visiting a rabbitry

I want to visit the rabbitries I buy my rabbits from.
I ran into a hoarder once and I know it can happen with rabbits.
At shows its great to see some good ones and meet with several breeders at once ,
but it would be nice to see other set ups and see how well their rabbits are treated.
At shows people don't always have the time to really chat with you, as they need
to focus on the show.
Would you welcome visitors to your place? Why or why not.

I welcome visitors to my "place" and I don't invite them into my barn.
I have a covered pen across the creek from my barn where I bring the rabbits for viewing.
This means that I am not exposing my herd to any unwanted attention
or anything that may be tracked in on shoes that have been who knows where.
ARA are alive and busy in my area. Others have had rabbits confiscated on a regular basis.
I'm not interested in the hassle.
I am happy to talk with anyone at length about my rabbits, my setup, genetics, health, etc.
And anyone who visits my place leaves their car outside my gate and visits in a fenced area away from my barn.

You have to remember that people have hundreds to thousands of dollars invested in their herd, not to mention the time and and dedication it takes to build a herd. You are stranger, some people aren't comfortable having strangers in their rabbitry (and home!), some are. It's a personal choice and doesn't mean someone is hiding something. Breeders have had rabbits stolen, caught diseases from visitors, "liberated" by animals rights activists and reported to animal control for refusing a sale. There are legitimate reasons for being cautious as a breeder.

Our neighbors and family know where our rabbitry is, and can come in if they like. Other than that, I don't even want people to know where I live, partly because of the whole ARA thing. I'll take my rabbits elsewhere and meet them, like at the livestock swap at TSC.

We also have locks on our rabbitry, chicken coop, shed, and well house, even though we're out in the country. We were glad we went to all this trouble when we learned that the man who raises meat rabbits down the road from us had a rabbit stolen. He now has locks.

By the way, when someone asks you how many rabbits you have, don't say, "I don't know." Give them a number, and act like you know, even if you don't. You can act like you're calculating while you figure out a number to give them. The neighbor who had the rabbit stolen realized that just a couple of days earlier, he had a visitor to his rabbitry. The guy asked him how many rabbits he had, and he told him he didn't know. He realized later that the guy must have figured that since he didn't know how many he had, he wouldn't miss one.

I don't let visitors to my meat rabbit barn for biosecurity measures but they can come into my house and see my 4 Mini Lops breeders in their set ups

I do ask that they not touch another rabbit 2 days before their visit and to remove their shoes in my garage before coming into the house which I mop with bleached water once they leave

If I kept my ML in a barn I likely would not allow visitors

I am curious how you knew the person was a "hoarder" ? Was the rabbits feet stained? Did it look malnourished or diseased? :shrug:

I have a boat load of animals that are well fed, kept reasonably clean and any sickly ones are promptly dispatched - many would call me a hoarder, others would call me a farmer

I usually let other breeders in, if asked, and it can be arranged at a time when my husband is going to be home. I generally enjoy showing my rabbits to other breeders.

I understand that is a weak point in biosecurity, and must accept that there will be occasional disease culls in my herd. As I intend to show eventually, I strive for high disease resistance instead of zero exposure.

If not specifically asked by a breeder... I've taken to meeting elsewhere, ESPECIALLY if it's going to be a pet buyer.

No buyers allowed no visitors allowed. All customers are met in town or the next town over. I no longer go to swap meets because of the disease/parasite risks plus my being nice and selling a 2 for pets/brood last year at one has left a lasting impression because of an old wound and pain in my side that re-surfaced. Life is too short, I have better things to do, and want to enjoy my rabbits over all. If some one would come, I have no idea what they are going to stick their fingers into, liability for injuries abound even on some one that knows the waiver laws here etc. I am not being responsible for some one's rowdy kid that gets bit or kicked picking on the animals. I have also had the awful experiences of different people trying to steal babies that weren't even weaned, just a few weeks old some without eyes open, because I wouldn't sell them to them. If you've never had some one track in parvo or parasites, count self lucky. It can and does happen by people that wouldn't do any such thing but just don't understand or know it is possible.

I am not going to chance my rabbit's safety, the other animals safety, my liability's sake, or health on some one's good whim thoughts. *Most* breeders, especially show breeders, keep their animals in good conditions. Otherwise, they'd not be able to show them OR get good litters from them even. Granted there are some that have bad molters or litter issues, right now my Mini Rex are trooper producers while my Hollands are on strike for no apparent reason for example. I know there are some ways of keeping rabbits that are pushed as bad, but there are different ways to keep rabbits and some fear that won't be kept in mind. The thought of must view or hoarder is an ARA tactic and not welcomed by the show community in general terms. Most will tell such a ploy they are free to go else where, as it has been used to gain entrance to places for not their said intended purpose. I know its been mentioned on the ARBA show Facebook page with those thoughts attached (ARA ploy, if can't do with my pictures/wins/etc go else where, I don't have to sell I can eat what if it doesn't, health isn't worth a sale, liability isn't worth a sale, etc).

Never even thought about someone stealing a rabbit, never crossed my mind to risk arrest for a rabbit.
The ara thing I will have to look inth animal right I get it, I Never thought about animal rights people either. ughhh
The old guy I had to feed rabbits fo,r had over three hundred cages. Many deformities, many many rats, piles of broken crockery and junk he woud not clean up. Trash barrels for the dead ones, which I found several of each and every time I fed. Would never consider getting rid of any, they died long before that would happen anyhow. I was only 14 and we had known his grown children for many years.I kept telling them how bad it was back there, but to my knowledge they never did anything about it. He was in his nintys and did nothing else. trust me, Hoarder was a mild term for what he was. He was nuts is what he was. No such thing as animal control back in those days. At least not to my knowledge. He fit the profie of a hoarder as well, lost two children, one at ten and one at 19. I am sure they were his escape from reality.

I welcome visitors into my Rabbitry,
if they are coming to make a purchase.
After all, my rabbitry is not a ZOO or Animal shelter!
It's a well kept housing of which I am very proud of,
I have nothing to hide! I am not afraid to allow others to see my Herd,
they are well protected! I believe that it is most imperative that you
occasionally allow others to see your wares. How else could you make a sale?
I am not afraid, if it should become necessary I have the proper utensils. :gun:
Never fear showing your rabbits to others that are or seem to be interested in them.
Ottersatin. ldtimer:

ottersatin":3ia07tqp said:

I am not afraid, if it should become necessary I have the proper utensils. :gun: :

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hahaha The proper utensils. That cracked me up! lol Very funny!

Interesting discussion.
For personal reasons I'd rather not have buyers at my house (we are remote, husband works away etc.).
After living a very public life in a small town, this is my retreat LOL
And I do worry about ARA types because one of them locally knows us well and I don't want her to see and judge through her particular crazy lens.

But then, I feel like buyers expect to see the rabbitry as part of buying, maybe more so with pets (and we plan to breed our hlops for pets)~ it is always encouraged with buying dogs.
Maybe biosecurity is the way to dissuade that without people thinking you are hiding something?
I suppose I could cite our location being off the beaten path as a reason to meet folks in town, too.

TF3":3eshzen6 said:

it is always encouraged with buying dogs.

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but most serious dog diseases are prevented with vaccines and puppies should have at least 1 set of shots before being sold and exposed to the public, the buyers are also usually told to not take their pup into public areas until after their booster shots.

People often have MANY rabbits - I have 12 meat rabbit does which is considered a "small" rabbitry :mrgreen: - and personally I wouldn't buy from someone who had that many breeding female dogs and would consider them a "puppy mill" (to my way of thinking anyone producing more than 3 litters a year from 3+ different females fits in this category)

I agree, Dood.
But I would guess that most pet buying public would only have experience with the dog 'guidelines' and could be suspicious~
So maybe the approach is simply to explain to people the differences?

Whenever asked how many rabbits I have, I answer "more than two". Dood's right. What would be normal for a rabbit breeder would get you branded a hoarder or puppy/kitten mill if it were other critters. I use that question as an opportunity to point out to folks that how many is not what's important - it's how well they're cared for that's important.

We keep our breeders in a separate area, closed off from what we call the "visitors barn". People can look through some windows to see into the breeder barn. The visitors barn contains all the rabbits that are for sale. When they ask if they can go into the breeder barn, I tell them no and explain about biosecurity and quarantine.

We didn't used to live in town. We do now - and we didn't have to move. Been on this property for over 50 years and have been swallowed by suburbia. What used to be a gravel road out in front of the place is now one of the major north/south routes in the county. Luckily, our buildings and animals are well shielded from folks driving by. (Plus they'd have to slow down to see anything!) ARA types have vandalized other folks like us in the area. Fences cut, animals released or stolen, bad things spray-painted on barns and sheds, stuff poured into fuel tanks on tractors, and tires slashed.

We've been lucky.

We still let people onto the property but they don't get an address until after I'm convinced that they're serious about buying. Probably scare off a bunch of sales but I'd rather be safe than sorry. Plus - if they get scared off that easily, they weren't that serious. Some days I worry. But then there are days like today when three generations of a family showed up to buy a trio. The two boys were in their early teens and eager to learn. Dad had brought them to get their new rabbits, and Grandpa was along to be sure they picked out good ones! As we were walking back to the gate, I stayed back with Grandpa (he was moving slower than the boys and dad) and he told me that we had some of the best rabbits he'd ever seen and thanked me for the time I'd spent talking to the boys about their care, etc.

I don't show rabbits, but I imagine that's what it feels like to win a blue ribbon.

Back on subject. I'd say that if you do decide to allow visitors to your rabbitry, you can't be too careful. Best of luck to you!

Again, we've been very lucky. Haven't had any problems from ATA types nor have we had any illness.

TF3":3fms5muy said:

I agree, Dood.
But I would guess that most pet buying public would only have experience with the dog 'guidelines' and could be suspicious~
So maybe the approach is simply to explain to people the differences?

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A lot of pet buyers simply wouldn't understand a statement like..
"We intend to eat most of em, so it's fine to have X many of breeders!!"

That might be worse than just letting them be suspicious.. :roll:

If someone says the word "pet", I usually agree to meet somewhere in between their place and mine. If needed, I find an excuse to be out that way, for example,
"Oh, I'll be shopping at this place near you on that day, maybe we can meet before we shop???"

Of course, we also drive a lot to meet other breeders, but that's just because we like to drive. :lol:

Recently my sister and I visited a rabbitry in search of some NZRs, and it was a closed rabbitry. My sister thought it was a little strange at first til the gal explained her reasons, and then my sister was ok with it. As my sister home breeds Arabians, she understood. I think if I hadn't known about the reasons for closed rabbitries, I would have been like, "What are you hiding?"

(There were no NZRs available, but my sister did get a 9lb Cali buck for her rabbitry!!)

I raised Arabs for twenty years, and I never refused a visit to my barn, so I don't get the reference.
What diseases are you afraid someone would transmit to your rabbits? Since I doubt if I would be handling them,
are you worried about some viral contagion that is airborne?. I hate to sound so dumb but I still don't understand.
As I have no rabbits yet, I can't see that i would give a rabbit some disease.

BlueHaven, one of the main ways rabbits are different from most domestic animals is that they are generally unable to take broad spectrum antibiotics. Anything that kills off their digestive bacteria can kill them outright.


There are some highly communicable bacterial diseases, like pasteurellosis, that are not curable in rabbits, partially due to their unique physiology. (Blood flow in their nasal structures is too weak to carry an antibiotic to all areas where the bacteria may inhabit.)
There is a vaccine, but it neither cures the disease nor renders it non-contagious. It's merely advertised to lower mortality rates against selective strains of bovine pasteurella.

It's not uncommon to hear of a breeder having to terminally cull their entire herd due to a nasty outbreak.

And, in my neck of the woods...Most people who buy rabbits are also breeders who have rabbits. The bacteria(there are many strains) that cause Pasteurellosis are said to survive about three days outside of a body, and it can become airborne.

We could grill everyone who visits to see if they have contacted a rabbit in the past few days, but many find that just keeping a closed barn is easier and more practical, especially with the other reasons people have listed.

I'm not saying that you will not find breeders who allow people in. I choose to take the risk myself.
But I also totally understand why some breeders keep their doors closed to visitors.

You will also find most serious breeders have a quarantine area where new stock is housed for 30 days separately from their established herds.

I was lax about that when I first got into rabbits. Until a respiratory disease outbreak forced me to terminally cull my entire herd...

So would showing them be even riskier? Would it be a good idea to keep the ones I show, saparated from the rest, for some time after a show?
How long would it be a good idea to do that? Sounds like its thirty days. That creates a whole new set of things for me to consider. Perhaps a bank of cages separate from the others. I am limited on space, so I will have to think it through. THanks for the info.

BlueHaven":3deiq23u said:

So would showing them be even riskier? Would it be a good idea to keep the ones I show, saparated from the rest, for some time after a show?
How long would it be a good idea to do that? Sounds like its thirty days. That creates a whole new set of things for me to consider. Perhaps a bank of cages separate from the others. I am limited on space, so I will have to think it through. THanks for the info.

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Yes, showing is all kinds of risky.

Many breeders who show do have a quarantine area just for their returning show stock. :yes: