"Best" wool rabbit?

[Frecs]

I know that is a silly question because everyone has a different "best" rabbit for them.

My need for fiber has gotten stirred and so I'm exploring the idea of adding a fiber side to my rabbitry. My main rabbitry focus is meat (Silver Foxes) and though it looked for a short time like I'd gotten bitten by the show bug, that passed like a bad flu. So, what I think I want in a fiber rabbit is: good spinnable wool (not too difficult as I'm basically a rookie, drop spindle spinner), meat rabbit potential for the culls, and very friendly rabbit (I don't want to fight with a rabbit to groom it multiple days a week).

I saw a lady (Charlotte NC) advertising for English/German crosses but she wants $75 per...that is more than I would want to spend on non-show rabbits. There is possibly another lady closer to me (Wilmington NC) with English for $25. Thoughts on either of those options? I have a Jersey Woolie buck but he doesn't produce much in the way of wool or so it seems. I've also not been able to locate a doe within reasonable pick-up distance.

 

[-HRanchito]

The crosses would probably be best for the meat rabbit capability and easier spinning....

but you can't beat that price, and the likelihood that you will get the temperament you want would be better with pure English. I haven't worked with either breed, but some Germans are bred with more of a "production" mentality, (as in they don't need to be great lap-sitters because of those crazy rabbit shearing machines) If it were me I would go for the English - they are teeechnically commercial type, but you could sell culls as woolers instead for at least $25, probably double.

 

[SarahMelisse]

All I can tell you is why I chose French angoras instead of English or German:

French are a moderate size (English seemed a tad too small and Germans a tad too big for me)
They "blow" or shed their coats (Germans need to be sheared and I don't like to spin sheared wool)
Their body type is considered "commercial" so they make a good dual-purpose breed
They have clean (unwooled) faces and feet making them easier to groom
Satins don't produce as much wool

Maybe go to a show near you and see first hand which angora breed you like better? Or look up some videos on YouTube that feature the angora breeds you are more interested in. I have a bunch of videos of my French Angoras on my website and on YouTube under my channel: MelisseSpring

Good luck choosing!

 

[Oceanrose]

Depends on what you like the best..

Sarah already covered French.

English require grooming more, especially on their furnishings. I have an english buck who lives on my porch, and you couldn't ask for a cuter bunny. But, I have been hesitant to get more than him and Laurel my old doe because they are more work. However, they produce tons of soft, crimpy fiber which is beautiful. Better quality English do mat less. My 2 don't get mats except on the legs or face if I don't keep up with them.

Germans are popular because they don't mat, produce a ton of fiber and can be sheared. However, they have more guard hairs (why they don't mat)so the fiber is coarser. Also, sheared fiber doesn't spin as nicely. Important for a handspinner, not as much for someone sending it to a pool to be turned into yarn. I can tell a difference between german yarn and fiber and the other breeds for sure.

Now I chose Satins. For several reasons. 1 I love, love, love the sheen and depth to their color. Angoras tend to mute in color, but Satins have really good depth to their color. In addition, spinning Satin Angora is like spinning silk, just spectacular. Their coat does weigh less, you don't get as much wool, but they molt the coat out, so you can pluck, and while it's lighter it goes a long way. Matter of fact while weight wise my English produces more, I get the same amt of length of yarn (spun on the same wheel and settings) from the Satins I've spun. Satin angora breeders are working hard on the density. Satin angoras are a bit more active, but mine all sit for grooming - well, except for Sabrina, but she's just a brat. I really enjoy them, and I LOVE their fiber! My only complaint is I need more!

 

[tm_bunnyloft]

French.

 

[lonelyfarmgirl]

I have english and giants and I have had satins in the past. I have some on the way.
English are by far the most difficult to keep groomed, but their wool is the softest. Giant and germans are easy to keep mat free. French and satin have already been discussed.
25$ for an english is a steal. I would wonder if something wasn't wrong with it at that price. The going price for a wooler english here is 40$, no papers. I sell my english babies at 8 weeks for 75$.

75$ for the german/giant cross is an acceptable price. If you want cheaper, then look to french or satin. French bring the least amount of money.

 

[tm_bunnyloft]

I am getting English with pedigree for $40 at 8 weeks.

 

[Frecs]

If you want cheaper, then look to french or satin. French bring the least amount of money.

Why are French cheaper than English?

I have a chance to get a pedigreed French for $40. I don't know yet how old the doe is...was just given the lady's name and number...

 

[lonelyfarmgirl]

French is a meat rabbit with wool. They blow coat and have a medium quality wool.

English have ULTRA fine and soft and silky wool and good lines don't blow coat. If you take care of the coat, you can get it a foot long. They have long face furnishings, and are a smaller animal. They are the most visually appealing of the angoras.

That would be my guess. You don't find a quality english here for less than 100$. $150+ is more likely.

Betty Chu is the number one english angora breeder in the country. She sells her woolers with no papers for 150$. She sells her papered rabbits for 500-1000$ each and she has to approve you first.

Quality english bring lots of money. It is what it is.

 

[SarahMelisse]

Betty Chu is the number one english angora breeder in the country. She sells her woolers with no papers for 150$. She sells her papered rabbits for 500-1000$ each and she has to approve you first.

Quality english bring lots of money. It is what it is.

But remember that Betty Chu can charge $500-1000 because all of her rabbits are grand championed. She worked hard on producing her lines to earn that much on a rabbit.

 

[Frecs]

French is a meat rabbit with wool. They blow coat and have a medium quality wool.

English have ULTRA fine and soft and silky wool and good lines don't blow coat. If you take care of the coat, you can get it a foot long. They have long face furnishings, and are a smaller animal. They are the most visually appealing of the angoras.

That would be my guess. You don't find a quality english here for less than 100$. $150+ is more likely.

Betty Chu is the number one english angora breeder in the country. She sells her woolers with no papers for 150$. She sells her papered rabbits for 500-1000$ each and she has to approve you first.

Quality english bring lots of money. It is what it is.

Well, I'm sure Betty Chu worked quite hard to get the reputation to merit charging those kind of prices. I'd never pay that but then I'm not rich so not in those kind of circles. :roll:

I actually don't like the English appearance. They look like tribbles with ears to me. I like to be able to see an animal's eyes. The French have a look I like (no facial "furniture" I believe is the terminology) and apparently at a price I can afford. The great thing about the rabbit world is there is a rabbit (or rabbits) for everyone! :bunnyhop: :bunnyhop: :bunnyhop:

 

[AnnClaire]

OK, I have to say something

I have English Angoras ... and I can tell you that I WANT an angora that blows the coat ... the fiber is perfectly fine for spinning and part of what makes Angora yarn/sweaters so desirable is the bloom of the yarn ... not only is Angora fiber one of the warmest wools with lightest weight, it is soooooooooo soft!

As for Ms. Chu's lines, she has done an AMAZING job breeding rabbits that can grow 10"+ of wool, but, honestly, that is not necessarily "needed" for spinning. My undying admiration and respect to Ms. Chu for the advancement to the breed she has accomplished!

As for breeding or simply keeping some woolers, maintaining a show coat is not necessary, so for my herd buck and doe, I simply keep the furnishings trimmed so they and I can see There are also other areas that I keep trimmed, but those are incidental.

As for a quality English Angora doe about 4-6 months old, $100-150 seems to be the going rate. And on the show table, the length of fiber is only pointed on meeting a minimum length, so the excessive lengths that Ms. Chu achieves, sadly does not contribute to the points ... but still she has grand champions regularly!

 

[Oceanrose]

English are simply more work, more time, have smaller litters, and that all contributes to the price. I have 2 English. They take a lot more time than my Satins. For example, I hadn't groomed in a month, because it's been raining here, and I didn't feel like pulling out the blow dryer and being electrocuted . It took me 45 minutes to:

Pluck out 2 satins, show groom 3 more. They don't take hardly any time, as unless you leave the coat in when they molt. I have one buck out there I need to work on as he was matted from his baby coat when I got him. The satins grow coat, and molt it for you to gather. Easy, quick, and beautiful prime fiber.

The English - even Chu's will eventually molt. But a longer fiber will mat as it molts, making shearing a better option. I still pluck my English, but when they start to molt, instead of seeing hair all over the bottom on the cage, you see it trailing behind the bunny still attached. The coat texture doesn't lend itself to a clean molt as easily.

I don't believe in charging high prices for baby bunnies, but if I had a rabbitry full of English, I'd have to adjust my prices to allow for the smaller litter, and the larger workload. Though the flip of that, is that Angoras also have a built in product they deliver every few months in addition to the litters .

 

[lonelyfarmgirl]

I think litter size is relative to nutrition and the lines. I see so many people post that their giants only ever have three or four, and same with English. I don't really understand it. My giants have 7-8 usually and my english 6 or more. My chocolate english has given me two litters thus far. 8 and 10. A blue doe I have just had her first litter, and she had 6. I have two does off the chocolate that are bred for the first time now. I am anxious to see how many they have.

I do have a black doe that only had two in her first litter. She is bred now also. I hope she has more than two this time!

Betty's rabbits are amazing. She's been perfecting them for what 30 years? I could never afford what she is charging but heck, if she gets it, more power to her!

 

[ohiogoatgirl]

how much does each of the breeds give? and how long between shearings/pluckings?

 

[skysthelimit]

Usually every three months. English tend to give the most usable wool, germans, french then satins, with the latter two having more guard hairs. I think the estimate was 5-8 oz each clipping.

 

[SarahMelisse]

I only count prime plucked wool from my French and I get about 4 ounces ever 3 months. If I were to count second grade wool (which I use for felting and not spinning) it would be closer to 6 ounces. I only shear during the hottest couple months of the year (July and August) and pluck the rest of the year.

I actually had someone request a small sample of French wool recently to compare to German and English to aid her in her decision of which breed to purchase... This woman said that she thought the English was more cottony and the German more wirey than the French. Of course that is one persons opinion. I have never seen a German so I wouldn't know.

 

[skysthelimit]

The English cross I got seemed to be more like cotton, or at least I thought that until I got the pure French. I just think he had a baby coat. I've been told people develop a preference for sheared or plucked. The buck I am getting later on is a GC the breeder is selling because she does not care for the color (siamese sable my favorite color) and he is a plucker only. The doe is from her lines, so I'm guessing that she breeds for shearers only, and the doe might be a shearer.
I cut the crosses because they were heavily matted when I got them, so in a little while I will know which one I prefer.

 

[Oceanrose]

The most I have gotten off of one of my Satins is 3oz, but I lost about another 2-3 oz in her cage since I was out of town. It was 4" long, amazing fiber! I am spinning it now. I haven't had enough other adults to see how that holds true. Most of my herd are young and just now coming into their senior coats. The Satins when they molt, drop it super fast and molt to the skin.

My English angora, I got 8 oz off of last week. Only about 4 was useable though because he is a free range bunny, and runs through water (and mats his belly and chest). A good English isn't so much cottony as fine and silky. They have guards hairs, but it is very fine. The English coat when it's correct is amazingly soft, and profuse and won't mat unless it gets wet or just isn't taken care of, no different than the other breeds. The difference is that the feet, and faces need care. The other difference is there are a lot of bad English Angoras out there who have overly soft cottony coat since people equate that with good spinning coats. They are not, it makes for a weaker fiber.

Germans do have the heaviest coat yields, but typically have a coarser guard coat.

Each breed is a little different to spin, and everyone likes certain coat textures. I like spinning the SA as it is like silk. The EA is loftier and spins to a yarn with more body, where the SA has more drape. Kind of like the difference between merino (EA) and Alpaca (SA). I have never spun French Angora, and have never spun German, so I can't speak about those two.