Cage sizing? (UPDATE ON PAGE 2!!!)

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Should have clarified, does with litters will be in a separate hutch with ridiculous amounts of space. These will simply be living quarters for individuals.

Being that each slot will be 36 or 37 inches deep, I'd think the rabbits could get out of the rain pretty easily, right? :shock: Unless we're having gale-force winds or something. The 20 inches will be in the front (and exposed) side of each slot.

The feeder thing has me concerned, I will admit. I'd like to replace all my feeders with these "Pro-B Feedsaver" things on Bassequipment's site, and they CAN come with lids...my concern is, will the lids be enough to keep the moisture out???

Also...it has been about 15 years since I had to deal with an outdoor rabbit in winter, the heck do I do to keep the water flowing?

 

[3mina]

Why not just make a frame for the cages you have now, with a nice overhang on the roof to keep everyone dry?

 

[hoodat]

I make my cages 2 feet high so I can put in a shelf at a foot high. Rabbits love shelves and jumping up and down is good exercise for them. It also gives them a break from being on wire. Adding a shelf effectively increases the foor space by whatever dimensions your shelf is. Mine are a foot wide and the width of the cage so you might say I have extended the cage by a foot in length witout taking up rack space.I've thought of using a shelf at both ends of my larger growout cage. A shelf can get crowded with ten or more buns on it. They end up pushing one another off.
I also prefer using 1/2X1 wire even though it is more expensive per foot. It's hard for cats and other predators to reach through the wire and snatch a kit. A well made GAW wire cage can last ten years with perhaps a new floor at 5 years so spending a few extra dollars to get them right is better than skimping and having to replace more often.

 

[OneAcreFarm]

So 20"w and 36" DEEP? Where will the door be? if on the front, that will make it hard to reach the back unless you are Stretch Armstrong! I agree with 3Mina, use the wood you have to make a covered area for the cages you already have and hang them. Here is mine that is similar...



It would not have to be as tall or fancy (I am married to an Analyst ) Here are some others...







Hope that helps get your creative juices flowing!

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Why not just make a frame for the cages you have now, with a nice overhang on the roof to keep everyone dry?

That would leave two holes for five current outdoor rabbits, which will soon be six or seven (depending on negotiations with a breeder I'm currently having). My other cages (the outdated ones I've been wanting to replace) are just not gonna cut it. I really want a nicer, more useful setup.

The plans I've been working on would leave eight holes for regular living quarters, and two HUGE hutches for does to raise litters in, so in a pinch, ten holes...though I'd like to keep the huge hutches as grow-out pens after weaning.

I also prefer using 1/2X1 wire even though it is more expensive per foot. It's hard for cats and other predators to reach through the wire and snatch a kit. A well made GAW wire cage can last ten years with perhaps a new floor at 5 years so spending a few extra dollars to get them right is better than skimping and having to replace more often.

I do prefer the 1/2 x 1 wire...I have other cages that aren't that size and I really hate them. The rabbits I have on the 1/2 x 1 wire flooring hop around a lot more so I assume they prefer it. Plus as you say, less predator issues. In my basement that hasn't been a problem, but...my dad's place has the occasional raccoon.

I was actually considering that, since the back of the hutch would be solid, it wouldn't be too hard to add a shelf or something. I saw somewhere where someone tacked a bucket in their cages and the rabbits could chill out in the raised bucket, I kinda like that too...like a little hidey-hole. But yeah, I like the idea of a shelf or hidey-thing for the rabbits. Plus having a shelf or bucket off the flooring would allow escape if a raccoon did try to grab their feet.

So 20"w and 36" DEEP? Where will the door be? if on the front, that will make it hard to reach the back unless you are Stretch Armstrong!

I'm actually a pretty short fellow, I already have a few (outdated, need-to-replace) cages where I have to shove my whole upper body in to reach a bun in the back. :lol: I'm used to it, though...had the same issue at the salon I worked at, tiny dog, deep kennel, I'd have to stick half my body in to get 'em out.

Plus I have the nice advantage that half my rabbits practically hop right into my hands when I open the cage!

I agree with 3Mina, use the wood you have to make a covered area for the cages you already have and hang them.

Well...first of all, most of my cages are NOT the same size. They are all individual, freestanding and not even remotely compatible with each other. Two of them are solid-floor monstrosities that I honestly cannot wait to retire and throw the heck out. The test-block I made during this thread? Is only two holes. Five rabbits cannot comfortably live in two holes, lol.

I also have to be mindful of the actual floorspace. I'm going to have to be able to stick this thing in a corner of the yard that isn't just open ground. If I finished the other ten holes I was planning to make with the same template as the two-hole test block...the whole thing would not fit in the corner of the yard it needs to go in.

Those cage setups are all really nice........but won't work for the cages I have except the two-hole block.

So here's my thing: either I give up all but three rabbits (the lop will live in an indoor cage), or I make something that will work well in the limited space I have for the next two to three years. Since I have a few months to plan this beast before I have to build it, here's my next question:

Feeders. I would rather have them attached to the outside of each cage, but I'm gonna need the majority of the front for a door. I'm considering tacking them to the inside wall...it will mean more time spent feeding since I'll have to open each one but I already do that anyways (hey, I like to pet them) so it should be okay. This would solve the concern of rain or snow getting in their feed and making it gross...has anyone tried this and how well did it work?

It would also be great if someone could answer my other questions above instead of just telling me to hang my pre-existing cages. I'm really keen to get these planned out as best I can before I build.

 

[3mina]

Sorry Kyle, I wasn't aware you didn't have hangable cages, I was blanching a little at all that work.

 

[OneAcreFarm]

Sorry Kyle, I wasn't aware you didn't have hangable cages, I was blanching a little at all that work.

Oh, me too! We were trying to SAVE you some work, but did not have all the info! :lol:

So, keeping what you said in mind:

1: Hang your feeders on the outside of the doors, IF you have the swing out to the side kind of door. That is what I did for mine...here is a pic that shows the feeders on the doors...



If the roof over hangs the cage fronts by at least a foot, then the covers on the feeders *should* be sufficient to keep the food dry, unless it is a big storm that is driving the rain at an angle.

2: If you have a big enough door that you can reach your head/shoulders in, then it won't matter how deep...I had them make my new cages with the doors in the middle of the front and as BIG as they could!

3: I would only make two sides solid, so they will have adequate air flow. Or, if the back is solid, only the back. Rabbits need ALL the ventilation they can get.

4: I *think*, and Hoodat please correct me if I am wrong, that Hoodat meant making the WHOLE cage from 1/2 x 1 wire....not just the floor. But to answer your question, yes, 1/2"x1" floor wire is the way to go.

5: A shelf made of floor wire or a bunny bucket like MSD has would work great!

Ok, did I cover everything you asked? Hope that helps!

 

[hoodat]

Yes, I build the entire cage out of 1/2X1 cage wire. I could probably save money by making the top and back out of larger mesh wire but that would mean having two rolls of wire around at the same time and I really can't afford that much at one time.

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Sorry Kyle, I wasn't aware you didn't have hangable cages, I was blanching a little at all that work.

Oh, me too! We were trying to SAVE you some work, but did not have all the info!

No worries, lol!

I admit I'm a tad bummed about the two-hole block I made, since it would be perfect for the basement setup.....but looks like my whole life is changing. :x Fortunately it's for the better!!! Who knew getting fired from that terrible place would be one of the best opportunities of my lifetime?! :lol:

Off-topic tangent...my dad was worried about the amount of animals he's going to have suddenly living in his house, and he balked at the many rabbits in HIS basement, since it is a finished basement...I told him I'd rather keep them outside anyways, since no dogs or kids will harass them here and it will cut down on the work I have to do (hauling poop is a large portion of my current setup's chores) and he got so worried that the "little bunnies will be so cold in winter!"

I feel bad 'cause when he said that I laughed at him.

1: Hang your feeders on the outside of the doors, IF you have the swing out to the side kind of door. That is what I did for mine...here is a pic that shows the feeders on the doors...

Oh wow, didn't know you could do that! I prefer to have door swing out anyways...some of my cages have swing-in or swing-up doors and I hate it, and was gonna make swing-out doors anyways. Question...if there's feed in the feeder and you open it, will the feed fall out?

If the roof over hangs the cage fronts by at least a foot, then the covers on the feeders *should* be sufficient to keep the food dry, unless it is a big storm that is driving the rain at an angle.

I can make a foot-out overhang with ease, actually. Though it's a shady corner I expect that'll help with keeping out direct sunlight, too.

2: If you have a big enough door that you can reach your head/shoulders in, then it won't matter how deep...I had them make my new cages with the doors in the middle of the front and as BIG as they could!

Oh man I hate small doors. My little doe, Nosey, was basically given away due to being "crazy" and awful to get in or out of her cage...the breeder was sick of getting kicked and clawed when taking her out or putting her away. The door on the breeder's cage was like...maybe eight inches across. My doors (on the cages I've built, not the ones I bought, sadly) are almost as big as the whole front of the cage. Guess what, her "crazy" behavior stopped and now she's one of the ones who hops into my hands!

3: I would only make two sides solid, so they will have adequate air flow. Or, if the back is solid, only the back. Rabbits need ALL the ventilation they can get.

Really? Hmmm. Making the sides open will be impossible but I could easily remove the paneling from the back, so the front and back would be open. That will also drastically reduce my building costs, too...though now I'm REALLY keen to tack an elevated bucked in each cage so they have a space to get out of the weather.

Ok, did I cover everything you asked? Hope that helps!

Yes very helpful, thankyou!!!

I think the only one that got missed is, how do you guys keep water flowing in freezing winter? It has been over fifteen years since I had a rabbit outside below freezing, and I cannot for the life of me remember how I kept the dern thing from freezing solid!

Yes, I build the entire cage out of 1/2X1 cage wire. I could probably save money by making the top and back out of larger mesh wire but that would mean having two rolls of wire around at the same time and I really can't afford that much at one time.

I may end up making the whole thing from that wire, too. It will be easier on me, too. Plus...that way no babies ever get their heads stuck in the wire...which for some reason is a fear I have. :roll:

Thanks guys! Gonna try and set up a very basic building "blueprint" sketch, will try to get it scanned and posted for your approval soon. That way if there's any glaring issues, you can tell me before I learn the hard way. :mrgreen:

 

[OneAcreFarm]

1: Hang your feeders on the outside of the doors, IF you have the swing out to the side kind of door. That is what I did for mine...here is a pic that shows the feeders on the doors...

Oh wow, didn't know you could do that! I prefer to have door swing out anyways...some of my cages have swing-in or swing-up doors and I hate it, and was gonna make swing-out doors anyways. Question...if there's feed in the feeder and you open it, will the feed fall out?

Nope! I do it everyday, twice a day!

If the roof over hangs the cage fronts by at least a foot, then the covers on the feeders *should* be sufficient to keep the food dry, unless it is a big storm that is driving the rain at an angle.

I can make a foot-out overhang with ease, actually. Though it's a shady corner I expect that'll help with keeping out direct sunlight, too.

Likely so!

2: If you have a big enough door that you can reach your head/shoulders in, then it won't matter how deep...I had them make my new cages with the doors in the middle of the front and as BIG as they could!

Oh man I hate small doors. My little doe, Nosey, was basically given away due to being "crazy" and awful to get in or out of her cage...the breeder was sick of getting kicked and clawed when taking her out or putting her away. The door on the breeder's cage was like...maybe eight inches across. My doors (on the cages I've built, not the ones I bought, sadly) are almost as big as the whole front of the cage. Guess what, her "crazy" behavior stopped and now she's one of the ones who hops into my hands!

Imagine that!

3: I would only make two sides solid, so they will have adequate air flow. Or, if the back is solid, only the back. Rabbits need ALL the ventilation they can get.

Really? Hmmm. Making the sides open will be impossible but I could easily remove the paneling from the back, so the front and back would be open. That will also drastically reduce my building costs, too...though now I'm REALLY keen to tack an elevated bucked in each cage so they have a space to get out of the weather.

Yep, you can do that too. It creates air flow and will be healthier for the rabbits.

Ok, did I cover everything you asked? Hope that helps!

Yes very helpful, thankyou!!!

I think the only one that got missed is, how do you guys keep water flowing in freezing winter? It has been over fifteen years since I had a rabbit outside below freezing, and I cannot for the life of me remember how I kept the dern thing from freezing solid!

Being in SE Texas, I will have to leave that to the superior experience of those that live somewhere that it actually freezes! :lol:

Yes, I build the entire cage out of 1/2X1 cage wire. I could probably save money by making the top and back out of larger mesh wire but that would mean having two rolls of wire around at the same time and I really can't afford that much at one time.

I may end up making the whole thing from that wire, too. It will be easier on me, too. Plus...that way no babies ever get their heads stuck in the wire...which for some reason is a fear I have. :roll:

Thanks guys! Gonna try and set up a very basic building "blueprint" sketch, will try to get it scanned and posted for your approval soon. That way if there's any glaring issues, you can tell me before I learn the hard way. :mrgreen:

You could use 1"x1" on the sides and and top. Lots of folks that live in places where mink and weasels are present use 1"x1" for their cages.

 

[3mina]

My rabbits are outside. Being from the great white north, I water with crocks in the winter, bottles in the summer. I water first thing then feed and anything I have to do then I water again so everyone's had a good drink. I do the same thing again in the afternoon after knocking the ice out of the crocks. When I say crocks I actually mean 1 pint steel dog bowls (cuts down on breakage). It s not perfect but at least everyone gets a good drink. It gets a little miserable around -25c for me but the bunns don't seem to mind in the least. Needless to say I don't breed in the winter.

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

One thing more...how high should a cage be? I am planning on this new hutch having about 20 inch high cages...would that suffice? If I can keep it 20 inches or so, I can add a third tier and thus have twelve holes instead of eight.......

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I think the only one that got missed is, how do you guys keep water flowing in freezing winter?

If you go with an automatic system, you can install an in-line heat tape or get a recirculating pump. There are thermostatically controlled outlets which will activate at a specific temperature.

 

[starshotbandit]

I use to have to go out twice a day with hot wather for my horse. ti worked for keeping the water from refrezing for a few houres. also in the morning he liked his hot drink.

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

My rabbits LOVE the warm water. I think it stimulates them to eat more, too.