Breeding options (coat colors)

[TerriG]

I am going to be breeding again around 12/27.

I am thinking about breeding Shadow (Black - aa B_ C_ D_ Ee) to Fern (Black Tort - aa B_ C_ D_ ee) this time.

I am also thinking about breeding Thumper (Palomino - Aa B_ Cc(chl) D_ ee to Cookie (Agouti - A_ B_ C_ D_ Ee)

What coat colors should I expect?

I have also been toying with the idea of growing out the Tort Otter/Blue Point and the Sable point since they are so pretty. What would they add to my breeding program?

 

[caroline]

well depends upon what breed you are raising and if you show your rabbits.

I know that in the standard Rex breed torts are not recognized, although in the minis they are.

if you breed your black to the tort, half the kits will be black and the other half tort.

Same with the palomino x agouti cross. half agouti and half palomino, unless the agouti carries self, then 1/4 will be tort and 1/4 agouti.
I don't think that torted otter is recognized in any breed. but I too find them interesting.

 

[Dood]

There are too many unknowns - you can get fawn, tort, agouti, chinchilla, black, chocolate, blue, and shaded varieties of these colours like frosty, seal, sable and pointed or tan marked kits like marten and otter.

Thumper (Palomino - Aa B_ Cc(chl) D_ ee to Cookie (Agouti - A_ B_ C_ D_ Ee)

= 100% A_ or 75% A_ and 25% aa or aat
= 100% B_ or 75% B_ and 25% bb
= 100% C_ or 75% C_ and 25% cch c or cch cch or cch ch
= 100% D_ or 75% D_ and 25% dd
= 50% Ee and 50% ee

Shadow (Black - aa B_ C_ D_ Ee) to Fern (Black Tort - aa B_ C_ D_ ee)

See above and only difference is 50% self "aa" (black/chocolate/blue/lilac) and 50% non-extension "ee"(fawn/tort)

 

[TerriG]

well depends upon what breed you are raising and if you show your rabbits.
I don't think that torted otter is recognized in any breed. but I too find them interesting.

I don't show. These are meat rabbits, but my kids want to use the pelts, so having good coats is a plus. I don't have to conform to breed standard. I can go with what we like

__________ Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:18 pm __________

So it sounds like those pairings might be good for what we want.

I messed up when I asked about growing out the kits. I meant tort otter and sable point/blue point. If they are does (still to young for *me* to tell for sure) we would use them to replace our agoutis. One agouti has kits that get enteritis and the other has kits that are messy. Their nest box is disgusting and we just cleaned it out. Her last litter pee'd and poo'd everywhere. We are talking 9" up the wall. Reminds me of my boys Anyway, they are making a lot more work for us in caring for sick kits and cleaning cages. If I could replace them with better stock, it would be great!

I plan on keeping the 2 bucks we currently have. What would they create if paired with those does?<br /><br />__________ Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:24 pm __________<br /><br />Assuming we keep those 2 kits and grow them out.

So if I am reading this right, if we bred the Tort Otter to the Black buck, there are recessives that are unknown, but the difference in their genetics is on the 'E' allele. Black is 'Ee' and Tort Otter is 'ee'.

For the Sable Point and Palomino, we could get 'Aa' or 'aa', B would depend since we don't know the recessives, the buck carries 'C cchl' and the Sable Point carries 'cchl_', they both carry 'D_', and both carry 'ee'. And that's without getting into the 'W'. I don't know how to convert that into coats though.

 

[Dood]

So if I am reading this right, if we bred the Tort Otter to the Black buck, there are recessives that are unknown, but the difference in their genetics is on the 'E' allele. Black is 'Ee' and Tort Otter is 'ee'

AND at the A locus - 'at a' or 'at at' is otter and 'a a' is black

we could get 'Aa' or 'aa', B would depend since we don't know the recessives, the buck carries 'C cchl' and the Sable Point carries 'cchl_', they both carry 'D_', and both carry 'ee'.

'Aa' and 'C _' and 'ee' give agouti, not shaded, non extension varieties of fawn
'aa' and C _' and 'ee' give self, not shaded, non extension varieties of tort

'Aa' and 'cch _' and 'ee' give agouti, shaded, non extension varieties like ermine, frost
'aa' and 'cch_' and 'ee' give self, shaded, non extension and give varieties of pointed

 

[TerriG]

I missed the difference on the 'A'. I had it on my spreadsheet as 'aa' like my Black Tort. I forgot with the Otter that would change.

I'm going to have to take another look. I have Thumper (Palomino) as 'Aa' and Fern (Black Tort) as 'aa'. They are the Sire and Dam to the kit that we are calling Tort Otter. An Otter isn't possible with those genes. I've got something wrong.

 

[MamaSheepdog]

If they are does (still to young for *me* to tell for sure) we would use them to replace our agoutis. One agouti has kits that get enteritis and the other has kits that are messy. Their nest box is disgusting and we just cleaned it out. Her last litter pee'd and poo'd everywhere. We are talking 9" up the wall.

I can't help at all with the color genetics, but I'd say replacing those does is a good plan. You can correct both problems if you do. Until I joined RT and heard about does peeing in nests, rabbits soiling their hay if fed on the cage floor, bucks peeing on everything, etc., I didn't know what a wonderfully clean and tidy herd I had. They are a pleasure to care for.

I now have a trio of Jersey Woolys who are currently housed in a large fish tank in the house, and one of them has started spraying the glass sides. I'm not sure who it is- the buck still hasn't dropped his testes, so I think it is a doe. A-a-and I just bought a Beveren buck who is quarantined outside our bedroom, and he is spraying on the window and french doors. :x

So I know from my Rex herd that you can select for "rabbits with clean habits", and that will make caring for your herd easier and more pleasurable.

 

[TerriG]

I just had to take the nest box out. It was too gross. There is no way the poops in there were from the kits. The stupid doe was peeing and pooping in it. I put a cardboard box in that is just big enough for the kits. They were just barely starting to wander out of the nest box, so hopefully they will be ok. I couldn't leave that nest box in there any longer. I don't want sick kits.