Could this be a chocolate magpie? Thoughts on litter/Dam.

[LakesideLops]

Have paired these two 4 times now and never got a chocolate to my knowledge but now I'm wondering if I missed one or it just never occurred because the recessive factor.
Sire is Black & Orange Harlequin

Would love thoughts on the Dam as I was originally told Sable Point but now I've been told Seal maybe?? Tried to show belly she looks a tad odd because she pulled so much fur.

Could any of these kits be chocolate or lilac types?? TIA

 

[LakesideLops]

Have paired these two 4 times now and never got a chocolate to my knowledge but now I'm wondering if I missed one or it just never occurred because the recessive factor.
Sire is Black & Orange Harlequin

Would love thoughts on the Dam as I was originally told Sable Point but now I've been told Seal maybe?? Tried to show belly she looks a tad odd because she pulled so much fur.

Could any of these kits be chocolate or lilac types?? TIA

Here is more if Dam and past kits

 

[Alaska Satin]

Have paired these two 4 times now and never got a chocolate to my knowledge but now I'm wondering if I missed one or it just never occurred because the recessive factor.
Sire is Black & Orange Harlequin

Would love thoughts on the Dam as I was originally told Sable Point but now I've been told Seal maybe?? Tried to show belly she looks a tad odd because she pulled so much fur.

Could any of these kits be chocolate or lilac types?? TIA

You certainly have sable in the mix, which can cause colors to be pretty confusing since it not only eliminates yellow pigment, but also dampens black to some variation of sepia (which can sometimes look just faintly chocolatey or orange-ish at certain points in the color development). See this link for photos of the chocolatey phase of sable development:
https://rabbittalk.com/threads/chinchilla-rex-at-last.36724/#post-355913

The dam does look like a sable point to me. In these photos her points don't look dark enough to be seal, but since the allele that produces sable and seal is temperature-sensitive, the darkness/intensity of both colors can vary quite a bit. I'd feel pretty sure she's a pointed something, though; there's a creaminess in pointed (non-extension) body color that is different from more brownish-sepia of a non-pointed (normal extension) sable. Sables and sable points often get very blotchy, especially when they molt or pull fur.

Neither sable nor seals (nor sable points) have white bellies - they're all self colors. What appear to be white patches on your doe's underside could easily be the lighter underfur showing through where she's pulled the out guard hairs; you can see a smilar effect on her right side, where it's obvious she pulled a lot of fur. (Good mama! ) The undercolor on non-extension colors like sable point is typically very light.

Here's my daughter's sable point Holland, Sleeping Beauty, as you can see quite dark but definitely a sable point:


I'm not seeing chocolate on those kits on my screen. The kit in the first two (three?) photos looks like a sable magpie. The blotchiness that comes along with sable coloration, and the weird effects of harlequin, could cause those color variations. The dark color on the first kit's nose does not look chocolate, and usually a rabbit can't be both black-and chocolate-based (not that it mightn't carry chocolate in the recessive place, but it would not show on the rabbit).

The kits in photos 4, 5 and 6 all seem to have the bluish tint of smoke pearl (dilute sable) or smoke pearl magpie (dilute sable harlequin). They seem to be at that "frosty" stage that sables go through, which is a pretty good indication that they're sable-based. The hint of tan-ish coloration could well be the sable/sepia; I'd watch it, since it will probably change as they develop their older junior and adult coats. (If they actually end up with any real orange colors, they're not sable!)

The kit in the 7th photo looks like a regular black and orange harlequin to me. He has "real" orange (so is not sable), and his dark fur is not chocolate (so I'd conclude that he's black-based rather than chocolate).

 

[MsTemeraire]

What is the eye colour like on the 'chocolate Magpie'?