Soy in meat after feeding pellet containing soy?

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ThunderHill

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Hi! One of the reasons we raise meat rabbits is to ensure our meat doesn't contain traces of soy, however the only soy-free pellet we can find is from New Country Organics, and is around $40 per 50 lb. bag. We feed Manna PRO to everyone else (less than half that price), and the NCO to our meat growouts, but even that gets really expensive really quick! Does anyone know how long the traces of soy would remain in the meat if we were to feed them the Manna PRO up until just a few weeks or so before processing? Do you know of any research on the topic? I've checked with all local feed mills and nobody produces anything that would work for us, so the NCO is really our only pellet option.

Thanks so much for any information you might have!

(Also, I know many folks don't think soy is a problem, and I respect that. I'm not trying to start a debate on whether or not soy is okay. My family tries to limit soy wherever we can because that's what we have decided is right for us.)
 

ThunderHill

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Well, you could have them on a hay only diet.
Thanks, but we want them to get the complete nutrition of a pellet and hay diet. We'd like to venture more into feeding fresh forage as a supplement someday, as we have a lot of good weeds, mulberry, etc. on our 11 acres, but for now just trying to figure out how long we need to "finish" them on the soy-free pellets to not have residual soy in the meat.
 

ladysown

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I did some research and was unsucessful in my search. based on rabbits' quick metabolisms, and depending on your butchering plans (say 8 weeks vs 16 weeks) at 8 weeks I don't think you'll have finishing time unless you simply feed them the expensive feed from the get go. Beyond 8 weeks....it rather depends on the protein amount of the non-soy feed. and how long you need to grow them out. a higher protein feed will grow them out faster, a lower protein feed to take longer to grow out. so you'll need to balance that out.
 

Preitler

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I'm not quite sure I understand the issue.
As far as I know, the food gets split up and those amino acids are used to build the growing body, so there will always, or for many, many years be part of the food be left in the bodys. That doesn't mean that it could cause something like an allergic reaction.

I don't know much about soy allergies - if people with it can eat normal meat that would mean that no allergens get into it at all. Or are there time periods before butchering where soy must not be fed in agriculture?
In the case of a severe allergy I would be more worried about handling the feed.

I could totally understand to not wanting to feed GMOs, and I guess most soy in the US is modified, but in that case I wouldn't feed it at all.

It would be easier to answer when knowing the reason why you don't want to feed soy.
 

kotapony

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I know we’re wandering a bit off topic, but I’m also curious what the movement is against soy? Especially when the substitute in feeds is peas. Both are in the same family. What is it that soy has, but peas do not?

I’m genuinely curious and hoping to learn. :)
 

kotapony

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I don’t know if this is helpful, but here’s a study that shows chickens fed soy and peanuts have no detectable traces of those proteins in their meat or eggs.


I suppose I’m not sure what else besides proteins from the soy would stay in the meat, to try and research it?
 

ThunderHill

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Thanks for the responses! I just searched YouTube and found this video that explains some of the reasons:

Watch "10 Reasons to Avoid Soy Products in Your Diet"

Again, many folks don't think there's an issue and I'm sure you could also find videos and research saying the exact opposite of this, so not trying to say anyone else is wrong if they think differently! But our concerns are more aligned with these reasons and are not allergy-related.
 
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pacard

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Hi! One of the reasons we raise meat rabbits is to ensure our meat doesn't contain traces of soy, however the only soy-free pellet we can find is from New Country Organics, and is around $40 per 50 lb. bag. We feed Manna PRO to everyone else (less than half that price), and the NCO to our meat growouts, but even that gets really expensive really quick! Does anyone know how long the traces of soy would remain in the meat if we were to feed them the Manna PRO up until just a few weeks or so before processing? Do you know of any research on the topic? I've checked with all local feed mills and nobody produces anything that would work for us, so the NCO is really our only pellet option.

Thanks so much for any information you might have!

(Also, I know many folks don't think soy is a problem, and I respect that. I'm not trying to start a debate on whether or not soy is okay. My family tries to limit soy wherever we can because that's what we have decided is right for us.)
Hello. I am very new to meat rabbitry and have been researching all aspects of rabbit care and feeding for meat. First, I have no idea the effects of soy on rabbit meat. However, I have thoroughly researched the topic of what to feed and not to feed rabbits (my research continues). My breeder feeds his herd Co-Op Complete Rabbit Pellets (manufactured by Protrition Feed, LLC in TN) or Producer's Pride Rabbit (manufactured for Tractor Supply Company). See attached for details. According to the guaranteed analysis of both products, there does not appear to be any specifically designated soy ingredients.
 

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ThunderHill

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I don’t know if this is helpful, but here’s a study that shows chickens fed soy and peanuts have no detectable traces of those proteins in their meat or eggs.


I suppose I’m not sure what else besides proteins from the soy would stay in the meat, to try and research it?
This was really helpful! We also have chickens for eggs and had the same concern with those, and I hadn't been able to find anything like this. Thank you so much!
 

ThunderHill

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I did some research and was unsucessful in my search. based on rabbits' quick metabolisms, and depending on your butchering plans (say 8 weeks vs 16 weeks) at 8 weeks I don't think you'll have finishing time unless you simply feed them the expensive feed from the get go. Beyond 8 weeks....it rather depends on the protein amount of the non-soy feed. and how long you need to grow them out. a higher protein feed will grow them out faster, a lower protein feed to take longer to grow out. so you'll need to balance that out.
Thank you!
 

ThunderHill

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I'm not quite sure I understand the issue.
As far as I know, the food gets split up and those amino acids are used to build the growing body, so there will always, or for many, many years be part of the food be left in the bodys. That doesn't mean that it could cause something like an allergic reaction.

I don't know much about soy allergies - if people with it can eat normal meat that would mean that no allergens get into it at all. Or are there time periods before butchering where soy must not be fed in agriculture?
In the case of a severe allergy I would be more worried about handling the feed.

I could totally understand to not wanting to feed GMOs, and I guess most soy in the US is modified, but in that case I wouldn't feed it at all.

It would be easier to answer when knowing the reason why you don't want to feed soy.
Hi! I posted a video that explains some of the reasons, and not wanting GMO is certainly another one! It's not due to allergies. Thanks for your response!
 

ThunderHill

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Hello. I am very new to meat rabbitry and have been researching all aspects of rabbit care and feeding for meat. First, I have no idea the effects of soy on rabbit meat. However, I have thoroughly researched the topic of what to feed and not to feed rabbits (my research continues). My breeder feeds his herd Co-Op Complete Rabbit Pellets (manufactured by Protrition Feed, LLC in TN) or Producer's Pride Rabbit (manufactured for Tractor Supply Company). See attached for details. According to the guaranteed analysis of both products, there does not appear to be any specifically designated soy ingredients.
Thanks so much! I appreciate the info. Although unfortunately, I think "plant protein products" is a generic term for soy (among other things). 😞
 

eco2pia

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So, the issue people may be concerned about could be the soy protein itself--if there were an allergy that is usually what the allergy is triggered by. In that case soy in animal feed is not a concern at all. Animal protein is animal protein, there are not traces of soy protein "in" it somehow. I am not a metabolic scientist, but I actually am a research scientist in a biological field (immunology) and regarding allergens I feel confident in this statement. If I actually need to cite papers I can, but I am just trying to offer reasurance on ONE count first.

If you are worried about other chemicals, such as plant hormones, that is a little trickier. In the case of milk production, those type of chemicals can be transmitted through the milk. I do not think they are likely to be an issue in meat production, but to be certian, I would withhold soy-based feed for 1-2 weeks, and avoid consuming the animal fat--generally not a problem with rabbits, as they are not typically riddled with fat anyway. The hormones are an issue in milk production because they are fat soluable. Typically they are not particularly stable however. The animal will metabolically break them down into generic components realtively quickly.

To be clear, I completely respect your choice, but I do not avoid soy products myself and do not think there really needs to be any concern at all. I want to provide information without suggesting that I practice this in any way. Each person needs to make choices for themselves. I am also a GMO fan, and can articulate why, and when I think they have value and when they don't. Both topics are nuanced and deserve to be understood. Basically, I like people to have informed choice but I HATE alarmist fear mongering.
 

ThunderHill

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So, the issue people may be concerned about could be the soy protein itself--if there were an allergy that is usually what the allergy is triggered by. In that case soy in animal feed is not a concern at all. Animal protein is animal protein, there are not traces of soy protein "in" it somehow. I am not a metabolic scientist, but I actually am a research scientist in a biological field (immunology) and regarding allergens I feel confident in this statement. If I actually need to cite papers I can, but I am just trying to offer reasurance on ONE count first.

If you are worried about other chemicals, such as plant hormones, that is a little trickier. In the case of milk production, those type of chemicals can be transmitted through the milk. I do not think they are likely to be an issue in meat production, but to be certian, I would withhold soy-based feed for 1-2 weeks, and avoid consuming the animal fat--generally not a problem with rabbits, as they are not typically riddled with fat anyway. The hormones are an issue in milk production because they are fat soluable. Typically they are not particularly stable however. The animal will metabolically break them down into generic components realtively quickly.

To be clear, I completely respect your choice, but I do not avoid soy products myself and do not think there really needs to be any concern at all. I want to provide information without suggesting that I practice this in any way. Each person needs to make choices for themselves. I am also a GMO fan, and can articulate why, and when I think they have value and when they don't. Both topics are nuanced and deserve to be understood. Basically, I like people to have informed choice but I HATE alarmist fear mongering.
Thanks so much for the information! And I totally agree with you about fear mongering and people having informed choice! I think I may just have to figure out how to mix my own blend of feed and forage someday so I don't even have to think about it!
 

SoftPawsRabbitry

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I have over 20+ sensitivities that all trigger my celiacs, and quite a few people I know also have allergies or sensitivities! I've also heard the GMO side of it can cause some bad effects, however, everyone has different reasons, mine would definitely be my allergies!
 
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Looking into feeding them moringa (leaves and branches) might be interesting. The leaves can be 25% protein (extremely high).

It doesn't constitute what would typically be considered a well balanced bunny diet (calcium is a bit high, I believe), but it's used extensively in Africa as rabbit feed with good success.
 
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