another body language question

[Brass]

I've been practicing handling my new bunnies. All 3 like petting just fine but Mama bunny gives me a dirty look, like "Seriously? You again? I'll tolerate this because I'm A GOOD BUNNY."

"Bob" the buck sniffs me and when I hold him has his ears back and sniffs me the whole time, moving his head around sniffing. He likes to be held horizontally in my arms. He seems content.

'Hop Hop' the NZW likes to be held upright against my chest (with his nose on my chest/under my chin). He gently sniffs the whole time too, and seems calm and content, but his ears are right up the whole time.

After reading the Language of Lagomorphs I'm still obviously confused. Both rabbits accept holding without struggling and 'seem' content but I'm extrapolating what I know of horses/dogs to rabbits and I know that it won't all apply. Can an ear up rabbit be content as well as an ear-down rabbit? Which one is happier to be held? Neither?

Thanks all for helping me understand these little critters. I"m sorry for asking all these questions but I don't know where else to turn!

Also, I need childproof locks on my cages. DS (3) yesterday went out to 'check the rabbits' by himself… he fed the rabbits hay, overfilled their pellets, and then managed to get Hop Hop's cage stuck OPEN with some sort of a hook (???). Thankfully Hop Hop didn't leave because DS left his step stool in front of the door. Cue small heart attack LOL. He's been very obedient since about NOT OPENING THE CAGES. :lol:

 

[Zass]

The bucks like to smell doe on you. Not just where you touched her, but anything of hers you may have touched or brushed against.

Ear up and ear down isn't as clear cut with rabbits as with dogs or horses. Partially because they have more uses for the things. To cool themselves for example, the ears must be up.

 

[Brass]

The bucks like to smell doe on you. Not just where you touched her, but anything of hers you may have touched or brushed against.

Ear up and ear down isn't as clear cut with rabbits as with dogs or horses. Partially because they have more uses for the things. To cool themselves for example, the ears must be up.

Thanks. I don't hold the doe, she's supposedly pregnant and I really don't want to irritate her more than I already seem to. I'll hold her after she's kindled. Any time I make too fast of a movement she is obviously aggravated. She will let me pet/stroke her just fine both on the body and forehead/cheek. She doesn't cower away or anything but it's clear she is Just. Tolerating.

I was hopeful that ear up/down was going to be a clear cut sign. They're so complex. I didn't realize how different rabbits were, which sounds stupid now that I say it! I guess as long as they're not struggling they're content. Or frozen in fear…. sigh…. Well I'll keep on keepin' on! Next big task--nail clipping! Whee!

 

[Zass]

I was just reading "the language of lagomorphs"

I suppose allowing your rabbits to dominate you would make statements like this one taken from the site more likely to be true:

"Some rabbits are more territorial than others, but many rabbits will be very angry if you reach into their homes (always a personal place), especially while they're inside. If you do so, anticipate getting charged at, pounded hard with pointy-tipped paws, and even bitten"

I cull those rabbits, plain and simple because I feel that the world doesn't really need more domestic rabbits who behave that way. I guess the difference between a pet owner and a breeder is that pet owners are encouraged to work with their animal no matter how antisocial it is, and a breeder has some luxury to sculpt the animals they produce to their own liking.

I prefer my rabbits to be most comfortable in the same mental state as the dogs, calm submissive.

 

[mystang89]

"Some rabbits are more territorial than others, but many rabbits will be very angry if you reach into their homes (always a personal place), especially while they're inside. If you do so, anticipate getting charged at, pounded hard with pointy-tipped paws, and even bitten"

I cull those rabbits, plain and simple

When I have rabbits that act like that with me, they get about half way through the motion before they are dead and being cleaned. :|

As for trying to know what gesture means what, I still haven't figured it out but I did finally break my SF's stubborn streak as far as me petting her without her running to the corner of the cage and hunkering down. She now nudges my hand when she wants me to pet her head. Went from almost on the chopping block to a keeper and it only took a year .... :| ....

 

[Brass]

"Some rabbits are more territorial than others, but many rabbits will be very angry if you reach into their homes (always a personal place), especially while they're inside. If you do so, anticipate getting charged at, pounded hard with pointy-tipped paws, and even bitten"

I cull those rabbits, plain and simple

When I have rabbits that act like that with me, they get about half way through the motion before they are dead and being cleaned. :|

As for trying to know what gesture means what, I still haven't figured it out but I did finally break my SF's stubborn streak as far as me petting her without her running to the corner of the cage and hunkering down. She now nudges my hand when she wants me to pet her head. Went from almost on the chopping block to a keeper and it only took a year .... :| ....

Ok my doe is NOT violent, thank god. She's getting better…. she doesn't cower or hunker down either. Her former owner said she was a good doe so I'm willing to take the time and do what needs done to win her over.

A lot could be my inexperience.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

To me, ears up indicates that they are alert and curious. If their eyes are wide and staring with ears up they are afraid of something. Ears laying on the head indicates they are calm and relaxed... but a resting rabbit may also have its ears upright,. As Zass said it isn't as clear of a signal with rabbits.

I guess as long as they're not struggling they're content. Or frozen in fear….

:lol: Look at their eyes. If you see the whites, they are scared.

 

[Dood]

You should be feel the tension in their body if they are nervous and is much more reliable than their ear position.

Besides - how do you interpret the ears of the lops ? :shock:

 

[Zass]

[album]2788[/album][album]2789[/album]

Here are some of my happy does showing good language.
Pancake is saying "any treats Boss?"
Dovetuft is just a doll who hops to the front of her cage to receive petting from anyone, even unfamiliar small children.

I don't make a habit of holding either doe, but both submit to handling and don't hold a grudge.
Most rabbits just feel a bit nervous with their feet off the ground.
My bucks always sniff me like mad when I'm carrying them. I always just figured they wanted every sniff of doe (and rival buck) they could get off me :roll:
If you get your doe acting like either of these girls, I'd say she was a happy animal.

 

[ek.blair]

[album]2788[/album]

Pancake is saying "any treats Boss?"

LOVE Pancake!!!!! :lol:

 

[Comet007]

[album]2788[/album][album]2789[/album]

Here are some of my happy does showing good language.
Pancake is saying "any treats Boss?"

Ever since we incorporated BOSS into their diets we are getting the nose through the cage look from both of our does! A big step for Velma, who always hunkered down in a back corner whenever we came into the bunny barn. She seemed to tolerate pets but didn't seek them. Daphne has been a treat hound, but only since kindling has she seemed to enjoy being pet, but only by me. Maybe because I held her water bottle for her to drink from when she was in labor?

I do know that all three of our rabbits act different with me than with DH - he was more assertive about petting each one every day right from when we got them. I waited longer and basically used their herbs as a bribe - first having them eat from the dish while I was holding it, then getting them to eat from my hand, then petting. Shaggy only took 3-4 days before he was greeting me at his door, Daphne wanted to play and get treats rather than being pet and Velma I waited the longest of all of them to pet her. Now all three are more open and affectionate with me than DH, even though he is very kind to them, just that he pushed the petting sooner! However, these are does that we got at 12 weeks old and the buck was 7 1/2 months old - starting with newborn kits is MUCH easier!!

 

[Brass]

Ok I'm convinced!!! Going for the BOSS!

Strangely enough, Hop Hop the NZW white buck (about 3 months old) is the most friendly. I'd heard they were nuts. Anyway, he submits relatively easily/happily to being held and he's ALWAYS at the cage front when I go to give food. He even tries to lift/push the door up with his face or teeth. He's hilarious and I know I shouldn't have favorites… buuuuuut……

Mama and Daddy Bob are still reservedly friendly. I'm going to have to clip his nails and palpate her so that should be fun, haha. Both submit to petting without running, etc, but they don't look as happy as your rabbit, Zass.

I think someone mentioned a Tablespoon a week of the Boss? They all like dandelions, so I'm sure they'll be happy for another yummy food in their diet!

 

[Comet007]

In my (very) limited experience, I would say the amount of BOSS depends on the condition of the rabbit. I monitor spines pretty much on a daily basis to make sure we don't have too fat or too lean buns. For our buck who really has no need for BOSS in his diet, I've found that giving him just a few seeds here and there makes him happy - actually now that we don't need to be giving our does the same boost that's what we're doing with them too. Giving them a few seeds each day keeps them happy without adding too many calories. As for giving just once a week, I think rabbits have a "what have you done for me lately?" demeanor, they'd likely give me the bunny kiss off if they didn't get a little treat daily! :lol:

 

[Zass]

:yeahthat:
For bribing purposes, a few seeds a day works better than a spoonful a week.

I also monitor my animals on a daily basis. Running my hands along their spines lets me know right away if there is a problem sometimes. For example, dehydration. When a spine is very easy to feel one day and wasn't the day before, it's generally because the rabbit is dehydrated and the water bottle should be inspected...you know, stuff like that. Just in case you needed another excuse for petting