Dead Rabbit URGENT

[Cspr]

This morning, I woke up to find my herd buck, Basil, unmoving in his cage. He was alive at that point and my mother and I took him to the vet, since we have a local thrifty vet who only charges for what he does. Basil was lethargic, seemed to have trouble moving (including holding up his head), and wouldn't swallow water. He had watery diarrhea. My vet is going to do a necropsy, but I'm trying to figure out what exactly I'm dealing with, to protect the rabbits I can.

He was perfectly healthy the night before. Clear eyes, clear ears, good teeth, good feet, no abscesses, etc. He ate a full meal, same as what the others ate. Within a night, he grew sick and died. He had spasms near death.

Prior to this, he escaped his hutch (two weeks ago) and was gone for several hours and my family had a campfire. He sneezed once with sticky, watery white snot and I quarantined him, but he had no further issues. Within the week, however, he's had trouble with food aggression and seemed picky about his greens.

None of the other animals seem sick, even though he was just bred to two of my does.

Thoughts? I'm swaying between pastuerella, coccidiosis, and Tyzzer's disease.

__________ Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:47 am __________

And if I wanted to keep the pelt, is that even possible? If so, how soon do I have to take it to someone to get it done or do it myself with tannic acid?

 

[Cottie]

You'd have to get the pelt back from necropsy. Is the vet doing it or having the corpse shipped to a lab? Most vets ship to a lab - too much equipment involved in bacterial/viral/parasitic analysis for most clinics. A straight necropsy of the organs can tell you sometimes, but with mine, it told me nothing. I never figured out for certain what caused the deaths (couldn't afford the lab work).

Something progressing that quickly doesn't sound like cocci or P, at least not with a mature rabbit. Tyzzer's is a definite possibility. I'd say start everyone on a prophylactic treatment, however if that's not what you're dealing with there is a risk of causing problems with an inappropriate treatment.

 

[MaggieJ]

So sorry you lost your Basil. There may be a link between his escape and his death, but it may be difficult to establish.

I know of no reason not to save his hide. After he is skinned, I suggest you freeze it until you can work out a plan for the actual tanning. Check out the Rabbits for Fur forum for information.

 

[Cspr]

Thank you, guys. I'm leaning towards Tyzzer's myself. It was just so fast. And I think the vet is just doing a necropsy, but maybe some tests. Despite it being a small vet, the doc has been at it for years and he even treats raccoons and all. If he doesn't sort it out, I'd be surprised.

Would you suggest any treatment in particular? I figure I'll do herbal immune boosters for all the others, anyway.

And I'll get him after the necropsy, so I suppose I'll skin him, salt it, and put it in the freezer until I can decide what to do with it then. I'll contact some local people. Just not sure I'll be able to keep my hands steady enough and I only have prep for bark tanning.

 

[Miss M]

I'm so sorry you lost Basil!

It is possible that whatever caused his death was not infective. Even if it is, you don't want to start your rabbits on the wrong treatment, and then have to switch. If you feel you must start them on something, you can do PenG, as Tyzzer's is sensitive to penicillin, or tetracycline, for the same reason.

I agree with RJS... it doesn't sound like P. or C. to me. I had never heard of Tyzzer's disease before, and had to look it up. Sounds like it mostly infects wild animals and laboratory animals, so I guess if that's what it is, you probably had a mouse or rat transmit it.

I think all you can do at this point is remove everything of his from the rabbitry carefully and quickly, and disinfect it and leave it in the sun... and watch your other buns for behavioral changes like what you saw in him his last week, until you get results back or other rabbits start acting a little off.

What's the time frame for results?

 

[Frecs]

Have you checked the feed? not sure if moldy food would kill that quickly or not? how about contaminated hay? again, just tossing out some guesses...

immune boosters would be a very good idea!

sorry about poor Basil... I lost a favorite buck this summer...it so sucks...

 

[Cspr]

No idea. Won't start treatment unless I must, but I figured since he had severe diarrhea, some rolled oats and some herbs that help with stomach issues and all wouldn't be harmful, so I have everyone a handful of that. I also removed Basil's nest box. All that's left are his feeder, water bottle, and a few toys I'll have to toss. Need to do that soon, but of course today my disability wants to act up and it's freezing outside. :/ And I'm very careful with their feed, Frecs. It's kept in a plastic box inside. I had mold once in a small bowl on the counter, but nothing in what I've ever fed. It's unlikely the hay or feed has any issues, since none of the other animals are sick. Then again, if it was infectious, wouldn't it be likely the others would show odd signs?

Bit worried about one, Fiona. She seems overly tired. Not sure what to do but to keep an eye on them and make sure they don't suffer any like he did.

Also, I know this is unlikely, but the neighbor's dog is sick. Our dog plays with the dog through the fence and she comes with me into the rabbitry. Should I even consider that, or is it far more likely that a critter tried to steal some of their food? We definitely have a rodent problem. The cats bring voles to the doorstep all the time.

Note: I should have the results of the necropsy this afternoon.

 

[Zass]

It sounds a lot like what I just nursed my favorite doe through.
The day before she looked and acted great.
Next day.
Miserable bunny, tons of watery diarrhea(not cecals) appetite loss for a few days, actually she lost most of her body weight. The only stressing factor for her would have been her 9 kits. New rabbits were present, quarantined, but since I'm the only caretaker, contamination is always possible. A few other buns passed some large loose cecals or had a messy bottom for a few days and recovered. (all does, some of the new buns and some of the old ones) They all got it and recovered about the same time, only the nursing doe was sick to near death. No kits were effected.
I helped her through it with supportive care, dropper feeding pedialyte and mashed pumpkin to keep her hydrated and prevent GI stasis during the worst of it. She's since recovered, and started nursing again after the ordeal. Didn't see a vet. None of the kits are sick. If it was Tyzzars disease it should have wreaked some havoc on the kits, right?

 

[Cottie]

Zass, I'd think if it was Tyzzer's it would have taken out at least some of the kits. But the Michigan DNR says that it usually affects "young and weanlings"...maybe those still in the nestbox are protected somehow?

 

[Zass]

Zass, I'd think if it was Tyzzer's it would have taken out at least some of the kits. But the Michigan DNR says that it usually affects "young and weanlings"...maybe those still in the nestbox are protected somehow?

My 8 or 9 week old SF kits never faltered, my 14 week old does had messy bottoms for a few days and recovered without intervention, they never looked miserable like the hard hit doe.

Everyone recovered with no relapses, but I'm pretty sure the nursing doe wouldn't have survived without the supportive care.

 

[DogCatMom]

Cspr, I just want to add my condolences for suffering the sudden loss of your herd sire, Basil. I'm so sorry.

 

[AmysMacdog]

I'm so sorry about Basil, I hope you can get some answers from the necropsy.

 

[Kyle@theWintertime]

Really sorry for your loss! Hopefully the vet will find some answers.

 

[Cspr]

The vet was in surgery until he went home, but he gave me a brief call. Currently he thinks it is pasteurella, but I'm going to ask him if he thinks that because of the information I gave or because of the necropsy. I know all three diseases do things to the internal organs, and if there is pus around the heart or lungs, I'll presume it was pasteurella.

Insofar, all my Mini Rex seem healthy. Clean butts except for one who just had a normal-looking poop stuck to her butt that I got off. Clean front legs and no snot on their noses. Bright-eyes without gunk except for a little sleep crud (they always have sleep crud, though). Everyone active and begging for pets and greens.

However, my Lion Lop pet seems a bit tired and is having very small poop. I think she might just be sad and moving less because of it--she's a very sensitive rabbit--but I'll give her only hay and wet greens today to see if I can get her to create larger, darker pellets.

__________ Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:12 am __________

So almost the same thing happened to another rabbit suddenly yesterday. I had hours notice. What the hell is happening here? I mean, it's been months between, but the only sign was limpness/muscular looseness and towards the end spasms. No diarrhea I could see, just a few wet droppings.

I let some older kids play with said rabbit under the care of my mother, BUT the youngest was an eleven-year-old who lives on a pig and horse farm. I don't think they'd have hurt her? Even so I cannot find a damn thing wrong with her.

They're not related at all, so it's not genetic. She was only born in Aug. of last year, a young rabbit.

Otherwise, I'll just be in my bed freaking out over having lost my BEST show rabbit, BEST fur rabbit, etc. Also a rabbit I'd grown extremely fond of. <br /><br /> __________ Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:14 am __________ <br /><br /> Do you guys think I should do a necropsy? This time there wasn't even any aggression over a couple of days, nor that godawful smell. Maybe it's something else? I'm worried at a local fire, making smoke inhalation? But, again, she's the only rabbit affected. I'm just kind of emotional. It's below freezing by quite a lot and I was just outside digging a hole so the kid(s) don't see what's happened, but... I mean, maybe I could at least keep the pelt, I didn't get to do that with Basil.

 

[MaggieJ]

So sorry you lost another one, Cspr.

My guess is that the two deaths are unrelated. Your second rabbit had some stress before its death: playing with the kids, the smoke. If there was any invisible weakness, those things could have tipped the balance.

A necropsy might give you some answers. And there is no reason not to save the skin for tanning.

 

[ladysown]

could simply be gut stasis due to stress.

some rabbits are more sensitive to changes in their environment and can go off feed.

Best you can do is support them or cull them quickly. Some rabbits can recover but will always be prone to digestive upset and you don't want to pass that tendency along in your health lines.