Doe not receptive

Robochelle · Sep 19, 2024

RabbitsOfTheCreek said:
You could try moving them to a different corner after cleaning them out

I'll add to this: bleach it also. If you have a way to destroy the smell, then when you put it back in a different spot it won't smell like it used to be a litter box. If she nested at all, you can add in any fur/nesting material she used (that wasn't covered with pee), to make it smell like her, but not like toilet.

As for used as a litter box, I've experienced different levels of that. One is a true definition of it which is urine and all poop ends up in that spot; she won't nest in that, but sometimes makes the nest using the outside wall, in the space next to it. In that case, once kits are born you can dump and bleach the 'litterbox' and put the outside nest in it; move it to where the nest was, and she will accept it.

If she only poops in the box , and it isn't all of her poop, and it is only at the one outside edge, she may still make the nest in it-- and she will not break the habit of pooping there, and the kits are less healthy for it. I had to change the nest to a box of a different shape, keep her 'litterbox' in so she didnt poop in the relocated nest, and they still didn't fare well. She did do better on her next Kindle though.

R Buns · Sep 19, 2024

RabbitsOfTheCreek said:
You could try moving them to a different corner after cleaning them out

I will do that! Thanks!

R Buns · Sep 19, 2024

Robochelle said:
I'll add to this: bleach it also. If you have a way to destroy the smell, then when you put it back in a different spot it won't smell like it used to be a litter box. If she nested at all, you can add in any fur/nesting material she used (that wasn't covered with pee), to make it smell like her, but not like toilet.

As for used as a litter box, I've experienced different levels of that. One is a true definition of it which is urine and all poop ends up in that spot; she won't nest in that, but sometimes makes the nest using the outside wall, in the space next to it. In that case, once kits are born you can dump and bleach the 'litterbox' and put the outside nest in it; move it to where the nest was, and she will accept it.

If she only poops in the box , and it isn't all of her poop, and it is only at the one outside edge, she may still make the nest in it-- and she will not break the habit of pooping there, and the kits are less healthy for it. I had to change the nest to a box of a different shape, keep her 'litterbox' in so she didnt poop in the relocated nest, and they still didn't fare well. She did do better on her next Kindle though.

Thank you. Very good information

tambayo · Sep 20, 2024

When it comes to neutralizing scent i prefer vinegar to bleach. Standard white vinegar for cooking is safe around bunnies.

Alaska Satin · Sep 20, 2024

Robochelle said:
I'll add to this: bleach it also. If you have a way to destroy the smell, then when you put it back in a different spot it won't smell like it used to be a litter box. If she nested at all, you can add in any fur/nesting material she used (that wasn't covered with pee), to make it smell like her, but not like toilet.

As for used as a litter box, I've experienced different levels of that. One is a true definition of it which is urine and all poop ends up in that spot; she won't nest in that, but sometimes makes the nest using the outside wall, in the space next to it. In that case, once kits are born you can dump and bleach the 'litterbox' and put the outside nest in it; move it to where the nest was, and she will accept it.

If she only poops in the box , and it isn't all of her poop, and it is only at the one outside edge, she may still make the nest in it-- and she will not break the habit of pooping there, and the kits are less healthy for it. I had to change the nest to a box of a different shape, keep her 'litterbox' in so she didnt poop in the relocated nest, and they still didn't fare well. She did do better on her next Kindle though.

I don't bleach fouled nest boxes before moving them, and it doesn't seem to have been a problem; once I move the cleaned-out box to a different spot, the doe usually quits using it as a litter box. Personally, I haven't seen any evidence that the smell of urine encourages them to use that spot - that surely would be convenient for litter-training, but it's never worked that way for me. My does seem to pick a spot in their cage to relieve themselves, and if the box is inadvertently placed there, they'll use it for that. The smell of the kits' urine is in the box nearly from the day they're born, anyway.

However, I have had bleach apparently deter does from using the box again, so I skip the bleach now. (Plus, I don't know for sure that it's a real risk, but it makes me nervous to use bleach where it might combine with ammonia from urine to produce toxic chloramine fumes.) My boxes are wooden, and I clean them by scraping and scrubbing, and then set the box in the sunshine (if available!) for natural deodorizing and sterilization. UV kills!

I have had box-sitter does who don't pee in their boxes, but consistently leave a pile of poo in the front part of their boxes where they hang out. It offends my aesthetic sensibilities, but honestly it never seemed to cause any harm to the bunnies in the nest. In fact I've seen the kits crawling up and eating it, and I figure it's just priming their little guts with the doe's microfauna.

R Buns · Sep 20, 2024

tambayo said:
When it comes to neutralizing scent i prefer vinegar to bleach. Standard white vinegar for cooking is safe around bunnies.

We have lots of that! Thanks!

R Buns · Sep 20, 2024

Well both does are open. My thinking is the buck was still heat sterile. My better half and I were discussing options tonight. We are leaning towards cutting our losses and processing the trio and replacing them but it's not set yet. I did treat this doe with ivermectin for the ear mites so I'm guessing I can't even try and breed her back for a bit putting us even farther behind. At what point are these two does getting too old to even make it worth while trying?

Alaska Satin · Sep 20, 2024

R Buns said:
Well both does are open. My thinking is the buck was still heat sterile. My better half and I were discussing options tonight. We are leaning towards cutting our losses and processing the trio and replacing them but it's not set yet. I did treat this doe with ivermectin for the ear mites so I'm guessing I can't even try and breed her back for a bit putting us even farther behind. At what point are these two does getting too old to even make it worth while trying?

That's disappointing.

If it was me, I wouldn't have any worries about re-breeding her after dosing. Ivermectin has a pretty solid safety record. I've used it a few times over the years without incident (for fur mites that were resistant to all the natural remedies I tried). I don't like to use medication unless it's needed, but in this case I'd agree it is.

I doubt you're out of time yet. My does keep producing into their third and fourth years, sometimes longer than that. If a doe hasn't had a litter at all by the age of 2, I start to feel a bit nervous, but I do know at least a couple of does which were bred for the first time at over 2 years old (a Mini Lop and a Polish), and both of them did just fine.

olhippityhop · Sep 21, 2024

I had a difficult doe that would refuse to lift. I had to hold her while my buck did his thing. I did get a few successful litters from her, doing this. I moved her out of my rabbitry and life is a lot more peaceful. I kept one of her sons and he's mellow and doesn't give me any trouble. If you can hang in there and get a litter from each doe, their offspring may perform well for you. From my (somewhat short) experience, the rabbits that grew up with me don't give me any trouble. If there are ill tempered offspring in the bunch, they get turned into dinner so that behavior gets weeded out.

This is what I did for my difficult doe:

I wear these when I'm handing a rabbit I know will scratch me: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B099NLB3D6?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1 they're a little tight for me but they are cheap and I don't get scratched anymore.

R Buns · Sep 21, 2024

Alaska Satin said:
That's disappointing.

If it was me, I wouldn't have any worries about re-breeding her after dosing. Ivermectin has a pretty solid safety record. I've used it a few times over the years without incident (for fur mites that were resistant to all the natural remedies I tried). I don't like to use medication unless it's needed, but in this case I'd agree it is.

I doubt you're out of time yet. My does keep producing into their third and fourth years, sometimes longer than that. If a doe hasn't had a litter at all by the age of 2, I start to feel a bit nervous, but I do know at least a couple of does which were bred for the first time at over 2 years old (a Mini Lop and a Polish), and both of them did just fine.

I am disappointed but honestly not surprised at this point. However I am surprised the doe that because quite cranky almost a week after breeding isn't bred. That seems odd. Now she just makes grumpy noises at everyone. I put her in with the buck a few minutes ago after reading this and she was making grumpy noises at him (well first when I went to get her out) but did lift twice but no more after that. She just hunkered down making noises at him after that. Got quite upset with me for putting her back in her cage too. Her whole personality shifted almost a week post breeding the first try. She's not gotten better.
This puts both my worries at ease. I'm going to give them another breeding chance. I would really like to at least recoup the purchase costs. Thank you so much!

R Buns · Sep 21, 2024

olhippityhop said:
I had a difficult doe that would refuse to lift. I had to hold her while my buck did his thing. I did get a few successful litters from her, doing this. I moved her out of my rabbitry and life is a lot more peaceful. I kept one of her sons and he's mellow and doesn't give me any trouble. If you can hang in there and get a litter from each doe, their offspring may perform well for you. From my (somewhat short) experience, the rabbits that grew up with me don't give me any trouble. If there are ill tempered offspring in the bunch, they get turned into dinner so that behavior gets weeded out.

This is what I did for my difficult doe:

I wear these when I'm handing a rabbit I know will scratch me: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B099NLB3D6?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1 they're a little tight for me but they are cheap and I don't get scratched anymore.

This video is very helpful. Not sure I can do that in the hutch but I'll try this. That isn't quite how I did it last time. I can not handle these does like this gal is. Certainly no way I could put them on a table like that and them not try and take off and go a bit wild. Hard enough in their cages. This video is how I remember our breeding stock being as a youngin. I truly feel like these rabbit's just haven't been handled. I may be completely wrong but that's the conclusion I'm coming up with. Plus I was trying not to get bit by her. She hasn't bit yet but after the 1st buck and her temperament since her arrival I'm way more cautious at the moment. I may need more practice which is something I never thought I'd say.

The plan when things turned into a stress was to keep nice offspring to raise as replacements but I'm wondering if we will make it that far at this point. The life would be more peaceful I am looking forward to. I think that's why I am ready to replace them vs carrying on. While this whole deal isn't the end of the world it's been quite an expense and a lot of care/work for nothing to show for it at this point. Well other than a bite and some decent scratches. Thank you so much for this item link. I am buying them tonight. I've been roasting wearing thick sweatshirts and gloves to protect myself. Won't be so bad in winter but it's been pretty yucky in the heat. I had no idea these even existed. I'll be getting a few pairs as they will be quite useful when doing trap neuter release work. Thank you

R Buns · Oct 26, 2024

Update on this thread:
This doe now has a beautiful litter. She's being a good mom so far. She has done great and everything was right on time. Surprisingly the other doe who was fine to breed did not get pregnant. She was bred first. Will try one more time then cull her. Wondering if the buck had to clear out heat sterility and then bred the second doe and was successful. I am not sure how the heat fertility works yet. Not going to cull doe 2 without a second chance. Technically 3 breedings but neither doe took the first breeding so I am not holding that against them. I do believe that was due to the heat.
Thank you to everyone for helping and supporting us in this journey. Really grateful for the great folks on this forum.

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