- Mar 22, 2022
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Her pedigree only says broken castor, but I’ve been skeptical of that since getting her. And unfortunately, I have no way to contact her breeder now. Her markings don’t seem very castor like to me but I definitely could be wrong!Hello, the genes that make a Charlie/Broken/Solid rabbit are not the same as the ones that make a Tri-colour rabbit, so yes it’s possible for a Charlie to produce Tri’s. If you breed her to a solid and got a whole litter of Broken pattern kits then she is a Charlie. From looking at your photos she may be a Tri herself?
Interesting, thank you! How would I figure out if my buck is the carrier? I do know his mom was harlequinized.A 'tri', short for tricolor, is simply another broken, in this case a broken harlequin. So if she's produced only brokens and tris, she's simply produced all brokens. A 'Charlie' is what we call broken patterned rabbits that have very little color showing, typically 10% or less color. The color typically only shows on the midline down the back, small eye circles, a bit on the ears and small nose markings that reminded someone of a Charlie Chaplin mustache, hence the nickname--Charlies. Your doe certainly matches that description, and the 100% broken offspring fits as well, as Charlies are homozygous (double copies of the same gene allele) EnEn--double broken. Since broken is dominant, and she can't contribute anything else but broken En, all the kits are broken.
Now, the question is, are you mating her to a harlequin carrier, or is she the carrier? If she's the carrier, it would explain why her color looks 'off'. When harlequin is a recessive in the background, it can mess with the colors. I have a litter now of really odd shaded chestnuts, looking similar to the color in yours (castor & chestnut & black agouti are all names for the same color), and mine are out of a chestnut and a harlequin. Really messed with the color.
Thank you for the info / clarification! How many test breedings should be done to confirm this? I’ve already done 2 breeding that were all brokens. I just don’t want to call her a true Charlie when it’s not trueI think the question is a bit confused. For a rabbit to be shown as a broken (a colored coat broken up by white patches), it needs to have a certain amount of color. For angoras, the minimum is 10% color/90% white, with a maximum of 75% color/30% white. For Holland Lops, the maximum amount of color is 70%, I didn't see a minimum. Broken Rex are 10-50% color. It would be very subjective when you got down to Charlie status as to whether a coat is 9% or 11% color. Tris are a subset of brokens, and aren't showable in many breeds, so this isn't so much a showing issue. Generally, for a broken to be showable, your breed has to have sanctioned brokens as an acceptable pattern, AND the base color has to be an accepted color as well. Some, like Holland Lops, have accepted tri, even though harlequin is not accepted.
I think the difficulty is in determining what makes a Charlie. Technically, it is simply a nickname given to rabbits with two broken EnEn genes (the En is code for 'English spotting', as the English Spot breed's spots come from this gene.) Since they aren't born with a genetic flag that says 'Look at me! I'm a genetic Charlie!', we need to look for clues. The first clue that you can see is the minimal spotting. But that's only a clue. It doesn't make them a Charlie. The 100% broken kits when bred to a solid is the best sign that the parent has only dominant broken genetics.
By definition, Charlies lack much color in their broken coat. It's the first clue. So, you can't have too much white/too little color to be a Charlie. You may well not have enough color to be a showable broken, that's a different issue. The Charlie issue is talking genetics, which we call genotype--En En Charlie vs. the normal broken En en (en en is a normal solid color rabbit, double recessive). The 'not enough color' issue is talking show/registration status based on appearace, called phenotype. Charlies simply lack much color, the real proof of being a Charlie is in the inability to throw any other offspring than brokens when mated to a solid.
Yes, it is a good point, for show purposes they are definitely different. The Harlequin breed doesn't show in tricolor, and Holland Lops show as tricolor but not as harlequin. Genetically, a tricolor is a harlequin rabbit with the En spotting gene added, causing a broken harlequin. Since the harlequin already has two colors in patches (like black/orange, blue/cream, chocolate/fawn, lilac/cream), adding white gives a third 'color', making it a tri-color. Interestingly enough, the rabbits with the 'best' harlequin jester pattern, like a checkerboard with alternating ear, face, and leg colors, and at least four alternating body bands of color--doesn't necessarily make the best tricolor. Those rabbits with a narrower, splotchier if you will, pattern, seem to look better when reduced to tricolor dots of color, as there are so many more polka dots of different color. Again, when you're showing, you breed for the genetics that produces the best show coat. The chinchilla version of harlequin, magpie, with a color mixed with pearl white instead of fawn/orange/cream--doesn't really make a tricolor even when it is a broken magpie. White, pearl white & color just doesn't cut it as a tricolor.Tricolour and harlequin are actually two different colours.
I am working on my castor's pedigree. The program doesn't give any option for a harlequinized castor. Is there another option for the color?My guess is that she is a harlequinized castor.
I don't have a pedigree program, so I can't answer how to enter it. I would not be surprised that there is no option for 'harlequinized'. I would enter 'broken castor' and then manually add the Eej if that is an option.I am working on my castor's pedigree. The program doesn't give any option for a harlequinized castor. Is there another option for the color?
Do I just put it under castor and use the genetics of: Aa Bb C_ Dd Eej ?