Deformed Kit- Max Factor? GRAPHIC!!!

MamaSheepdog · Aug 7, 2013

This kit is out of a Standard Rex pair, but it had an open eye like a Max Factor kit, a grossly herniated abdomen with exposed viscera, and a twisted tail. The skin on its skull was also not complete.

Open eye:

Closed eye:

Exposed organs- definitely not placenta, the abdomen was perforated:

Skull:

MamaMandy · Aug 7, 2013

I had a kit born with it's head looking just like that! Someone told me that is a max factor thing. Very weird!! You have 2 symptoms of max factor going on here. I hope someone has some ideas on this.

MamaSheepdog · Aug 7, 2013

Hmm. Well, I think I recall that the Mini Rex were developed from Rex (as opposed to breeding to a Dwarf breed), so it could be that my lines carry Dwarf? :?

As most of you know, I started with two pair of Rex, but one of my original bucks died before I could use him. So my foundation stock consisted of Black Floyd (buck), and two does, Feather and Poppy.

DE422, who delivered this kit, is out of Dirk on the topside, who is out of Floyd and Feather. On the bottom, we have Evil Blue, who is out of Floyd and Poppy.

DE422 was bred to Greystone, who is out of Quill on top, who was out of Floyd and Feather, and on the bottom is out of Poppy.

So obviously, I have a high propensity of matching up hidden genes. I am surprised that something like this has not shown up before, given that my whole herd is out of those 3 original animals.

MaggieJ · Aug 7, 2013

I'm not knowledgeable enough about this to even comment... but I sure hope it's not something that is likely to happen often.

Flemishstar · Aug 7, 2013

The closest I had to something born like this was a few baby chicks...Someone told me it had to do with inbreeding,,,but I dont believe it...I think it was just a fluke?...I hope this is the last you see of this MSD

MamaSheepdog · Aug 7, 2013

MaggieJ":1edrdsuv said:
I'm not knowledgeable enough about this to even comment... but I sure hope it's not something that is likely to happen often.

Me too.

It was pretty gruesome, especially because the kit was alive.

Flemishstar":1edrdsuv said:
The closest I had to something born like this was a few baby chicks...Someone told me it had to do with inbreeding,,,but I dont believe it.

This kit is actually one of the least inbred, given that the doe is directly out of one of my foundation does. :?

skysthelimit · Aug 7, 2013

Remember the one I had born with no nose holes? I'm hoping it's just a defect from heat stress.

MamaSheepdog · Aug 7, 2013

skysthelimit":pvi3zf45 said:
I'm hoping it's just a defect from heat stress.

There's a thought. I bred three does, all of whom kindled today.

We had very high temps for an extended period of time, and I wanted to check the virility of my bucks. Perhaps the sperm was damaged- but if so, I don't think he would have beat out the competition to fertilize the egg. :hmm:

Flemishstar · Aug 7, 2013

YES HEAT !!! LOL thats what I forgot to mention, I didnt believe about the inbreeding either, I though it had to do more with the heat, during conception,or incubation, It was a hot month the 2 weeks I was collecting eggs, good point!!

Kyle@theWintertime · Aug 7, 2013

I would suspect Max Factor because of the presentation but to be totally honest...given how many stages of development a creature goes through from conception to birth, it's a miracle things don't go wrong more often!!! It looks to me like if it isn't Max Factor (which it probably is) it is a very unfortunate birth defect.

I have an acquaintance that was born with an omphalocele like that...she survived but had to have major surgery at birth to get her viscera into her body. Her doctors have always told her it's just a developmental issue that happens sometimes, rarely is it genetic.

However...that plus the creepy eye, twisty tail and what looks like an open space on the head...I'd say this kit was just terribly unlucky and had something really wrong. I'm really sorry this happened. Hopefully it's a one-time deal!

DitchDoc · Aug 7, 2013

I'm sorry this happened, MSD

You do post some of the most amazing pics, though I'm sad for you and the kit. Never heard of the Max Factor...factor. Will be doing research on it. Always learn something new on this board!

MamaSheepdog · Aug 7, 2013

Thanks, Kyle.

It is remarkable that most of the time everything does go right during gestation.

But boy- a whole lot went wrong with this poor little kit.

I haven't been able to find out a lot about Max Factor, except that it comes from an ND buck named "Max". I think it highly unlikely that ND would have been introduced to improve some trait in the Standard Rex, so this must just be a horrible anomaly. I certainly hope so, anyway.

DitchDoc":2vx8tyv5 said:
I'm sorry this happened, MSD You do post some of the most amazing pics, though I'm sad for you and the kit.

Thanks, DitchDoc. It is not something I ever expected to see in a standard sized breed, that is for sure.

As to the pictures- well, I think it is important to have photos of things like this so we can all learn from them. But I'd much rather take pictures of happy, healthy critters instead!

jessie15273 · Aug 7, 2013

Some one may have bred some Mini rex into your foundation does' lines. People would do this to improve fur. So it would be a stretch from Netherland dwarf to mini rex to standard rex, but it could be possible. I dont think Max factor is connected to the dwarf gene, just that it first happened in a dwarf?

MamaMandy · Aug 8, 2013

jessie15273":38xqc80o said:
I dont think Max factor is connected to the dwarf gene, just that it first happened in a dwarf?

I believe that is correct Jessie.

__________ Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:01 am __________

Obviously I need to figure out how to properly use the quote feature! LOL

I fixed it for you.

To quote, you can click on the "Quote" button in the toolbar below the user's post and it will copy the text in its entirety. You can then delete the unwanted portions.

However, I find it is easier to go to the "Full Editor" option when you wish to quote only a line or two, or if you want to quote from multiple user's posts. The thread history will appear at the bottom of the page.

Highlight the portion you wish to quote. Click on the "Quote" button at the top of the user's post... otherwise the quote will be attributed to whomever's Quote button you click on.

Hope that helps!

--MSD

Cottie · Aug 8, 2013

Kyle@theHeathertoft":2g4w93c9 said:
I would suspect Max Factor because of the presentation but to be totally honest...given how many stages of development a creature goes through from conception to birth, it's a miracle things don't go wrong more often!!! It looks to me like if it isn't Max Factor (which it probably is) it is a very unfortunate birth defect.

This is what I'm thinking. It's probably just a very bad luck of the draw, influenced by heat and possibly genetics in a variety of ways.

Still...poor little guy. =(

MamaMandy · Aug 8, 2013

MamaMandy":2b6tmthx said:
I fixed it for you.

To quote, you can click on the "Quote" button in the toolbar below the user's post and it will copy the text in its entirety. You can then delete the unwanted portions.

However, I find it is easier to go to the "Full Editor" option when you wish to quote only a line or two, or if you want to quote from multiple user's posts. The thread history will appear at the bottom of the page.

Highlight the portion you wish to quote. Click on the "Quote" button at the top of the user's post... otherwise the quote will be attributed to whomever's Quote button you click on.

Hope that helps!

--MSD

Did I get it right this time?? LOL

Thanks! MSD!

__________ Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:12 pm __________

Yay! It worked!

__________ Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:13 pm __________ Ok, nevermind. It's still not right! It says that I said what you said.

What did I do wrong?

Cottie · Aug 8, 2013

This is how it should look in your editor

Code:

[quote="User Name"]The quote goes here[/quote]

Will look like this when published

User Name":2yv6h4bu said:
The quote goes here

MamaSheepdog · Aug 8, 2013

jessie15273":3f4ms5mo said:
Some one may have bred some Mini rex into your foundation does' lines. People would do this to improve fur. So it would be a stretch from Netherland dwarf to mini rex to standard rex, but it could be possible.

With further research, I have discovered that the ND was used in the development of mini Rex, so that could very well be the case.

http://angelrabbitry.net/rabbit/mini-re ... istory.php

MamaMandy":3f4ms5mo said:
jessie15273 wrote:
I dont think Max factor is connected to the dwarf gene, just that it first happened in a dwarf?

I believe that is correct Jessie.

What I have learned is that when this anomaly first appeared, it was traced back to a Netherland Dwarf named Max. Peanuts are caused by Pituitary Dwarfism- the pituitary regulates growth, so with one copy of the gene you get a normally proportioned but small rabbit, but with two so little growth hormone is released that the kit cannot survive.

Max Factor is something different altogether, and can show up in other breeds where ND has been bred in. The information I have been able to find does not cover the standard sized rabbit breeds.

http://www.angelfire.com/hero2/2of4news ... /pg16.html

http://www.amysrabbitranch.com/Breeding ... actors.pdf __________ Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:34 am __________

MamaMandy":3f4ms5mo said:
MamaMandy":3f4ms5mo said:

I fixed it for you.

To quote, you can click on the "Quote" button in the toolbar below the user's post and it will copy the text in its entirety. You can then delete the unwanted portions.

However, I find it is easier to go to the "Full Editor" option when you wish to quote only a line or two, or if you want to quote from multiple user's posts. The thread history will appear at the bottom of the page.

Highlight the portion you wish to quote. Click on the "Quote" button at the top of the user's post... otherwise the quote will be attributed to whomever's Quote button you click on.

Hope that helps!

--MSD

Click to expand...

Did I get it right this time?? LOL

Thanks! MSD!

__________ Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:12 pm __________

Yay! It worked!

__________ Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:13 pm __________

Ok, nevermind. It's still not right! It says that I said what you said. What did I do wrong?

You didn't do anything wrong at all. It says it is you because I edited your post using my Super-Mod powers. My text is not attributed to me in the eyes of the computer- which is why I colored it blue, to differentiate my post from yours.

MamaMandy · Aug 8, 2013

MamaSheepdog":1h3gr40m said:
You didn't do anything wrong at all. It says it is you because I edited your post using my Super-Mod powers. My text is not attributed to me in the eyes of the computer- which is why I colored it blue, to differentiate my post from yours.

Oh good! It makes sense now.

I was beginning to think I was crazy. Well, I know I am a little crazy...but, wow!

Deformed Kit- Max Factor? GRAPHIC!!!

Help Support Rabbit Talk Forum:

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Administrator

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Join the conversation!

Join today and get all the highlights of this community direct to your inbox. It's FREE!