A Tough Morning

[Buknee]

I woke up at 4:30 AM yesterday and hopped out of bed to go out and check on my rabbits. Lily had kindled late the night before (11:00ish) and all her kits were at the front of her nest box without a strand of fur on them. Thankfully they were all squirmy and together and she is my predictable 31 day gestation bunny. I quickly tucked them into the nest at the back of the box. Very little fur was pulled and it wouldn't pull from mama. I made due with other things to get them all covered and warm. I hung out for about an hour to be certain they warmed up and they did.
Anyway, back to yesterday. I went directly to Lily's cage and they were all doing great. Still tucked in and full tummies. But then....
I check on my doe who was now at 33 days gestation. (first litter) No, no, no! I see a half eaten baby on the wire, one cold dead on the wire and one tucked into a nest outside of the nest box. Yes, I warmed the dead kit, but it had been too long. I was so disappointed as I had high hopes for Muffin. Later in the morning, when I was a bit more awake, I found one more dead kit. I had missed it! It had crawled behind the feeder. I also found part of the placenta on the ground. It somehow fell through the wire. This might have contributed to Muffin eating a kit. I don't know. What do you think? I have never had a mother do this before since I keep them well nourished. Her kits were/are big. I weighed the one I tried to revive and it was 2.5 ounces.

Anyway, the good news: all remaining kits (10) are doing good. I put 2 of Lily's 9 with Muffin so the one survivor could stay warm. They are all warm with full tummies.
1st & 2nd photo: my lone survivor (beautiful) This kit is only 1 day old! What color is it considered?
3rd photo: dead kit

 

[Cosima]

The kit in the first pic is so beautiful. it’s ether a black harlequin or a chocolate harlequin.

 

[Buknee]

The kit in the first pic is so beautiful. it’s ether a black harlequin or a chocolate harlequin.

Thank you. I am guessing black harlequin.

 

[ladysown]

black harlequin.... for it to be fully furred means it was "overcooked". So should have been born day 31 but something caused delay in birthing. The half-eaten kit was probably just the doe cleaning up OR if it's her first litter, a mistake on her part. the fact that she cleaned them means she tried, she just didn't get all the parts right. I honestly would rebreed her IMMEDIATELY simply because you want to give her the best chance to have a larger litter next time which will make delivery easier.

 

[Buknee]

black harlequin.... for it to be fully furred means it was "overcooked". So should have been born day 31 but something caused delay in birthing. The half-eaten kit was probably just the doe cleaning up OR if it's her first litter, a mistake on her part. the fact that she cleaned them means she tried, she just didn't get all the parts right. I honestly would rebreed her IMMEDIATELY simply because you want to give her the best chance to have a larger litter next time which will make delivery easier.

Thank you for your input.
Yes, she was at 33 days. It was her first litter. She is being a good mother to her living kit. I have put 2 others with her from my other litter. I won't rebreed until they are at least 12 weeks since she is raising them.

 

[ladysown]

why 12 weeks? Just curious.

 

[Buknee]

why 12 weeks? Just curious.

I like my mamas to have plenty of time between litters. When I have bred closer together, I find that over time it really wears on their condition.
I have 8 does that I rotate through the year. So each one kindles three times with one other. (In a perfect world.)
I like to pair a first time doe with a proven. Or if I have a doe that has large kindles, I pair her with one that has small kindles so I can foster them over.
Muffin is doing fantastic nursing, so she now has three of Lily's kit to raise.
Muffin is now raising 4 and Lily 6. This gives the kits more nursing time.

 

[ladysown]

okay, it's always good to understand another person's thinking.

 

[MuddyFarms]

My does will not always eat every placenta. I see some on the floor beneath the cages after kindling, but none of the does eat their kits. If they have large litters, they can especially leave some placentas behind.

With her having four kits, they may have grown too large to be delivered well (as @ladysown also mentioned). That would also typically explain why she kindled later, as litters with fewer kits can grow longer before the doe kindles them (they’ve got more room in there!). I had one doe have trouble kindling a while back, and she had only 5 kits. Most of them were very large, and she had to pull them out with her teeth. She tore some of them and ended up eating parts as she cleaned up. She took 5 or 6 days to actually finish delivering them all. I rebred her one week after she kindled the last kit, and she had a large litter that time with no issues. She’s a great mama, and has had a number of litters since.

The basic idea with rebreeding sooner is that it usually increases kit numbers in a litter. That way her next litter should go easier on her when she delivers smaller kits.

 

[ladysown]

My does will not always eat every placenta. I see some on the floor beneath the cages after kindling, but none of the does eat their kits. If they have large litters, they can especially leave some placentas behind.

With her having four kits, they may have grown too large to be delivered well (as @ladysown also mentioned). That would also typically explain why she kindled later, as litters with fewer kits can grow longer before the doe kindles them (they’ve got more room in there!). I had one doe have trouble kindling a while back, and she had only 5 kits. Most of them were very large, and she had to pull them out with her teeth. She tore some of them and ended up eating parts as she cleaned up. She took 5 or 6 days to actually finish delivering them all. I rebred her one week after she kindled the last kit, and she had a large litter that time with no issues. She’s a great mama, and has had a number of litters since.

The basic idea with rebreeding sooner is that it usually increases kit numbers in a litter. That way her next litter should go easier on her when she delivers smaller kits.

well said Muddy Farms!

 

[Buknee]

The basic idea with rebreeding sooner is that it usually increases kit numbers in a litter. That way her next litter should go easier on her when she delivers smaller kits.

Thank you so much for explaining that. I had no idea. Did she have kits to raise and you just removed them when she was close to kindling again? Muffin has her sole survivor plus three of Lily's babies that she is raising. Doesn't that take a lot out of the Dam to be nursing and pregnant?

 

[ladysown]

nope, not when the litter is small.

 

[MuddyFarms]

Thank you so much for explaining that. I had no idea. Did she have kits to raise and you just removed them when she was close to kindling again? Muffin has her sole survivor plus three of Lily's babies that she is raising. Doesn't that take a lot out of the Dam to be nursing and pregnant?

Sure! Just thought it worth mentioning.

My doe did not have any live kits that first kindle. When I had another doe that only had three kits (she delivered them just fine, thankfully), I rebred her at 2.5-3 weeks and removed her kits at just over 5 weeks. They did well with the transition. She then had 1.5 weeks or so to herself before kindling 10 kits!

The first two weeks of a doe’s pregnancy are very low strain on her. The last two are the ones that are more work for her.

If Muffin is a good sized doe, four kits is practically no work for her to care for. If she had 7-13 kits, that would be a different story. You should be good to go with rebreeding her at pretty much any point. I decided that weaning those three of my kits early was better than losing my doe if she had too few kits the next time.

 

[RabbitsOfTheCreek]

I rebred her at 2.5-3 weeks and removed her kits at just over 5 weeks.

5 weeks seems like a pretty early time to separate them

 

[MuddyFarms]

5 weeks seems like a pretty early time to separate them

It can be, but there are definitely lots of factors that go into it. When a good doe has so few kits, they get nursed very well- so they were quite big for their ages and doing great on solid food. Results can vary when you do it, just like at any other age of weaning.

Most of the time, enabling a breeding doe to kindle successfully the next time after a fail is of greater importance and more reasonable to me than to let a very small litter nurse for a long time. Especially when the bunnies are able to handle it. I did not want to wean them any earlier than 5 weeks, personally, so that’s why I delayed rebreeding that second doe a couple weeks.

 

[ladysown]

kits do just fine being removed at five weeks. it's often best to move mom with them to a new area, and then two days later move mom back to her kindling area.

 

[Buknee]

The basic idea with rebreeding sooner is that it usually increases kit numbers in a litter. That way her next litter should go easier on her when she delivers smaller kits.

Why does rebreeding them sooner increase their litter number?

 

[MuddyFarms]

Why does rebreeding them sooner increase their litter number?

Oh, boy! I don’t specifically recall where to find that information. Anyone else know if the reason for this is known?

 

[ladysown]

Less fat build up