Color (genetics) Question
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Agouti is dominant so it cannot be carried and always shows in the coat.
Your proposed breeding depends on the agouti doe. If she had has two genes causing agouti her kits will all be agouti. If she has only 1 agouti gene, only half will be agouti when bred to a solid black buck. To confuse us more, you can have a black rabbit that is really a "super" Steele that has the agouti gene and two Steele genes making them look black. I was fooled once and royally T.O. at the breeder I got her from!
Do you know the colours of the does parents? If both were agouti then she likely has two genes, if one was solid then she only has one.
Your proposed breeding depends on the agouti doe. If she had has two genes causing agouti her kits will all be agouti. If she has only 1 agouti gene, only half will be agouti when bred to a solid black buck. To confuse us more, you can have a black rabbit that is really a "super" Steele that has the agouti gene and two Steele genes making them look black. I was fooled once and royally T.O. at the breeder I got her from!
Do you know the colours of the does parents? If both were agouti then she likely has two genes, if one was solid then she only has one.
Dood,
The does dam was a "Cal" and her sire was an agouti
The bucks dam was an agouti and his sire was a tri-color
All the kits out of the first mating are black or Cal marked.
I don't care much for black rabbits, but both the bucks I need to cross in are black. I want to save at least one doe and maybe two from this mating and prefer agouti. Breed again and hope for better luck?
The does dam was a "Cal" and her sire was an agouti
The bucks dam was an agouti and his sire was a tri-color
All the kits out of the first mating are black or Cal marked.
I don't care much for black rabbits, but both the bucks I need to cross in are black. I want to save at least one doe and maybe two from this mating and prefer agouti. Breed again and hope for better luck?
skysthelimit
Well-known member
Cal is still an agouti A gene, with a himi gene stripping away the color. Tri color in most cases is still an agouti gene. I would have to know the rest of the litter to tell what else she might carry. Got a REW from a castor to castor (agouti) breeding that is not an agouti, have yet to have any agouti kits. She has black kits, otter kits with an otter, so she's probably a black. Anyway, she could carry several things with that agouti, because Cal can carry black. You may get black kits, you may get agouti kits. May not happen the first time. I bred my agouti doe twice to a broken black, and did not get a single agouti either time. And yes that black could be a steel. Still not enough info to solve the whole equation, you will have to breed her to see what they both carry.
Since this breeding has produced self blacks, she only has one agouti gene and a quarter of the litter should be agouti. It was bad luck you only got blacks.
I am surprised you got cali marked kits from this breeding. The doe will have a himi gene from her sire, be thankful it is not the REW, but I would not expect the buck to have one, based on his parents at least, but he must have had an ancestor who did.
Could you post a picture of the agouti doe, or is she the red one in your profile picture?
I am surprised you got cali marked kits from this breeding. The doe will have a himi gene from her sire, be thankful it is not the REW, but I would not expect the buck to have one, based on his parents at least, but he must have had an ancestor who did.
Could you post a picture of the agouti doe, or is she the red one in your profile picture?
skysthelimit
Well-known member
Dood":27lec766 said:
Crappy isn't it. I don't care for blacks.
I have discovered that quite a few people breed the himis to otters and blacks. I only have one himi buck, for my sable project, and he is very closely related to the doe, so I will have to breed the gene into my herd to continue it. Unfortunately, nearly everyone in the herd carries REW, so I may get more himis than I really want.
The picture in my profile is just some kits from a couple of years ago. The doe is a standard agouti. I have had some red does, but she isn't out of that stock. Not sure if I'll have an opportunity to get a picture of her, but I will give it a try.
I appreciate the help everyone. As far as what I might get out of any of these rabbits, they have purposefully mixed genes, and almost any color is likely to pop up (except chocolate). The doe is getting old and it is important to me to get some stock does out of her before she stops producing. But I really don't want black or Cal if I can help it.
I appreciate the help everyone. As far as what I might get out of any of these rabbits, they have purposefully mixed genes, and almost any color is likely to pop up (except chocolate). The doe is getting old and it is important to me to get some stock does out of her before she stops producing. But I really don't want black or Cal if I can help it.
The cali cropping up threw me off and I thought you might have a red/fawn/castor and not realize it. It is weird that you only got black and cali, was it a small litter? Statisically you should get one quarter of the litter agouti. The black buck must have a hidden a himalayan or REW gene to get cali markings in his offspring.
I would try your luck again. None of the black kits will have an agouti gene but you could try keeping the cali kits, they may be agouti pointed and have a 25% chance of passing it on OR buy a proven agouti with agouti parents and siblings, remember that chinchilla/silver coloured rabbits have one or two agouti genes as well.
I would try your luck again. None of the black kits will have an agouti gene but you could try keeping the cali kits, they may be agouti pointed and have a 25% chance of passing it on OR buy a proven agouti with agouti parents and siblings, remember that chinchilla/silver coloured rabbits have one or two agouti genes as well.
I would say that doe (one with the black rabbit next to her)is not agouti but a tortiseshell and this explains why you only got black and cali kits. She is really a black rabbit thats colour is being modified by a double recessive at the E-locus and she does not have an agouti gene, I'm afraid you are out of luck.
Well she certainly looks agouti in this picture but her baby pic makes me wonder, she doesn't have the buff coloured eye liner or belly seen in agouti, and I bet under her tail is dark as well.
Actually she kinda looks like a steel agouti AKA gold tipped steel. It is possible the black kits are really "super steel" who have two steel genes and look black. I have some of these, the kits are born black and at around 2 months some of them develop ticking but some dont and are "false blacks". It is possible your black kits will change colour.
Isn't genetics fun! :baby04:
All I can say is give it another go and hope for the best.
Actually she kinda looks like a steel agouti AKA gold tipped steel. It is possible the black kits are really "super steel" who have two steel genes and look black. I have some of these, the kits are born black and at around 2 months some of them develop ticking but some dont and are "false blacks". It is possible your black kits will change colour.
Isn't genetics fun! :baby04:
All I can say is give it another go and hope for the best.
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Thanks for the help every one. I guess there might be any color floating around since these rabbits are a cross breed of many different varieties including:
a)Blue Brazilian buck with buff underparts.
b)San Juan (agouti)
c) NZW
d)Californian (from show stock)
e)French Lop (Broken)
f)Flemish (light buff color)
g) half Harley/half Brazilian
a)Blue Brazilian buck with buff underparts.
b)San Juan (agouti)
c) NZW
d)Californian (from show stock)
e)French Lop (Broken)
f)Flemish (light buff color)
g) half Harley/half Brazilian
