Best bunny has white toenails

[WyoWool]

Litter of 5 jersey wooly, born late November.

Of the five, the only self is a gorgeous black doe. The rest are brokens. Nicely marked brokens, too, but the clear winner is the self.

Mom is black otter, Dad is broken Siamese Sable. Both have substantial wins on the show table, however this is the first litter for each. (Dad has had a subsequent litter with another doe, another 5 bunnies with 3 broken and 2 REW from a REW mom and none have mismatched toenails)

The best bunny of the 5, the self black doe......she’s got 3 white toenails on one foot. I can’t keep a DQ, but my bigger worry is if I have a hidden genetic problem on my hands. I have gotten several conflicting comments about this bunny. Every thing from “it’s the Mom, get rid of the mom or you’ll always have this problem” to “She’s genetically a broken with a white spot on black because it’s more than just one toenail, so keep her and breed her because she’s so typey.” It’s not skin or hair that’s white, it’s three toenails on a hind foot.

I have a small rabbitry, and no room for DQs or DQ producers. My spouse already claimed a reject wooly and that’s all the room for pets we have.

Do I get rid of this gorgeous little doe, and potentially her mom to not perpetuate this genetic flaw? Do I keep mom and just hope she doesn’t throw another like it? Never breed these two together again??

 

[alforddm]

This is a bit of a complicated question. There are a few things that could be happening.

1) It's just a fluke and not genetic at all. Toes are one of the last places for pigment to be deposited during development. Because it's one of the last places, it's possible that something environmental caused the pigment to not reach the toes. It could potentially have been something as minor as extra cold temps during gestation. There's just no way to know.

2) It's a modifier that causes the white toenails but it might not show up on all the rabbits who carry the modifier. Because all white patters have variances in expression, it's possible it's a small white modifier gene. It could potentially vary in expression from white feet to no expression at all. It would be very difficult to test breed for it.

3) Very minimal Vienna expression. This you could test breed for if you really wanted to but it's the least likely of the options unless you've had other indications in your litters such as blue eyes or larger white patches.

4) An injury caused the toenail to turn white.


Does the dam of this kit have any white toe nails? If not and it is indeed genetic, it's most likely to have come from the broken sire. A white toe nail would be easily covered by broken. Are you planning on showing? If so cull her and rebreed and hope for a similar kit without the white toes. If not you could keep her until you get a replacement. Sometimes you hit the jackpot in type and it might be some time before you got another rabbit as good or, you might get an entire litter of them next breeding.

 

[SableSteel]

I myself wouldn't worry about it until you get another kit from that line with a white toenail showing up. Then you can step back and decide who is worth keeping, despite likely carrying white toenails. Personally I would be looking more towards the sire, as white toenails often run in shaded lines.

 

[WyoWool]

Thank you guys for the replies!

Dam, (black otter) does not have any white toenails.

No injuries for this little one (believe me I was hoping!)

I didn’t think of the Sire being the genetic factor behind the white toenails, it just didn’t occur to me. I’m just now delving into shadeds. I’m finding they don’t seem to place as well as the Selfs do on the table.

Should I consider the three white toenails on this little doe a possible Vienna mark despite having no further evidence of it?
Neither the Dam nor the Sire have any Vienna on their pedigrees, although of course it could be really hidden and way back...it would be beyond seven generations back if it were.



I think I’m just irritated more so than anything else. To have just a fantastic quality doe bunny...finally...and then it a DQ at that. :evil:

 

[SableSteel]

Shadeds generally don't place as well as selfs in many breeds, largely because of the lower numbers and the fact that they don't breed true (throwing rew's and seals). But they are more common in JW than some other breeds so you should be able to find some pretty good quality shaded JW out there.

Personally I wouldn't be quick to say it was a vienna mark. Vienna isn't as common in JW as it is in other breeds, and there are other genetic causes for white toenails. If you start seeing blue eyes (and its a breed with the vienna gene present, and no dutch gene) then it's pretty safe to call it VM imo, but with just some white nails and no history of vienna I wouldn't probably even think about it. I used to breed shaded NDs and I'd get white toenails from time to time, but never got any eye color problems or white spots. I've had to cull a few otherwise nice rabbits for white nails. It sucks. I used to raise harlequins as well, which are probably one of the worst breeds for toenail color DQs, and I had one rabbit that was nearly perfectly marked... but had three toenail colors on one foot (white, horn and dark). Ended up showing her just for fun and she got three legs (but I never registered her). Was DQd about half the time. When I bred her, though, and half the babies also had white spots or white nails, she and the litter all went to a cull buyer

edit:
Another thing to add, which I didn't see before - if the sire is broken I'd say it's even more likely it came from him. A lot of breeders have bred rabbits with white nails into broken lines because the broken color covers up all their toenail issues (for all you know, he could even have the genetics for a white nail under his pattern) If his first litter was 3 broken, and 2 REW, you can't really determine much about toenail color as those varieties naturally have white nails whether they have the genetics for a stray white nail or not

 

[WyoWool]

Thank you guys for your thoughtful advice!

Would I be out of my mind to keep her and breed to a broken??
I have broken bucks I could use with her, but as her father is broken I do not want to chance Charlies.

 

[SableSteel]

IMO you should not keep her to breed to a broken, the babies are likely to carry genetics for white toenails and throw white toenails. This would not only solidify the white toenail genetics into your line (when its harder to cull out because you can't tell which have stray white nails, because they're broken) but make it unethical to sell those brokens to other breeders (who will probably cross them with selfs.) People crossing white toenails and vienna into broken to hide their problems are one of the reasons the color gets a bad reputation in some breeds.

 

[Ghost]

Maybe this is me being pedantic,but I would like to throw a caveat in to this. It is all about the ethics of disclosure. If you are selling to a breeder who wishes to participate in ARBA showings, then it important information that there is a history of white toenails in the genetic past of an animal.

However if a pet buyer likes the color of the animal regardless of the white toenails then there should not be an issue with this animal. This is unless white toenails indicate some deeper issues with liver/kidney problems that show up in different animals over and over.


Also many people looking for stock in a meat rabbitry buyers want hearty foundation stock and are not interested in ARBA showings. It is all about ethics in breeding and disclosure. Are accurately representing what you are selling. Just like I stated in THIS post.