Baby Flemish help maybe?

[Kihluna]

Awhile ago we were handed a boy bunny at a pet store and fell in love. They told us he is a rex "velveteen", unsure of all that, but he has been super easy to care for. No nail issues, no health issues, quite the personality.

So we decided we wanted a female..I found a little 2 month old gray flemish giant female and went to go meet her. First inspection she looked healthy, eating fine, normal looking poops. A few bite marks from her brother the owner said. I then noticed she had a few pimple looking things on her ears and a bump on her foot. The lady told me they were most likely just bites from the brother that had gotten a little swollen.
She had them housed in a garage, kinda hot in the florida weather. On pine shavings. I brought the baby home and gave her a quick little bath and found more bumps, squishy bumps. One on her foot was leaking this thick cottage cheese looking stuff so I quickly hopped on google to investigate.

I`m assuming they are abcesses. She has about 7-8, all maybe 1 cm big and superficial. They all appear to be where I would assume a sibling bite would end up, near the spine, the feet, one on her eyebrow. She picks them open with her teeth which is super gross. I have shaved the fur away from them and rinse them daily. I do wonder if it is pus inside though because it does not smell. Only one has ever given me blood. I am squeezing them once she opens them and cleaning the areas, she doesn`t seem to mind. No squinting, kicking or biting, just lays there.
Today I noticed she was limping and there is one under her front paw that hasn`t been bitten open yet. The nearest small animal vet is two hours away so I`m wondering if I could handle it on my own. She will put weight on the foot and is licking the bottom. I`ll have to shave the area to get a better look at it.

I also noticed she`s kinda fat. Not bloat, I did google that. Shes just..pudgy? Should I be concerned about this? She is eating her pellets fine, no veggies yet (not till 4 months right?) unsure if I can start her on the alfalfa hay or not, will google after this. She is producing normal looking poops, and peeing from what I can tell. There have been a few squishy wet poops, maybe 4-5 pellets but other than that they look fine. She cleans herself and snuggles, explores and all that. She refuses to eat from her bowl, will dump it and lay on the floor of the cage eating it like a lardo lol.

Sorry for the long ranting post, I usually care for our animals at home with vet care only if absolutely necessary. She is my first baby bunny and I`m nervous about every little thing she does.

 

[ladysown]

I'd be bringing that sick rabbit back to the person you bought it from. Seriously.

You're going to continue to deal with abscesses and issues from her.

 

[Dood]

:yeahthat: its really unethical that they'd sell you a sick rabbit but if you want to try and save her then ..

It is normal for rabbit puss to be very thick and have little odour.

She has about 7-8, all maybe 1 cm big and superficial

Usually you can treat rabbits for this and actually, in rabbits, oral antibiotics are not very effective for the type of wounds you are describing.

Unfortunately the wound in her foot may never heal - once the bacteria are in the tendons or bones it is nearly impossible to completely eliminate them and the infection will keep recurring. Euthanasia might be neccesarily to eliminate her suffering.

Lancing them and expressing the puss frequently is the best you can do. You could try performing 10 minute warm salt water soaks each day for her foot to try and pull the infection out (the water should be luke warm and only slightly salty)

If her arms, ribs and legs have very little muscling but she has a big pot belly then she has one if several rabbit diseases that can be passed on to your current rabbit. If she seems pudgy all over and with good muscle tone then she is likely heathy but a bit over weight. Pictures would help.

 

[Kihluna]

I'd be bringing that sick rabbit back to the person you bought it from. Seriously.

You're going to continue to deal with abscesses and issues from her.

I know, the woman did say that if she died she would give me another one, which was off putting because she was very nonchalant about it. I didn`t want to leave her there after I saw the abcesses because she told me she usually just sells off the sickly ones for snake food or "disposes" of them which made me pretty mad. <br /><br /> __________ Thu Feb 06, 2014 1:29 pm __________ <br /><br />

Unfortunately the wound in her foot may never heal - once the bacteria are in the tendons or bones it is nearly impossible to completely eliminate them and the infection will keep recurring. Euthanasia might be neccesarily to eliminate her suffering.

Lancing them and expressing the puss frequently is the best you can do. You could try performing 10 minute warm salt water soaks each day for her foot to try and pull the infection out (the water should be luke warm and only slightly salty)

If her arms, ribs and legs have very little muscling but she has a big pot belly then she has one if several rabbit diseases that can be passed on to your current rabbit. If she seems pudgy all over and with good muscle tone then she is likely heathy but a bit over weight. Pictures would help.

I will get some pictures today. I don`t think the infection is in the bone or tendon yet, there is a little abcess right where the foot bends and I think the pressure is making her limp. Could I soak her whole body up to the neck in salt water? How frequently should I be expressing them? There are two today that are flat and aren`t giving me anything but blood, which I am taking as a good thing. She is still eating and drinking a lot. Last night I gently palpated the belly and it seemed to reduce the swollen look. She made some..I guess farts? Weird little squeaks from her behind and the pudge lessened.

 

[Dood]

Do not soak her while body, and if the foot wound is superficial as well then it won't need soaking either.

I would try and express the puss twice a day.

 

[Kihluna]

thank you. here are some pics of her and the worst of the abcesses. The one on the back leg is hardly giving me any pus, but is swollen and she licks it a lot. top pic you can see her pudge belly and the foot I`m holding up is the one she is limping on. There is an abcess that appears very painful to her right where I would assume her "wrist" is.

I have been squeezing 3x a day the past 2 days. They are all hardly giving me anything now, was wondering if I could rinse with peroxide? would saline be better? Should I wrap them? Half of google is telling me to keep them open, the other half says to let them scab over.

 

[Zass]

Oh the poor thing!
I wouldn't accept ANY other rabbits from that person.

There isn't any reason to let them tear each other apart.
If she wanted to sell them as snake food or dispose of them, it should have been long before the rabbit ended up in that condition!!!
Your girl should have been separated from the rabbit who was biting her as soon as the first wound was discovered. Leaving them together to hurt each other is not "normal".

On another note, are you sure she's female?

 

[MamaSheepdog]

Poor little rabbit.

The abscess on the leg looks really painful. I would lance it (a brand new exacto blade is nearly as good as a scalpel!), express the pus, and irrigate it.

Hydrogen peroxide is not usually recommended to be used multiple times on wounds because it damages newly formed cells. However, in the case of rabbit abscesses, it can really help to flush out the pus, and I wouldn't hesitate to use it.

For the wounds that are pus free at this point I would irrigate with either a weak Betadine solution (the color of tea) or saline. Raw honey has antibacterial properties, so I would then inject honey into the wound tracts.

If you have access to any willow trees, the bark and leaves contain salicylic acid which is a natural pain reliever. You can cut some branches and allow her to self medicate. If she isn't accustomed to fresh greens, I would limit her to only one or two leave at a time.

Please be aware that these abscesses likely mean she has Pasteurella... best case scenario would be that she has a staph infection. Depending on the strain, Pasteurella can be highly contagious.

Keep her quarantined from your other rabbit for at least 4-6 weeks after she has recovered. Personally, I would never allow her near him since I highly suspect Pasteurella.

Here are some articles on treating abscesses that you might find helpful:

http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Conten ... ourceID=43

http://www.lbah.com/word/pasteurella-rabbit/

http://www.animalhospitals-usa.com/smal ... tions.html

 

[Dood]

I wouldn't put anything on them.

I would keep them open - if they scab or heal over the infection cannot drain and a puss pocket will develop again.

If you are only getting blood then i would only express them once a day or less just to keep them open and let the wounds heal from the inside out.

 

[Kihluna]

Oh the poor thing!
I wouldn't accept ANY other rabbits from that person.

There isn't any reason to let them tear each other apart.
If she wanted to sell them as snake food or dispose of them, it should have been long before the rabbit ended up in that condition!!!
Your girl should have been separated from the rabbit who was biting her as soon as the first wound was discovered. Leaving them together to hurt each other is not "normal".

On another note, are you sure she's female?

that is exactly how i felt. Our first rabbit was free from a pet store bc he was being attacked by the others. I seem to have a penchant for the underdogs I guess. As I type this Boris, our male is running around like a crazy rabbit all over the back of the couch, pulling my sons hair and scampering off like a brat lol. He is all upset that he can`t be near his girlfriend and keeps flipping the litter box over spilling it everywhere.
The lady sexed her and showed me, but she could have been speaking german for all i know. I do know the one she said was male did have a different shaped hole than she does, and some of the articles I`ve read suggests she is a female. <br /><br /> __________ Thu Feb 06, 2014 5:00 pm __________ <br /><br />

The abscess on the leg looks really painful. I would lance it (a brand new exacto blade is nearly as good as a scalpel!), express the pus, and irrigate it.

Thank you for this, well your whole post really. I just finished her big daily treatment of expressing everything and wiping. I did finally wet her down today from neck to tail and to my horror found maybe 12-13 more abcesses. In between the toes, on the ankle. Her back legs are covered in them. I popped them all and rinsed. Dipped the back legs in Peroxide. Front feet I finally was able to manhandle her and get ahold of that limpy leg. Its the only one she fights tooth and nail for me to leave alone which I understand it must be horribly painful for her so I don`t mind the scratches. I got some pus from the limpy leg and popped one on the left front leg as well as 4 mini pustules I found in between those toes.
Aside from the 3 on the body and one on the ear they all appear to be in the feet. I will look into that Pasturella thing and figure out what to do.

How far away from Boris should she be. They are in medium sized metal dog crates about two feet apart. (We call them the "his and her" crates lol. Working on our outside hutch which is where they will be eventually during the day, coming inside for the night as the mosquitoes here are insane during the summer)

 

[Sagebrush]

I have my new girl 12 feet away from my boy Romeo. I am keeping them in quarantine even though the vet gave the all clear. I would rather be safe then sorry. Maybe try putting her in a different room then Boris?

 

[MamaSheepdog]

I don`t mind the scratches.

You need to thoroughly clean those out NOW. People can also contract Pasteurella. <br /><br /> __________ Thu Feb 06, 2014 3:37 pm __________ <br /><br /> Here is another link with more info on "P":

technical-sheet-re-pasteurella-multicoda-t15511.html

I did finally wet her down today from neck to tail and to my horror found maybe 12-13 more abcesses. In between the toes, on the ankle. Her back legs are covered in them.

If she is that riddled with abscesses I don't really see the possibility that she will ever be truly free of them. This form of "P" can become systemic and affect the internal organs, so even if she appears healthy on the outside, the likelihood of her having internal abscesses is high.

I know that you aren't going to like to hear this, but I really think it would be kindest to put her down rather than prolong her suffering.

I am very sorry.

((Hugs))

 

[Zass]

My thoughts exactly, pasteurella pus can infect scratches. Thankfully, it's curable in humans(unlike rabbits), but I've read that it can leave a REALLY nasty infection that requires medical treatment. I agree with keeping the new girl in a totally separate area. Change clothes and sanitize hands after touching her too.
It might sound extreme, but it's normal procedure for many of us who have learned the hard way what pasteurella can do to our favorite bunnies.

 

[ladysown]

I am sorry, but I concur with MSD. Putting this young rabbit down is your best option. Living with systemic pasteurella is NOT a good disease for any rabbit to live with. I would STRONGLY suggest keeping a really close eye on Boris and hope that he hasn't contracted it.

Separate as far away as you possibly can.
Keep yourself well cleaned and disinfected (wear long sleeve clothes)
Wash up when done and change your clothes before you anywhere that Boris can go.
Tell your children to stay far away from your new bun. You don't want them getting sick OR spreading illness throughout the house.

Return her or put her down.

 

[Zass]

also...she looks kinda small for an 8 week old Flemish Giant, and...I've never ever seen 8 week old kits fight like that.

 

[Dood]

12 more!!!

There is something seriously wrong with that girl, at the very least she has a compromised immune system and will likely catch something later on that does her in.

I highly doubt the spots between toes or on her neck are from bites from her cage mate and something more sinister is going on

 

[Doc Oc]

I completely agree with the other posts. You need to have her put down. It's about quality of life. If you are hurting her more by trying to save her, then what good are you really doing?

We had one rabbit come down with a P infection, horrid experience, after 3 months we had to put her down. I didn't want to, but we had to, for her. It wasn't fair keeping her that wait.

I am sorry for your poor bun, but you need to go to that breeder and check out the other rabbits, sounds like a back yard breeder, and that is a bad thing...

 

[MamaSheepdog]

If you are hurting her more by trying to save her, then what good are you really doing?

We had one rabbit come down with a P infection, horrid experience, after 3 months we had to put her down. I didn't want to, but we had to, for her.

I'm so sorry you went through that, Doc Oc.

Sometimes it is hard to step away and be honest with yourself about what is best for the animal. I know that I have gone to extraordinary lengths to save some of my beloved pets, only to prolong their suffering. I always vow never to do so again... but it is very hard to let them go when you feel they might have a chance.

sounds like a back yard breeder, and that is a bad thing...

You should be careful with that term. The Animal Rights Activists have done a stellar job of implying that anyone that breeds animals in their "backyard" are irresponsible, uncaring, and unethical people who crank out animals willy-nilly.

The fact is that most people do breed in their "backyard" or on their ranch. Not many people can afford a commercial facility, and even fewer of us would want to breed animals in that type of setting. Most of the people I know would be considered "backyard breeders" and whether they raise dogs, horses, chickens, or rabbits, their animals are loved and given excellent care.

A more accurate term would be "irresponsible breeder", since location has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of care an individual gives to their animals... but that doesn't fit with the ARA agenda to demonize all breeders, so of course they aren't promoting it. :roll:

 

[Kihluna]

thank you all for the replies. Our roomate is now spitting mad that I would "let an animal that can get us sick in the house", joy. Even though its fine to have her massive tard pitbull in here knocking over animal cages and peeing on everything...anyway..
I`m going to bring her back to the breeder most likely. I honestly don`t want to because I know she is going to die there, but we cannot afford to take her 2 hours away to get her put to sleep. I`m going to ask to see the other rabbits as well. This absolutely sucks all around. What should I be looking for in Boris? He seems totally fine but has only been around her once in the 3 days.

 

[Zass]

I BELIEVE you are only likely to get a pasteurella infection yourself from a rabbit with abscesses is if you get the bacteria into an open wound.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, because fortunately, I've only read about pasteurella in humans, and never experienced it myself!

This is unsolicited advice...but...It might be a good idea to refrain from adding any more animals to a shared dwelling until the roommate's dog's behavior problems are straitened out. I love pitbulls myself, but it's extra important that they receive proper training. (since they are judged more harshly then most breeds)