Howdy all!

Sagebrush said:

Welcome to the forums R Buns! There are a lot of knowledgeable people here who can help you to relearn what you might have forgotten. I know they are doing that with me (sorry, laughing at myself)

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RabbitsOfTheCreek said:

How old are they?

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R Buns said:

DOB:
Buck- 1/15/24
Doe #1- 1/16/24
Doe #2- 2/21/24

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RabbitsOfTheCreek said:

So just turned 6 months and almost 5 months
I'm assuming (and hoping-) this was their first time breeding, and since they're just reaching a good breeding age I doubt you'll get much for the time being
You can breed a five month old but they're still pretty young and the youngest I limit myself to is 5.5 months and that's only if it's 'urgent'

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R Buns said:

Thank you! I looked for New Zealands for quite a while with no luck. Most people I contacted no longer have rabbits. Others changed breeds or just had cute ones to sell as pets. Wanted just plain white meat rabbits. When these came up in an add I decided to try them because they are more heat tolerant and white in this case. Finish earlier for processing which is always a plus. After being bit tonight however I am more inclined to keep looking for New Zealands. I don't want pets but charging to bite is a bit of a no for me.

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Alaska Satin said:

Yes, charging and biting is a non-starter for us, too. However you may not have much better luck with NZs. Most meat rabbits are selected for meat production qualities, and it's often the case that not too much attention is paid to temperament. It took several generations for me to breed my Satins (which are a breed I've heard judges call "satans") into the sweethearts they are now.

You might try to get one round of litters out of your buck before putting him in the pot, then be choosy about which of his offspring you keep to replace him. Chances are that not all of his get will have the same problems.

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R Buns said:

Satans. Sounds like you had to do some culling to get good temperaments. I am a big stickler on temperaments in all our other livestock.
I have reached out to the breeder this evening after the bit incident and we will be talking the end of the week. I am hoping that a swap will take place. I have no interest in biting rabbits. Honestly he'd be processed now if not for waiting for the breeders options/opinions. The breeder is a larger breeder for meat so hopefully will take this seriously. Especially for breeding stock prices. Unfortunately I'll have to deal with this buck for now. Not sure how I am going to manage that with his food and water being inside his pen. Although he does have a water bottle that he may get stuck with instead of a bowl and bottle. The bottle is more of a backup water source since they do knock bowls around. They seem to drink more with dishes so that's why I have them offered. Plus the bottles stay warmer than the crocks.
I will keep in mind getting a litter first. Also keeping a buck from it. I don't have intentions of keeping any offspring for a while anyways but dealing with putting does in and out of his cage for breeding along with daily feeding/water could be an issue. Not something I expected to be dealing with.
Thank you very much for the advice!

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Alaska Satin said:

Yes, I had to cull pretty hard. In fact that's why I have selfs and otters, instead of coppers, chinchillas, and my very favorite, reds. All of the agouti Satins I had for several years were n-a-s-t-y.

Hopefully the breeder will have sympathy for your situation and give you a trade. I know some bigger breeders have biosecurity concerns, though, and don't necessarily like to risk bringing rabbits back once they've left the property.

I have no idea what your buck's particular problem is, of course, but for the time being, there are some things you might try to encourage him to calm down a little.

If you can isolate him from other rabbits, that might help. I don't mean take him to a different building (though that might actually help), just make sure there are solid dividers between him and all other rabbits. It doesn't sound like you have any other males, but I've had bucks that were driven to distraction by being able to see others.

If he's lunging/biting out of fear, maybe giving him a hide, like a three-sided box with no floor, would give him a place to go to get away from you. The problem with that, though, is that when you bring him a doe to breed, she'll probably use it to hide from him, so it would need to be removable or able to be blocked off.

Keeping him on a water bottle and getting a feeder you can fill from outside would make it possible, at least in the short run, to take care of him without having to do what he seems to think is invading his space. Yes, rabbits tend to drink more from crocks, but many of them do just fine with bottles.

Giving him treats (grass, dandelion leaves and flowers, chickweed, etc.) through the wire might eventually help him understand you're the source of good things rather than a threat. Start with just dropping the stems through the wire on top and sweet-talking him. Eventually he'll probably come up to take the stuff through the side wire. A little patience can go a long way; resist the urge to punish him, which just seems to escalate things.

Likewise, bringing him does to breed might also get you in his good graces after a while. I have had bucks that weren't especially friendly, then after I'd brought them a few "dates" they couldn't wait to see me. But if your buck had never been bred and you brought him his first does, he may be just over-the-top excited. If that's the case, he'll probably relax after a few more breeding attempts. Alternatively, if the super-assertive older doe really bothered him by mounting him, he may be responding aggressively for that reason. Either way, he may very well mellow out, at least a little; if you just recently got them all, he's probably still figuring out where he is and who and what is safe. I still wouldn't keep him, as I want my rabbits easy-going right out of the gate. But it might buy you some time while you find another option, and make his life, and yours, a little less stressful and more pleasant in the meantime.

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R Buns said:

Another question is if you had a trio and wanted to breed them would you recommend breeding the two does "together" or separated in time. Obviously the buck won't breed both the same day but a day or two apart as far as "together". I've tossed around both options. Seems together might be better? If there is a need to surrogate some kits that gives me the option. Also growing them out and processing at the same.
Thoughts?
Thanks again everyone! Your advice is greatly appreciated!

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R Buns said:

What is the ideal age of a Tamuk buck and Tamuk doe to start breeding? I've seen mixed ages. @RabbitsOfTheCreek stated above 5 1/2 was early but can be done. I am seeing a lot of different ages online and in books for different breeds. I want to get to breeding BUT don't want to push them. Would rather wait a bit longer and get the possibility of longevity and good litter sizes longer term. Although we are getting into the heat now so while I know they can be ok in the heat it's probably not a good idea to be having litters in August/September when it's constantly over 100*. Although the last few weeks have been abnormally hot for us. 90's-103*.
Another question is if you had a trio and wanted to breed them would you recommend breeding the two does "together" or separated in time. Obviously the buck won't breed both the same day but a day or two apart as far as "together". I've tossed around both options. Seems together might be better? If there is a need to surrogate some kits that gives me the option. Also growing them out and processing at the same.
Thoughts?
Thanks again everyone! Your advice is greatly appreciated!

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RabbitsOfTheCreek said:

I would breed the two Does around the same time. They have their Kits at almost the same time and if something goes wrong, they can be given to the other Doe

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Alaska Satin said:

I don't raise Tamuks, but all of the normally-sized meat breeds I've raised (Satin, Californian, New Zealand, Champagne D'Argent) do fine at roughly 6mos for does and 5-6 months for bucks. They don't need to be senior weight, but they should be nearing that weight; if does are noticeably small or are not in glowing health, I give them another month or so (if I breed them at all, since I want healthy, fast-growing rabbits).

My bucks breed two does in a day without any issues whatsoever (and they're happy to oblige! ), from my youngest bucks to my old guys (a 5-1/2-year-old white Satin named Girdwood, and a 9-year-old BEW Polish named Jazzy). In fact I try to breed all the does I'm breeding in any particular cycle on the same day, if possible. If I'm using the same buck, for instance when I'm breeding for matched meat pen bunnies, I take him one doe and get 2-4 fall-offs, give him 5-10 minutes to groom himself, then bring him the second doe. I wait an hour, then bring him the same does in the same order.

There was a tantalizing study - tantalizing because I can't find it - that indicated that a one-hour interval between breedings yielded the highest rates of conception and largest litter sizes. Since rabbits are induced ovulators, meaning they ovulate as a result of attention by a buck, that makes sense. And while I can tell you that in my barn a single fall-off will usually produce bunnies, I want to maximize production, so I use all the tricks I know.

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