9]

Another GREAT post! Learning so much here! Love this resource!

 

[avdpas77]

I tried to find a good picture of what coccidiosis normally looks like, but could not. It usually manifest in the liver as yellow colored nodules. I have never seen coccidiosis as bad as in this picture, but it was the best I could do. Once or twice, I have seen livers that were lighter in color than normal with whitish squiggly lines on them (not raised). I do not know if this is a manifestation of coccidiosis or not, I think it might be caused by some other condition.

 

[Miss M]

I was kicking myself for not saving that liver long enough to take a picture of it to post. It was nowhere near as bad as the one in the picture.

This was a dirty bunch. Oddly, the other litter, by Squeak, was dirtier -- but no coccidiosis.

The buck, Pinto, had no contact with the babies. So I will medicate Pearl, who is pregnant. Would it be a good idea to medicate Squeak, too, since her litter was really, really dirty... even though there was no coccidiosis in her litter? Maybe I should medicate Pinto, since he had a rendez-vous with Pearl since that litter. Should I medicate Fluffy and Nibbles, since Fluffy has been in Pinto's cage since then? Fluffy is nursing, and her babies are exploring and starting to drink the water, so I guess I should wait?

So... from looking at other threads, these are my options:

sulfaquinoxaline 1g/L of drinking water for at least 5 days (or Ottersatin's site says "5 days on, 5 days off then 5 days on again.. [one teaspoon per gallon of water] Repeat the treatment in 30 days to get any hatchlings.")

Sul-met 2 tsp per gallon for 5 days (or Ladysown said orally for "two days on, four days off, three days on, three days off, two days on two days off until you hit two weeks"... but I don't know the oral dosage.)

Corid 9.6% 5ml per gallon of water for 5 days with the solution as their only source of water, off 5 days, on 5 days (Arachyd)

Medicated pellets for 2 weeks. Don't know what the medication is, or what the feed is... is this rabbit food, or is it one of those things that's made for horses, but you can use it with rabbits? I just don't know what to ask for.

Are these dosages correct? There's such a huge difference between the sulfaquinoxaline dose Jessykah asked about, and the one Ottersatin recommended. I don't really know what's right. I want to kill the bug, but I don't want to overmedicate!

 

[Devon's Mom Lauren]

You can get rabbit pellets that are medicated for cocci. To be honest this would be the best way as the instructions on the bag are rabbit specific. I would do everyone now that the fryers are gone.This way you might med them only once or twice a year. It is easier to prevent than to cure.

 

[Miss M]

Should the feed store have these pellets? Is there any sort of particular name they have?

Also, Squeak has a set of 5-week-olds, and Fluffy has 2-week-olds... Can I just put the feed in there for all to eat?

Or do I wait to medicate Squeak for another week, when I'll be removing her litter, and then medicate just her, but not the babies? But go ahead and medicate Fluffy & Nibbles, since those babies aren't going to eat much food for a couple of weeks yet?

I don't have plans to medicate Pearl's current 8-week-olds... they'll be going to freezer camp in 2 weeks.

Sorry for all the questions!!!

__________ Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:45 pm __________

I burned the cages the litter we just butchered were in. One of the feeders had urine spray on it and in it. :x So I burned it, too.

But at least I was finally able to move poor Pearl's newer litter out and into their own cage. I'll burn her cage tomorrow.

 

[ottersatin]

I have posted the information below this paragraph,
though suppose the information was missed.

I would not use medicated feed as I don't believe it is necessary.
If you have/are breeding rabbits with such a weak immune system
you would do better by Culling them and starting with a more healthy line.
You can eliminate all disease with proper culling, feeding and husbandry.
If you sweep the cling-ons from the cage floor within 24 hours
you will do much to prevent re-infestation with Coccidiosis.
It takes 24 hours for the eggs to become infective.
Ottersatin. ldtimer:

COCCIDIOSIS

There are two types of Coccidiosis Intestinal and Live Form. The disease is caused by a protozoan parasite which attacks the bile duct or the intestinal tract. There are ten different species of the genus Eimeria which may infect the intestine. Generally these are not of much concern, unless a case of enteritis makes an appearance. This can lead to enterotoxemia and or Mucoid enteropathy, although enterotoxemia has been reported in rabbits which are free of Coccidiosis. Liver Coccidiosis is a problem as it causes white spots on the liver which renders that part of the rabbit the rabbit uneatable.

SYMPTOMS

Include lack of appetite, rough coat, loss of weight, poor weight gain, potbelly, listlessness and diarrhea. All of which often lead to death.

TREATMENT

The best treatment is the use of sulfaquinoxyline in the drinking water as the only available water for 5 days on, 5 days off then 5 days on again.. [one teaspoon per gallon of water] Repeat the treatment in 30 days to get any hatchlings. DO NOT use the treated rabbit as a food source for at least 30 days after the last treatment.

PREVENTION

Brush the cling-ons from the cage floor within 24 hours. This will aid greatly in preventing the spread of Coccidiosis. Do not allow fecal contamination of the feed or water.
Ottersatin. ldtimer:

 

[MaggieJ]

Ottersatin, this is the third time I have asked you to edit your information about eating rabbits who have liver coccidiosis. It is not the rabbit that become inedible - just the liver.

I really hate to take the role of heavy-handed administrator, but this is incorrect information and I really cannot allow it to pass. Please amend it.

 

[Miss M]

Ottersatin, I mentioned your treatment guidelines in a previous post up there, so I didn't miss it.

I also don't have the option of culling my herd... four of the rabbits are protected by promises to the kids, and two are protected by a promise to the lady who gave them to us. The kids know that once these rabbits are gone, there probably will be no more such promises, but these were our first pair of rabbits, and a pair from our first litter.

I don't know that they have weak immune systems... only one rabbit has exhibited any signs of coccidiosis so far, and it was from a litter that was really dirty, to the point of spraying urine all over one of the feeders. I had to take the resting pad out, because they had smeared fecal matter all over it. I think that even with a really good immune system, they would eventually get sick anyway with this kind of behavior. Thankfully, I'm not seeing behavior this bad from the litters I've got coming up now! Nor will they stick around long enough to become sexually mature and start spraying, like the litter we just butchered.

I do need to know these things, whether I can find medicated food or just medication:

Should I treat Squeak's 5-week-olds along with her, or wait a week when they will no longer be with her?

Can I treat Nibbles and Fluffy, with Fluffy's 2-week-olds in there?

Thank you to anyone who can answer these questions!

 

[MaggieJ]

Miss M, there is no need to cull any rabbits other than the ones you are sending to freezer camp. It is certainly one way of dealing with a coccidiosis incident but not the only one. And this is an incident, not a major infestation. You could go years before seeing a spotty liver again. I haven't seen another since that one litter back circa 2007... and that was 2-3 rabbits out of a litter of at least 10. And believe me, I examine carefully the liver of any rabbit I butcher!

Likewise, please ignore that comment of Ottersatin's that a rabbit who has a spotty liver due to coccidiosis is "uneatable". Ottersatin knows a great deal about rabbits, but like all of us he has a few blind spots. I've asked him to quit posting that particular piece of misinformation. You should not eat the liver, of course, but the muscle meat will not harm you in any way.

Medicated feed may or may not be available in your area. Perhaps Devon's Mom Lauren will post a brand name that you can search for, but remember that she is in Ontario and the brands and formulae may not be the same. You could simply wait, breed the rabbits again, step up sanitation (sometimes raising the feed and water dishes helps keep them clean and it is a good idea to remove promptly any bunny berries that the rabbits may have access to). If you get another round of spotty livers in the next litters, you will know that medication of some sort is needed.

Just my take on your situation.

 

[Miss M]

I can wait? I had no idea.

Well... I did see Pearl yesterday eating some hay that had fallen on the floor and had been soiled (I was hurriedly trying to get it all out, and she was eating some of it). Maybe I should treat at least Pearl. Then again, it sounds like she should have been sick by now if she had been infected by the behavior of her last litter. I don't know if her litter I just removed has any issues. Maybe, when we butcher them in two weeks, if I see any spotty livers then, I'll go ahead and treat her then.

Thank you for calming my panic, Maggie!

 

[ladysown]

I would cull first...as in wait for a time period when you don't have growers almost ready to butcher as you need to give time for the meds to clear their systems (about a month to be safe).

Then treat.. takes about 2 weeks and then you monitor by checking livers.

Since it's not a deadly situation...just an eating/cleanliness thing that can weaken a rabbit to susceptible to other thing it's not like clear it up NOW immediacy thing.

keep the buns clean
wait until you have a time period that you can wean/butcher and then medicate.

Go to your local feed store, get some albon or corid or sul-met and treat them.
wait a month, then butcher.

Doesn't hurt the kits to be treated.
Give them lots of hay.

Some have success putting it in the water.
I found it best to simply grab each rabbit and give a dose manually. (they drank better that way).

 

[MaggieJ]

All I know is that when I eventually sent to freezer camp the doe and buck that were the parents of the kits in question, there was no sign of coccidiosis on their livers. And none of the rabbits were ever sick. You may wish to play it safe and treat some or all of your adults, but there is certainly no need to panic or to rush into treatment until you are confident it is the best choice.

 

[sjlattimore88]

Is coccidiosis dangerous to humans if it, is ingested by humans from eating a bad rabbit liver

 

[Miss M]

Well, turns out I have to wait at least until I can find medication. I asked about it at the feed store, and they carry no cocci medications at all. I was going to wait until I saw the livers of some more fryers in 2 weeks anyway, but now I have to call around. :roll:

I appreciate all the info, though... I may eventually treat anyway, just to try to make sure Pearl doesn't drop dead on me, and to make sure it is good and beaten back.

Ladysown, when you treat your rabbits like that, how did you do it? What and how much of it did you give each rabbit?

Is coccidiosis dangerous to humans if it, is ingested by humans from eating a bad rabbit liver

I was wondering that, too... like if it was too early on to tell the liver was infected. I did see that there is "human hepatic coccidiosis" and "human intestinal coccidiosis", but I also read that most coccidia don't affect humans... with Cryptosporidium and Toxoplasma being exceptions.

http://books.google.com/books?id=PeAoAA ... &q&f=false

http://moreauanimalclinic.com/pb/wp_b37 ... 88b73.html

 

[ladysown]

when I treat rabbits individually you mean?

I use a syringe and I put it in the pocket of their mouth and squirt it in. I would take the dosage amount (that I would put into the water bottle and not just not dilute it so much).

There is a learning curve... NOTE: for large breed rabbits DO NOT use a small syringe. For babies and smaller breeds a small syringe is good. Not quite so for larger rabbits.